Oh, I know it's from 2011. I didn't know if it was like the 1997 one in how they threw more modern tracks in with the older ones. The riffing sounded like the post 00s material, but the guitar tone seemed more in line with the 90s stuff. Maybe it's just me.

It may not be QUITE so black/white as Pursino = good riffs...but then again I'm not so sure. Every song from Marriage II and Invictus that have interesting and dynamic riffs have a writing credit from him. It's a very discernible stylistic difference as well. The riffs aren't just "better" in some vague way, they're more jaunty, they usually have some kind of melodic hook worked in or an incredible pause that gives some "oomph".

Edit: Wait what? Pursino is all over the individual song credits in my version of Invictus, especially in the second half.

Plus it's undeniable that as soon as Pursino left, the riff quality dropped precipitously. It might not be that Pursino has to personally write ALL the riffs; it's possible that Defeis can write more complicated and interesting riffs when he tries, but can't actually play them himself.

Someone's been reading their detective books! That's a very plausible angle that never would have occurred to me.

...And now I want to write metal songs through a proxy.

Barely around thesedays, have I missed anything insane?

Mostly a lot of VS discussion, nothing much. No new awesome bands that I can think of. How've you been man?

Honestly, I don't have a copy of Invictus on me, so I was just going by the Wikipedia credits. If that's the case, you can just ignore everything I said.

I've been listening to Lost Horizon a LOT lately. Fucking amazing band, those 2 albums are the best Euro Power metal albums of all time, Daniel is/was an incredible singer.

I looked up what Daniel was doing now and it's atrocious. Sounds like a shitty Linkin Park clone.

Yes, Heiman's recent endeavors are nothing short of horrendous. I liked that Heed project of his though. It was modern and chuggy, but in a good way.

I think I listen to Heed more than LH actually. LH is definitely really good, but I have to be in a certain mood.

I got my Cloven Hoof s/t tape yesterday. There are no words. I'm so glad I didn't download it ahead of time. "Cloven Hoof" the song is up there with the all-time great entreaties to the horned one. We're talking Come to the Sabbath and Offrande Charnelle levels of Satanic majesty. I know this is old hat to everyone else but whatever I'm so thrilled.

THE HOOOOUUSE OF GOD

HAS BEEN

VIOOOLAAATED

Yesssss! It's so unsubtle and atmospheric at the same time. The middle part with the spoken incantation and the eko ekos is too perfect.

I love A Sultan's Ransom and Dominator but it would have been neat to see them go just full-on satanic for one album. Wouldn't have worked so well without that first vocalist I guess.

I dunno man, the debut isn't 100% Satanic but it's got three songs out of six (not counting the instrumental) that are, and they're by far the longest on the album. I agree though, both the David Potter material and the Russ North material are so good in such different ways that I'd really just like more of both.

I was actually talking to Jeremy yesterday about the more rocking numbers. I don't want them gone by a long shot. It's just a fantasy I can't help, that their next album could have been their "Don't Break the Oath" where things get a little more serious.

I like how Crack the Whip is all set to be a big radio hit and then at the very end they were like "Fuck it, who are we kidding!" And tossed in a little change up and a more driving riff with the gang chanted part.

Yeah I agree, I like all the rocking numbers. "Laying Down the Law" is awesome, and even "Crack the Whip" is fun. They remind me of the rocking songs from Manowar's debut; just tons of fun. Also I like Melissa better than DBtO so there!

Cloven Hoof is great, my favorite is Mistress of The Forest, great song with great lyrics.

Laying Down the Law is so cool, I'm glad they still wanted to sound like Priest by '84.

I argued that Melissa was better for like 3 years...and then one day DBtO just hit me like an epiphany. I love them both but I think I favor the Yellow guy these days. Truth be told I'm currently super obsessed with Nuns because I just got "The Beginning" a few months ago. Best EP ever.

I also just recently sat down and read along with the lyrics to Black Masses for the first time. How good is that shit? Just a whole rapturous song about baby blood. The really tacky way he screams "WE'RE KILLIN' BABIES!" at the end is one of my favorite heavy metal moments.

Oh my God, there is a group called Max Pie. Who the fuck names their band Max Pie?! The band itself is merely alright, nothing to write home about, but they're fucking Max Pie.

Looking for bands similar to Angel Dust that use keyboards, but are still heavy?

Kamelot's sort of similar I guess (haven't heard much newer Angel Dust), Virgin Steele's very heavy and uses keyboards a lot. Those are just off the top of my head, I might come up with more later.

How come we don't talk about Pokolgep all the time in here? We should. If you're not listening to Pokolgep, well, you should be.

I don't really like Pokolgep. Nothing I've heard by them has sounded more than just average.

POKOLGEP GEP POKOLGEP GEP

The first 3 Tad Morose albums, + the Paradigma EP
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tj8nHJO2f_c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EdFGpPyhy4

The real question about Hoof is...why is Dominator so shitty sounding? I remember buying that 'remaster' a few years ago and it sounding like a vinyl rip. Apparently the vinyl itself doesn't sound that much better.

Also, why does Russ North have to be such a wino? He sounded pretty decent on that re-recording compilation in 2010. Instead, we get this. I don't watch much TV, but apparently the lead singer was on X Factor at one point? Might explain the Bon Jovi cover.

How do people feel about the live album that featured nothing, but new songs? Never listened to it and decided to do so as I type this. Vocalist doesn't measure up to North, but he's still pretty decent. Sounds very AOR-ish.

I don't know the story of the remaster, whether they couldn't get a hold of the master tapes and ripped it from vinyl and then messed with the EQ or if the master tapes themselves are just really poor quality. All I know is, the shitty CD remaster is by far the best version of Dominator I've heard. You can actually tell what the rhythm guitars are doing, and there's some real low end. Unfortunately, boosting the rhythm guitars and the bass seems to have introduced some sort of background hiss so it's not ideal. Still, the music itself is fantastic.

As to why the original sounded shitty to begin with...I think it was mostly because nobody gave a shit about that style of music in the UK at the time. They probably had zero budget and couldn't get any real studio time with a decent engineer.

My copy of Dominator (cd) is a bootleg I think, but I've really become accustomed to and almost grown to enjoy that fucked up sound. I swear it gets MUCH better after the first two songs though, just sonically speaking. The bass also sounds CRANKED on mine which I adore.

Reach for the Sky is a perfect uspm song. That pre-chorus!

Yeah it's pretty hard to nail down just exactly what the fuck genre Cloven Hoof were playing on that one. It's like USPM in terms of song structure and arrangements, but the riffs and melodies don't sound like USPM riffs and melodies, and neither do they sound like Euro power riffs/melodies. It's also clearly more than just plain ol' heavy metal. There are a lot of post-NWOBHM bands like that, which just sort of ended up drifting off into weird places, like a solar system whose sun just vanished, leaving the planets to just hurtle off into space in random directions.

I mean aside from Cloven Hoof there's Holocaust, who went from fairly straightforward NWOBHM to fucking weird, Voivod-influenced progressive metal. Algy Ward left Tank in the late 80s for Atom God, an even fucking weirder progressive/thrash/whateverthefuck band even less definable than Holocaust. Blood Money were of course formed out of the ashes of Wolfbane, and played basically a pretty sweet fusion of NWOBHM with melodic thrash. Deep Switch of course are well-known around here.. Basically every NWOBHM band that survived into the late 80s started trying really weird stuff.

It's a really beautiful thing. I never knew about the Wolfbane/Blood Money connection, that's pretty interesting.

I really wish later Holocaust stuff was easier/cheaper to come by. I used to have a d/l of Covenant at my old job and it was a really intriguing album. I should probably listen to disc 2 of Smokin' Valves more but I hate hearing songs that were meant to be part of a whole in that broken format. Holocaust has to be one of the most unexpected style changes ever. You would never listen to Lovin Feelin Danger and expect them to be a progressive basically one-man metal outfit 15 to 20 years down the road. Mortimer might be special.

Speaking of weird NWOBHM goings-on, have any of you been following the fairly recent Tank-related drama? Due to health issues, Algy Ward is unable to play live anymore, so the other guys reformed the band without him, saying he had retired. Later, he formed his own version of the band, as a studio-only solo project, and claimed that he had never retired or given his former bandmates permission to use the Tank name/logo. There doesn't currently seem to be an ongoing legal feud like with Queensryche, just a few negative comments in interviews here and there, and a "diss song" Algy Ward wrote on his album.

The best part? They're both pretty good.

Tucker/Evans Tank play a slick sort of heavy metal with heavy hard rock influence in the song structure and riffing, pretty comparable to modern Saxon. The singer even sounds like Biff Byford. Nothing amazing, but quality stuff, with some real inventive riffs here and there.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8GtIb8ukI0

Algy Ward's Tank play a style that's a lot dirtier, sloppier, and probably closer to early Tank than the above. It's less standard but also less consistent; some of the songs on the album just don't work. At times though, it's quite entertaining:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0sl_Kjl0vg

Just another interesting entry in the annals of metal history.

Mindhalálig Rock & Roll! Pokolgep's second album is fucking perfect; energy, passion, fantastic vocals... it's got it going on, man. You have non-functional ears not heavy metal ears!

I definitely consider Russ North era 'oof to be power metal. One of the rare examples of English power metal. I don't even think Dominator sounds that bad, it's demo-y but it works for me.

So the guy has a project with the singer/drummer from Warfare, but he uses what sounds like a drum machine?

Also a slightly amusing note about the 'new' Tank is that ZP Theart of former Dragonforce fame did/is doing live vocals for them. Just seems wrong.

Of course it's power metal, you ass. We were just talking about how it doesn't really sound like other power metal.

Yeah Pokolgep really is a great band. You never really hear enough about them. I even forget about em sometimes. They have a pretty bitchin' catalogue. Pretty dece right through, from what I've heard, innit.

The only real power metal bands that I like are Nevermore and Helloween. Not too many others. I'm more into melodic death/progressive metal as well as death and black metal. I like pretty much all genres, but those are my personal preferences.

Those are two pretty different bands and there are lots of other bands that share similarities with them...you sure you've looked that far into the genre?

Is Nevermore even power metal? I know they're tagged as power/thrash for their earlier material, but it's a bit of a misnomer.

@ Orbitball, do you want us to recommended bands similar to Nevermore and Helloween? If so can you be more specific about what you like about those bands.

Yeah. I mean, I like Nevermore and stuff, but I never understood where the power metal label they usually get slapped with comes from.