That's exactly how I look at Ram It Down, FasterDisaster.

Painkiller is what happens when you play Ram It Down with a drummer that isn't a human dumpster fire.

I think "Hard as Iron" was them moving closer to the "Painkiller" style, and yeah they wanted Travis-like drums there but had to settle for a drum machine.

The title track is great and fast but still has riffs that are closer to "Defenders of the Faith" than the more thrashy riffs they started throwing in on "Painkiller".

Judas Priest defy the usual album-to-album progression frequently. British Steel - Point of Entry - Screaming for Vengeance is one. Turbo - Ram It Down - Painkiller is another.

Of course a lot of Ram it Down was written for "Twin Turbos" but yes, the intensity is an unappreciated proto-Painkiller. God, that lead break in the title track. I don't think there really wasn't much like that around in 1988. It's still kind of jaw-dropping now. Even Riot's Thundersteel doesn't live up to that. Some of the songs are speed-metal masterpieces.

The problem is, it's not controversial to say that Love Zone, Come and Get It and Love You to Death are a bit naff, which doesn't leave that much.

I think the Johnny B. Goode cover is a bit of fun unfairly absolutely critically ravaged, but Heavy Metal is fucking awesome and a massively underrated anthem.

There are people who hate their "Johnny B. Goode" cover? What fucking monsters are these?!

They are monsters, monsters of rock.

Apparently, JP themselves hate their "Johnny B Goode" cover.

Ram It Down is JP's worst album, for two reasons:

1) at least half the songs stink up the joint. Heavy Metal/Love Zone/Love You To Death - all terrible songs, really forced lyrics, trying desperately to prove how 'metal' the band is after the alienation caused by the previous record.

2) The drums. OH GOD, the drums. Put it simply, Ram It Down has the worst drum sound of any album I can think of apart from St. Anger. To say that the drum machines/electronic drums sound dated would be an understatement. They interrupt every single song.

There are some good songs on Ram It Down. The title track, as others have pointed out, contains some awesome shredding that points the way for Painkiller. Hard As Iron is OK. Blood Red Skies is actually a classic JP song. But the drum machine just ruins them. Blood Red Skies in particular, which starts off very atmospherically and then has the mood completely interrupted by the drums. That song works much better live, simply because there is no drum machine on it....

JP need to take the good songs off Ram It Down and get Scott Travis to re-record all the drum parts properly. Then release them as an EP.

"Love you to Death" has good music, even if the lyrics cause people to cringe. But that lyrical theme is not uncommon for Halford so it seems a little strange to wait until 1988 to object to it.

I was thinking more along the lines of Heavy Metal or Monsters Of Rock - cliche central.

I've been hooked on the "Defenders Of The Faith" LP again recently. It's got me real excited for some new JP. It also really makes me wish they'd play some more deep cuts on their tours.

I hate those songs. Some of the worst they've ever recorded.

I wish every legacy artist would play more deep cuts. Otherwise, I have little reason to see them again.

Holland probably could've done a good job if he wasn't too busy diddling kids.

I hope this new album is not redeemer of souls part two. that title track was just horrible.

I don't see why it should cause anyone to cringe, unless they're sexually uncomfortable. "Sadomasochistic and sadistic to the core, gratify your senses as they drag you to the floor", that's what Halford is, and if one "objects", they should perhaps listen to somebody else.

What? Where? Painkiller is about the best example of a speed metal album as I can think of (it's also a dumb album, but that's another thing).

"Ram It Down" is actually mostly awesome - the cheap 80's drums and corny lyrics only add to its power. Those who dislike it, when asked "what do they want," surely fail to reply "HEAVY METAL."

Ram It Down is crap; Turn it Off is more appropriate for a lot of its duration. Painkiller? Eh, 'Between the Hammer and the Anvil' is basically the only song on that album with any "heart" for me.

Fair enough. Priest are fairly silly from Stained Class onwards (Oh, I know, some of it is pretty good but Invaders?) and I think any fan needs to embrace that.

Lochness is a bit much though. I remember a massive backlash against that song and how stupid it was, and I do find it very hard to love.

(Unless you count Blood Red Skies, I think Cathedral Spires is the only time Priest have managed to do a long-runner that can hold up to Maiden's epics)

Not a fan of Leather Rebel huh?

Or the title track or "All Guns Blazing" or "Metal Meltdown" or "Hell Patrol" or Nightcrawler" or "A Touch OF Evil" or "One Shot at Glory" either I take it?

No doubt Painkiller had massive impact on me when I heard it for the first time (who didn't find it the most metal thing ever when he heard this the first time anyway?) but nowadays I just see it as an over-the-top album that's just way over the top. As if Judas Priest went through a midlife crisis when they delivered that album.

Sorry, I just love over-the-top over the top.

It's absurd but also fucking extraordinary and unique. It's like Michelangelo or David Bowie in that it takes everything further than anything before but if you copy it you just look kinda stupid.

I'm trying to remember when it has ever been wrong for metal music to be over the top. That's a new one to me.

It's supposed to be over the top.

Well a lot of people on these boards seem to not like post-Battle Hymns Manowar for how over the top they got. Personally, I really dig it though.

Apparently, only some of us have heard the call.

If it's anything like ROS i'll be happy

So your happy with mostly forgettable tripe?

Before people quibble with this, I challenge anyone to do a poll of any group of metalheads of their favorite Judas Priest album and share how many times the post re-union albums appear.

Does anyone think that the post reunion albums are better than any of the other JP albums?

Yes, that was definitely what he was saying, you're a genius.

I asked the user a legitimate question. RoS is a sad attempt to regain past glory....just like Sabbath's 13, Manowar's re recording of KoM, and the new Metallica. Will the new album be any different? Doubt it. But you chiming in like that shows me how your post count got so high.

Yep. Also add new "Queensryche" albums to that list. I'm sure there are many more examples.

I really wish KK would form a new band with Ripper Owens. That might be worth hearing.

I like AoR more than Rocka Rolla, Turbo, Ram It Down, Ripper era, and Point of Entry. Its nothing special or unique but it gets my head banging for the most part.

That's my favourite track from Painkiller! Don't hear it praised too often.

Or to put that another way you like it less than Sad Wings of Destiny, Sin after Sin, Killing Machine, Stained Class, British Steel, Screaming for Vengeance, Defenders of the Faith, Ram it Down, and Painkiller.

Well that changed my perspective.


Really? I thought it was a show fav. It's such a good metal anthem.

It's anthemic. It's speedy. It doesn't overstay its welcome. It's a pretty fuckin awesome song.

Sure its impressive that some geezer can actually move around a bit on stage...but at some point it becomes a shell of its glory

First taste...