I couldn't find a topic for this, so here go.





Track Listing:

01. Olympus Rising
02. Thunderbolt
03. The Secret of Flight
04. Nosferatu (The Vampires Waltz)
05. They Played Rock and Roll
06. Predator
07. Sons of Odin
08. Sniper
09. A Wizard's Tale
10. Speed Merchants
11. Roadie's Song

Ok 'zick. I like how when the camera shows the crowd, it's all guys as old as the band. Nice to see how many metalheads have remained true over the decades.

That was pretty cool. Saxon is one of the better old-guard bands still going - they write simple stuff but they just know what they're doing and have a formula down pat that works, and remains exciting. I missed their last one, but Sacrifice was a monster of an album - hope this one is as good.

Man, I fuck with that album cover heavy.

Edit: The song is pretty boring though, with that same old production all the old fellas use. God damn.

The single isn't quite as heavy and in-your-face as "Sacrifice" or "Battering Ram", but it's still pretty good. Feels more in the vein of their older stuff, or say, Unleash the Beast as opposed to the past two which felt more in the vein of Metalhead.

I, for one, dig the production. Sneap has got them sounding the best they've ever sounded. It sounds on first listen like he more-or-less copy-pasted the mix from Battering Ram to this one, but I'm OK with it because Battering Ram's production was tits.

Is it possible to describe in words what you think is ideal about it? I'm not challenging your opinion, and if you don't feel like explaining further, that's cool. But Sneapsound seems to have become the industry standard for big name bands and it just sounds so lifeless to me. You think the guitars on this song, or Battering Ram, sounds more powerful than Wheels of Steel or MY GOD Strong Arm of the Law?

The pure rock and roll fury of "To Hell and Back Again" is magical to me, and a portion of that is derived from that beautiful guitar tone they got. It sounds on FIRE to me! It buuurrrnnnns with heaviness. The Sneapsound guitars just sound Loud™ to me. They sound loud and empty. Like the surface is made of heavy metal but everything inside is just air.

Yeah I mean in an ideal world all these old bands would continue using the retro production techniques and making things sound personal and unique as they did back then. I can agree that the "Sneapsound" thing is overdone and makes bands sound identical to one another sometimes. But it just doesn't bother me much and if the music is really good, as on Sacrifice, I'm not letting the production prevent me from enjoying it.

Listening now. Love the album art. New Saxon is always reliable. I Paul Quinn and Biff Byford are both massive inspirations to me--able to perform at such a high standard for their age and actually getting better in the 2000's than they were before. Probably my favourite "old guard" band.

"It just doesn't bother me much" is a far cry from "the best they've ever sounded". I get what you're saying and that a lot of people probably feel that way. But a lot of people seem to genuinely LOVE this sound that Saxon and Accept have both been rocking for a few years now. I can't wrap my head around it and I was hoping maybe he could explain a little bit.

Yeah, actually I do think it sounds better than those albums. In fact, I've never been particularly enamored with any of Saxon's productions in the 80s. I've just always preferred really well-produced albums, and Sneap's style seems to do it the best for me. I think he always gets really good guitar tones that always are clear, crunchy, and satisfying to the ear. I also prefer that style of drums, I've always found them more effective. I will agree that sometimes those very clear and well-produced drums can take away from the heaviness (Angel of Retribution is the first to come to mind for me), but the majority of the time I think the way the transient and snap is focused on makes the drums hit harder, and have more impact.

It's hard to really quantify, because it really comes down to opinion and base preference. I can't really tell you why I prefer, say, the guitar tone on "Battering Ram" versus "Denim and Leather". I simply prefer, and have always preferred, the more modern style of metal production, primarily the way Sneap specifically does it. The albums always have more punch and deliver the intended reaction better for me. Now, I will grant that the style lends itself to sapping out individuality, but I don't think that's something that Sneap does, but many people who attempt to sound like him. Yeah, Sneap's style is pretty distinct, but so was Randy Burns' style and his wasn't clean or pretty. Even then, there are clear differences in production between say, "Blood In, Blood Out", "Blood of the Nations", and "Sacrifice".

Keep in mind, I also do engineering work primarily in heavy metal, so I'm somewhat biased towards making everything sound nice. But at the same time, I moved into that mindset because I liked productions by guys like Sneap and Jens Bogren so much.

On a side note, I'd like to bring up a point in response to this:



The thing is that back then, bands got what production they could get. It wasn't a matter of, "we want it to sound like this" the grand majority of the time, but what budgets and engineer talent would allow. As better productions became cheaper and more accessible, bands started doing it. They won't go back to those sounds because they always wanted the best production possible, and they got what they could get in the 80s and they get what they can get now. For example, Gary Holt said Exodus did "Let There Be Blood" because he always wanted "Bonded by Blood" to sound like that. I'm not sure what my point is, beyond maybe that I'd be willing to bet if Saxon could choose, they would have made "Strong Arm of the Law" sound like "Thunderbolt" if they had the option.

^ That definitely is true, yeah. Good post all around.

I'd definitely say Saxon are better songwriters now than back then. They were good in the 80s but their best albums are Lionheart and Sacrifice for me - the songs are just sharper and more pro and it works better; you can tell they've learned from their wisdom.

For production, Sneap's sound is mostly utilitarian for me - it gets the job done and sounds satisfyingly heavy and entertaining, and it conveys the music in a clear fashion. It isn't terribly exciting so far as production goes, but it gets the job done well enough and good music can make you not care if it sounds slightly too much like others with the same production.

If I had to choose, some of my favorite guitar tones are from more underground bands like Antiquus/Slough Feg (the spacey, gritty tone) or the sharp, intricate melodicism of Pharaoh, or something like that. I love a lot of modern production styles and it's cool that so many bands can achieve a new dimension to their sound with new technology.

Thanks thrashinbatman! I guess it is borderline impossible to quantify, but it sounds like you prefer stuff to sound kinda clean and I want it shit-caked! That explains that! hahaha

I'm so glad none of these bands had any fucking money in the early 80s. But even if they did, the most sterile production they could have got would have sounded like Heaven & Hell, which fucking RULES. The big name/profitable bands back then still got some pretty incredible productions, despite having a lot of money and a team behind them. Dokken for instance, had some fucking RIPPING tones.

Yeah, I agree. I've enjoyed their past three albums more than any of their classic stuff, though in no way am I implying classic Saxon is anything less than great. The past few albums have been generally heavier, and I prefer aggressive Saxon to traditional-sounding Saxon. I'm constantly impressed with their ability to "get it", and compose fresh, inspired sounding heavy metal even at their age. Modern Saxon in a lot of ways is what Judas Priest is trying so hard to be, but Saxon manages to pull off effortlessly what Priest struggles immensely with.

I also agree that Sneap's productions can be generally pretty utilitarian, particularly his 2000's work. I feel in recent years he's expanded into doing things that sound really good as opposed to acceptably bringing the music across. Albums like "United Abominations" or "Enemy of God" are good-sounding but generally not remarkable. I think "unorthodox" guitar tones are really cool, taking an approach that focuses on creating particular atmospheres or vibes as opposed to just sounding good, even though there's nothing wrong with either approach.



Yeah, for sure! I think the difference was that back in the 80s, bands were forced to use what they had in terms of gear, so even well-produced albums would sound somewhat unique amongst each other. While things like amp sims, impulses, and drum samples are great tools, they can very easily lead to a lot of separate productions sounding the same. It's much easier to sound unique when you take a specific drum set that's set up a particular way, the miced up in a unique room then processed, versus bands just pulling up Steven Slate Drums and using that. Clean productions =/= that necessarily, but it's very easy to fall in that trap, especially nowadays that we have as a whole, sort of figured out what works and what doesn't for heavy metal, while back then the rules were still being written.

I liked what I heard there. Very formulaic Saxon and I can't complain. Still my most anticipated album of the year.

New song from the upcoming album and a fucking great one at that. Such a tasteful tribute to Lemmy. Saxon is as consistent as they come.

I finally got the album after having seen them for the 4th time a week ago. Very good; it's not quite as good as late-career high watermarks such as Unleash the Beast, Sacrifice and Lionheart but it's not far behind. Man, live and in the studio, Saxon are really still a quality band. Their peers should be ashamed. They played more, play harder and write better new material.

'Secrets of Flight' is one of the best Saxon songs... a band pushing towards their 70s have no right to be writing riffs that good. The album is a bit front-loaded but even the weaker tracks tend to be fun due to the energy. Yeah, I'm not a great Sneap fan either, but he's done a good job in terms of capturing energy and, I assume, helping with arrangements. These songs are concise and have loads of cool features - parts that just appear once, for instance (fuck you, Iron Maiden, hire a producer who'll kick you in your arses... your fans deserve it). The power metal vibe is still there ala the earlier 2000s stuff and it just feels like part of their thing now.

Long may they reign.

You've hit the nail right on the head with "Secret Of Flight" being an absolute killer. One of the best songs of the year for me and probably one of the best songs that they've ever written. They are absolutely fantastic live. Biff still kills it every night and does very little warmup for his vocals. Dude is just inhuman.

I can't get into the Motorhead tribute song so much, and the latter half of the album isn't quite as good as the first half. But "Secret of Flight," "Nosferatu" and "Predator" are some seriously rocking tunes. Great riffs. They're still consistent as hell.

I'd agree that it dips in the second half. I think the Motorhead tribute works well; it's part 'Fast' Eddie, part 'Princess of the Night' and therefore it does the trick for me. They're basically on a 9 album (mostly) winning streak at this point in time.

Yeah I mean even the second half's got fun tunes like "Wizard's Tale" which is charmingly geeky in a way I don't see old school bands doing as much now. And "Sons of Odin" is a bit of a grower - sweet groove.

This was just the first one I heard after Sacrifice, which was probably my favorite album they did, so after the initial excitement wore off I may have graded it slightly harsher. Should go back to it soon.