The Thorns songs were immensely influential, but way earlier than the album release, in the early nineties. Much of the 2nd wave guitarwork, atmospherics and production values/ideas came from Snorre's demos/rehearsals.

Yeah, I know and agree with that. But the Thorns demos aren't the self-titled full-length.

That's right, my point is the album showcased to the world his characteristic sound in a way the demos never could, and thus is a monument to his craft and probably a big influence to the dissonant and twisted BM sound that arose a couple of years later.

Since there's a higher volume of bands, it's less likely any will ever be as important as the older black metal. That being said, Windir's 1184, Taake's Hordalands Doedskvad or even Noregs vaapen, and Gorgoroth's Twilight of the Idols all come to mind as they did a great job sustaining Norwegian black metal after the 90's. Drukh's Blood in Our Wells (or Autumn Aurora) also seemed to make a huge impression on black metal fans, and as mentioned, Deathspell Omega's Si Monumentum... and Fas..
I can see how Behemoth's The Satanist could also be considered "important", but I generally think this album is better judged outside the context of black metal and more in the context of Behemoth's overall discography (which ranges in genre). The album isn't a single-focused black metal album, so to call it one of the most important black metal albums of the 21st century seems a bit unfair...



Never thought about it that way, but I think this is very accurate.

The only massively impactful thing to come out of black metal, genre-changing, is Deathspell Omega. I can't think of anything that had the impact they did. I'm not that familiar with their albums so I can't say which one created the huge wave but the band is massively important for the evolution of black metal in the 21st century so far.

Alcest - Souvenirs d'un autre monde. Perhaps the most important album that helped create blackgaze as we know it. It was there to help spawn a new genre that has reached great popularity as a black metal subgenre. This band is hugely influential and I believe this is the most important record (even though I'm more familiar with the follow-ups).

Some comments on other suggestions already made:

Watain - Lawless Darkness. Never my cup of tea but surely regarded as a classic by many. However this wasn't very influential since it isn't original in any way. There is nothing that is new about Watain so they are riding the wave of an already existing sound, it's just that some think they released a great album.

Drudkh - Autumn Aurora or Blood in our Wells. Great albums, great band, but I don't know how influential their sound was. Did it really spawn waves where bands started to create music in relation to the Drudkh sound? Perhaps but I'm not that familiar with it.

Wolves in the Throne Room (whichever album was the most influential). Perhaps not that original but they were (are) at the forefront of the whole new scene called Cascadian Black Metal that in some ways have been defining its own type of sound. While not as clear cut choices as Deathspell Omega or Alcest they might be considered runner-ups.



I am not familiar with Xasthur but if they were instrumental in popularizing the one man depressive suicidal black metal bands they are deserved of a mention here. There was a huge wave of this type of music that I think helped shape and re-create the black metal genre (for better or for worse).

i've always heard more abyssic hate than xasthur in the shitty fuzzed-out dsbm style

It seems to have been more of a group mentality than a single influence. Look to The Pagan Front and the bands involved in The Night and the Fog compilations, particularly the second one - that was a turning point, or the birth of "NSBM" as "a thing." Up until then, the bands involved were largely influenced by black metal as a whole, though the Absurd, Burzum, and Graveland influences did stand out in some bands.

That being said, Absurd's works from the 90s absolutely shaped the genre, while the 21st century touchstone for NSBM is Der Sturmer's The Blood Calls for W.A.R. The majority of NSBM seems to be either the RAC/BM hybrid of Der Sturmer channeling Absurd, or the raw and somber Burzum influence channeled through Bilskirnir. Graveland and bouncy Eastern European pagan/black metal seem to be another branch of it, which is also heavily influenced by Wolf's Absurd.

So, I guess what I'm saying is blame Der Sturmer for every shitty NSBM band. TBCFW laid the template for it and stripped it of the weird raw emotion that early Absurd had.



I'm surprised Lawless Darkness is the Watain album mentioned. Casus Luciferi seemed to set the tone for the whole Orthodox Satanism/black metal thing before SMRC came out, and Sworn to the Dark brought it more mainstream by being released on a bigger label. I think much of what Watain influenced had already been done, or at least the seeds sown, by the time Lawless Darkness came out. Their main influence seemed to be steering that style of black metal away from the Norsecore caricature, a divide which definitely began in the mid-00s, not the 10s.

A lot of the pagany, foresty type black metal, especially if they're from Eastern Europe, tends to have a lot of Drudkh or Hate Forest influence. Graveforests and their Shadows by Walknut is 100% Hate Forest worship. Drudkh obviously tends to be more solemn at times compared to Hate Forest, but Forgotten Legends also has a very epic quality to it which is what I hear a lot of when I listen to Winterfylleth.

I agree, soundwise Lawless Darkness didn't bring many new things to the Watain table, but that's the album that vaulted them into the upper echelon of extreme metal in terms of recognition and wide-spread fame. Sworn to the Dark was starting to get there, but LD blew it out of the ballpark, thus being my pick for most important of their albums in everything but the sound.

We could also mention Malign's Fireborn, Ofermod's Mystérion tés anomias as well as Funeral Mist's Devilry if we're talking about the orthodox/Satanic wave, as all of those were released in 1998 and far precede any of Watain's releases.

Though I certainly find that question to be a very tough one, both objectively and subjectively, I actually could agree with you about Deathspell Omega to many degrees. Though very few albums of theirshave truthfully ever hit me as far as inspiration goes, the sheer magnitude of their composition skills masked with their innate ability to interweave ohscure black metal Chaos with aspects of Classical music and chamber music is insanely impressive. Not to mention the fact that I feel like anyone who can't cite them as one of the reigning black metal bands of our time, doesn't have too much of a clue about modern black metal. Of course there is thousands of bands (or atleast hundreds) that I think can maintain that eligibility within the context of specifically the 21st Century. Influence, composition; darkness, and knowledge of esoteric/occult concepts should be some of the biggest refining elements to be put into perspective of how to judge a bands status of influence among modern black metal music. Bands that I could also put into these categories as far as extreme influence and sheer groundbreaking abilities or even justness the ability to write extremely catchy tight-knit songs within Black Metal would also be these bands (that come to mind): Abigor, Inquisition, Darkthrone, Watain, Dissection, Wolves in the Throne Room, Gorgoroth (sadly, I might have to decry that now) , Mayhem, Emperor, Belphegor, Behemoth, MGLA, Nightbringer, Dark Funeral... the list goes on and on, but these bands specifically have incredible momentum and are on the forefront of obvious huge recognition. So I have to look at the refined status of objectification and subjective taste. My subjective taste would include hundreds of bands that I can see making this bridge, but societal recognition and status within Black Metal... I'd have to go with the above mentioned. Note: That also is to say that a couple bands within the context of this list have Death Metal elements, so that of course can be debated.

Funeral Mist - Salvation

Everyone wants to be like Funeral Mist in the 21th Century. But nobody reaches it. That Album is the pure essence of what Black Metal has become in the 21 Century. A hunt for the most extreme, most furious, most religious satanic work.

DSO's Album was very popular and hyped back in the day but i don't see them much influence people. They influenced the french scene, yes. But overall i think they are not important at all.

I think one needs to ponder the subgenre or style before the artist, and the artist before the album for this question. The Cascadian black metal scene, although exploding in popularity at first, is most certainly waning if not entirely dead at this point, so Wolves in the Throne Room et al don't really fit the bill in my opinion. Neither do bands like Watain really have much in the way of originality and influence. I think it's safe to say that dissonant black metal has led to the biggest shifts in sound, has enjoyed the longest stay in popularity and continues to make the biggest waves in black metal.

With that in mind I can totally see why so many are flocking to Deathspell Omega and to their trilogy for this pick. However, I am fully backing Thorns on this one. The only category in which Deathspell Omega surpass them is in acclaim and even there they are heavily divisive.

probably either DSO/Moonblood or DSO- Inquisitors of Satan. both ignited massively the DSO career trajectory which (sadly) shifted musical styles , aped Averse Sefira, and influenced countless imitators; while simultaneously ignited the demand for UG labels limited vinyl LPs and the shift towards online sales and distribution for said labels. Of course, Sombre never got there with the death of Marcel S, but EAL (via Noevdia) and NH are still what they are today. Of course, what NoevDia is today, sadly, co-opted the term "Orthodox Black Metal", but what can you do. Most listeners/consumers are young uninformed kids who don't know better nor will they do their homework.

lmao I think Zodi's weirdly butthurt DSBM post has to be the hottest take in this thread

Most important BM album of the 21st century is quite the large topic which could go on forever.

I'd suggest three albums which could all be considered the most important.

Nokturnal Mortum - The Voice of Steel. This was a huge deal back when it was released with a lot of bands realizing that you could fully integrate folk music into black metal without it sounding forced or cheesy. Sure, the folk black metal sound had been done before (even NM did it) but the scope on this record was much different. This is where folk black became a fully realized sound.

Funeral Mist - Salvation. There had been other bands doing the orthodox satanic black metal thing before, but listen to them and then listen to this. No comparison. It got very real on this album and showed that the music could be just as important as the message, not to mention the overall picture being painted here. I still hold this album as the best orthodox BM album of all time. A lot of people give Watain (whom I love as well) all the credit for the orthodox movement, but that's not correct at all. All they did was get more exposure and ape Bathory, Dissection, and Mayhem.

Dissection - Reinkaos. I'm sure a lot of people will disagree with me on this one and that's fine. Quite frankly this album is a masterpiece from front to back and was the fully realized vision that Jon had always wanted. I like Storm better overall, but you can clearly see Jon's vision being unfolded piece by piece. While this album isn't the same type of black metal as the first two albums, it's quite a bit more BM than most people give it credit for. What Funeral Mist started is what Dissection completed. It doesn't get more genuine than this.

How is a melodeath album the most important black metal album of the 21st century?

As I said, it's not the typical BM album that people would imagine.

Black metal or not, Reinkaos is definitely not an album I'd describe as important, influential, or essential.

or even good, to be honest. an album so bad it drove a man to suicide

+1.

Vocalwise, I would say Niklas Kvarforth (Shining) and Famine (Peste Noire) are GREAT. I LOVE their work.

i wanna say Inquisition is important, but i know it's not true. most of today's black metal bands just aren't as concerned with writing proper guitar riffs as they used to be, and instead are content to just strum away randomly in a lazy attempt to use atmosphere as a songwriting crutch because they heard WITTR do it. i guess riffs are like, too hard, n stuff.

even though I don't like it at all, and would love to throw in something else, I'll go and say DSO - SMRC. it was definitely a game-changer upon release, fas or whatever other DSO release doesn't even come close.

Are you implying inquisition shamelessly copied Wolves in the Throne Room or am I reading that wrong? By the time WITTR released Diadem of 12 stars Inquisition had three albums already and their sound and style were pretty well known and established, if anything I'd say WITTR owes more to inquisition than the other way around.
About the topic: WITTR is one of those bands I consider important for the development of new styles within the genre, but that wouldn't have been possible if their first album wasn't more or less an attempt to emulate The Weakling's Dead as Dreams, so, if there's an album I would call "important" in the sense of being a cornerstone in shaping new sounds and styles, despite not being popular, its that one.

Edit: typo

I don't know if I entirely agree with the post but it was an absolutely interesting take. I tend to forget how 'big' Xasthur was during that time, though I have no problem confessing that I do love me some Xasthur (especially those early albums). Zodi, if you fleshed it out a bit I think you'd have a compelling little essay. I do agree with theposega however. I think there's way more Abyssic Hate, Silencer etc in the peak of bad bedroom DSBM. That stuff was always more riff-oriented than Xasthur's buzzsaw wall of sound. Therefore I'm not inclined to call Subliminal Genocide an influential album. As Zodi alluded to, it's standing was more important for the exposure and opportunities opened up for other projects.


Agree on Leviathan being the best of USBM. There's a bit of a synergy game at play with Wrest's discography. The whole is greater than the sum of its parts, so not one album in particular could appropriately be described as 'widely influential.' Though in some time I do think Scar Sighted will have left the largest fingerprint.

In regards to Drudkh, that's totally a strong candidate. Not only for the eastern European foresty type stuff (which is a massive contingent in modern black metal) but also for "cascadian metal." When you're looking at the genesis of that style you're more or less looking at Weakling getting fucked by Drudkh. The question is which of their albums gets the nod? I'm inclined to say Forgotten Legends.

That's completely ridiculous. Well, I mean, I know you were trying to joke there, but I mean, I think you guys are being way to harsh, that album is somewhat underrated. Definitely not in the same class as what they were doing before, but there are some really well composed songs on there. "Black Dragon" especially. (Not in the running for this thread topic really though, don't get me wrong, just going on a tangent)

that's not what i meant at all.

As much as I love Inquisition they're just a very good Immortal worship band. As for your statement about "most" black metal bands trying to sound like WITTR, I think you might just be listening to the wrong stuff, or scraping off the surface of what the genre has to offer. 2017 alone saw Enslaved, Blut Aus Nord, The Great Old Ones, Helheim, Nidingr and Lorn offer albums that had much more than just atmosphere going for them.

what? no! that's not true at all. Even if the vocals sound similar (which is the only thing remotely similar between both bands) they are delivered in completely different ways.

The Immortal-Inquisition Similar Artists score (245) might be the highest on the entire site. Trying to deny they are similar is beyond silly. Riff-heavy, mid-paced second wave with frog vocals. I actually can't think of any two bands in all of metal that are more similar than these two.

early inquisition is undoubtedly indebted to immortal. vocally and riff-wise. it diminished with each album, however, and from ominous doctrines on i can't really hear it outside of the vocals (and even those have started to drift from Abbath territory).

and i just wanna say xasthur sounds like mutiilation taken a step further imo. listen to the cover of "black imperial blood" off the debut. it fits right in perfectly.

DsO trilogy.

They are indeed similar in many aspects, the both play the same genre to begin with, but saying Inquisition is just an Immortal worship is more than silly, is just plain wrong.



Then you need to pay a little more attention to the music, black metal is more than just blast beats, tremolo riffing, corpse paint, and dark-themed lyrics.

It's been a while since I listened to much Immortal, but I have a hard time believing the most recent Inquisition records, with the depth of songwriting and creative ideas, can be JUST clones of that band... no doubt there's influence, but mere clones and nothing more, really?

I wasn't agreeing with the clone claim. I was responding to blackmantram's statement that the vocals are "the only thing remotely similar between both bands" because that's clearly not true, as his contradictory follow-up already admitted.

Immortal and I.C.E.

Has Leviathan ever written a song that actually works all the way through? Everything I've heard by him is so slapdash and incoherent. Really cool riffs mingle with really boring riffs and they all sound thrown together.

I didn't use the word clone, I said "worship". Might still not be the right word for it. I'm not denying that they haven't kind of found their own sound, but even their latest material I think is still heavily reminiscent of Immortal.

Regardless, I love them but they didn't release the most important black metal album of the 21st century.

Personally, I love most of Leviathan's output but have you heard Wrest's material as Lurker of Chalice? Personally I think the Lurker of Chalice album is one of the greatest to come out of metal. One reason I loved Scar Sighted so much was that it had threads of LoC in it.