Deleted Sylvaine. Shoegaze.

It hasn't survived long, this one. I thought it'd been reassessed less than a month ago.

Numerous mods overruled OC on this one.

Deleted Tezcatlipoca from Finland. Musically dodgy lo-fi stuff and seems to be a 2-track-Mikseri bedroom band anyway.

*OOPS,wrong thread*

Wrong thread, use viewtopic.php?f=3&t=64985

Hey I'm not sure where to post this but why is the Perturbator guy here, he doesn't have any bands on the archives.

http://www.metal-archives.com/artists/P ... tor/478546

Allright, deleted. He was at some point attached to a band that was deleted.
As for your question where to post stuff like this, you can always use the report function.

Deleted Finis Omnium. Missed the fact that the only release was streaming only.

These look like duplicate entries of the same band:

http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Dar ... 3540412654
http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Dar ... 3540406412

Yup, they are dupes, most recent one deleted.

Dang, the warning took me to the other band, so I didn't even see the other-other band. Good catch.

Gotchas! Wasn't sure which one should go or stay or all that and did not want to get into that I figured I just post it here and let ya'll chop it up how ya see fit!

Good catch, Gelordum. Thanks for reporting.

http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Waterclime/61423

I've looked in the thread, and I've seen where Waterclime is mentioned as being a side-project of Vintersorg/Andreas Hedlund, but the last time it was brought up was 2009, and rules have tightened since then. I get that Hedlund is prominent with folk bands, but is he really big enough that a prog/jazz solo project of his belongs here?

Deleted.

EDIT: Also nuked This Horrible Machine. -core.[/quote]


I had submitted this band back in 2004 and I was a member of the band until we split up. Besides from "Drowning Visions" that you considered "non-existing", we had another demo called "the agony" which was recorded in 2005 but never listed in here I guess. I am now enclosing the downloadable link of this demo to prove the validity of the demo. It includes four songs two of which are our own compositions and 2 cover songs from Death. This demo was quite known back in the day especially in the online audiences thanks to metal forums. I would have sent this sooner had I learned that you deleted the page.

https://mega.nz/#!4ERgADCZ!6SoqmVNRDLFU ... 55pvAPfPOU

Cheers

Ok, let me get this straight... Out of two demos, there's a total of eight tracks of which FOUR are Death covers, ONE is an Iron Maiden cover, and only three songs consist of original music? That's... not really a valid release. That's mostly cover music backed by a couple original tracks, and it should be the other way around to be considered valid. Sorry, but your band can't be accepted based on that only.

Deleted Neizbezhnost. Same band as Неизбежность that's already in the archives.

Deleted:

Stagnant Waters - noisy/mathy avant-garde/industrial something
Nowyourefucked - punk-based grind
Hark! It's a Crawling Tar-Tar - neocrust

Maybe this was discussed before but I couldn't find anything with the search option. I'm actually wondering why Sloth are still accepted by MA. We can safely say that a significant majority of their music doesn't have anything to do with metal or even with music for that matter. The band only seems to keep going to be the band with the highest number of releases on this site. I think one shouldn't feed the troll.

I'm sure a mod will come behind me and confirm, but Az has stated before in another thread that Sloth's desire to commit the musical equivalent of shitposting still doesn't negate their inclusion on the site. They're the same as any other band that played metal and moved away, but with an obnoxious habit attached.

Correct, we don't delete valid bands because they are inconvenient to keep. We do not have the luxury to excise "naughty" bands, we document what they do/release according to the guidelines set for this site. Sloth are an extreme case and there are some moderators who agree with kluseba, but I strongly believe there is no valid reason to delete them (singles or wholesale).

As for "metalness", Sloth were re-reviewed extensively not too long ago and there are enough sludge metal demos, EPs and splits in their pre-singlerrhea period to warrant inclusion.

Speedgod:

http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Speedgod/3540367595

All three songs are here:
https://www.youtube.com/user/Speedgodba ... =0&sort=dd

I saw someone bring this band up in the "why was band x rejected" thread and decided to give a listen. It sounds pretty borderline -core to me so I figured it might be worth a re-evaluation.

Endoki Forest
http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/End ... 3540256615

Ambient
Moon Dances: Described as ambient on this old distro list: http://i.imgur.com/meGzHB5.jpg
Dusk of the Serpent Covenant: https://faunusloki.bandcamp.com/track/d ... -demo-1994
An Evil of Nordic Frost: https://faunusloki.bandcamp.com/track/a ... -demo-1995
Black Sorcerers Fortress: https://faunusloki.bandcamp.com/album/b ... s-fortress

Other stuff:
https://faunusloki.bandcamp.com/album/a ... rdic-frost
https://faunusloki.bandcamp.com/track/the-great-god-pan

^Deleted.

Also deleted Schwefel from Germany. A many-faced band playing glam rock, industrial, EBM and other non-metal genres; allegedly added based on one metal release, but it's groovy rock with some industrial/alternative overtones.

After re-evaluating their entire discography, the staff has come to the conclusion that none of In Extremo's output is really predominantly metal and so they have been deleted. A decade-and-a-half-old oversight, I'm sad to say. The norm appears to be a mix of folk rock, NDH and chuggy bagpipe rock with some metal leanings from time to time. It would seem Kunstraub is among their most metal, but even this album is extremely borderline at best.

If you're wondering, we are currently in the process of "auditing" the entire medieval "metal" scene as there are a lot of those kinds of bands listed on MA and a lot of what I've heard is questionably metal, to say the least.

EDIT: Also gone for similar reasons: Ignis Fatuu

Not sure I agree with Twelfth of Never being on here. I've listened to both of their full-length albums, and I don't hear any actual metal. There are occasional distorted guitars, but very little in terms of actual riffs. I'd call it ethereal wave/gothic rock at best. It's kind of like the same case as This Empty Flow; it's definitely dark, and it's gothic, but it's not gothic metal.

Deleted.

Have you listened to In Extremo's brand new album "Quid pro Quo"? There is definitely a whole lot of metal in this, just listen to songs like Roter Stern; Quid pro Quo; Lieb Vaterland, magst ruhig sein; Flaschenteufel and Dacw‘ nghariad. It's not just one element among others, it's really as dominant as the folk passages, hence the genre folk metal or medieval metal. It's no coincidence that the band has collaborated with Blind Guardian and Heaven Shall Burn on this record. This record is at least as heavy as "Kunstraub'' was and probably even heavier in my opinion.

It's also no coincidence that the band's new record is the album of the month in the German Metal Hammer magazine. Do you really think that your definition of metal is right and the definition of such an old and famous magazine is wrong? Should they change their name from ''Metal Hammer'' to ''Rock Hammer''?

How about the band headlining numerous metal festivals in and around Germany? Do you think those who are organizing these festivals think something like: "Yeah, they're not really metal but we want to have a headliner for our metal festival that cannot really be considered metal?"

Do you think metal fans who are going there to see them consider In Extremo to be "chuggy bagpipe rock"?

I think you guys are really being too severe. It's inredible how the metal scene becomes more and more diverse and open-minded, yet the rules for the archives more and more conservative and narrow-minded. In Extremo has been on the archives for more than a decade and were accepted when they were much more experimental and mellower and now that they have become constantly heavier with each record, they get deleted. It doesn't make any sense to me.

And In Extremo is definitely heavier than nearly all medieval rock bands, so you should delete groups like Schandmaul and Saltatio Mortis way before them. The only band that might be nearly as heavy as In Extremo is Subway to Sally but their heaviness sounds like depressive NDH music which is something you guys don't consider metal anyway.

To keep it short, I would like the decision to delete In Extremo from the archives to be revised, preferably by someone who is aware of In Extremo's pioneer work for folk metal, their undeniable impact on the entire metal scene in and around Germany for decades and especially the constant development of their sound towards a much heavier direction that can't qualify as folk rock music anymore.

And if you are really going to stick with that decision, is there a way to send me my review of their latest single "Sternhagelvoll"? Thanks.

PS: I don't mean to be impolite and if you read that out of my text, I do apologize. I admit that In Extremo is one of my very favorite bands and the band that really got me into metal, so it's an emotional thing for me.

Really, man? You've been around long enough to know that we don't fool around when we make these decisions. You can rest assured that, yes, we did review the entire discography (including the new album). Likewise, no, we don't judge bands (with the very few recorded exceptions) on anything but the music they produce. Frankly, we don't care what definition the editors of "Germany Metal Hammer" magazine use for determining what is and isn't metal, much like I imagine they don't care how we define metal, and likewise it doesn't matter who bands play with at festivals "in and around Germany." Are you going to suggest that ALL bands that headline at Wacken are heavy metal? Seriously?

I also like how you have to include a bit about how we're "conservative and narrow-minded" compared to the rest of the "metal scene." Really? A site that has over 100K bands listed on it is "conservative" and "narrow-minded"? Even with those numbers, we don't deny we have a different way of defining metal than others; we base our definition on "metal riffs" and not on "heaviness" or whatever else others have come up with. We accept it's subjective, as anyone's definition might be. We're also not in the business of being an authority on what is and isn't heavy metal; we leave that up to our users to decide on their own. If you believe In Extremo is "heavy metal" than all to you, but following a lengthy review we've decided the original submission was made in error. We've always had this idea that to be acceptable a band must have at least one album that is predominantly metal and that metal is a form of music based in metal riffs, but admittedly when In Extremo was added that understanding was still being worked out. For the sake of maintaining consistency with our standards it's important for us to review the decisions we've made - even ones over a decade old - because it reinforces those standards. We're still reviewing bands in the same vein as In Extremo; we are taking our time to be as thorough with the music as possible, to make sure that the decision we make is the right one.

Personally, as a lover of folk metal I can't fathom In Extremo as folk metal, sorry. I've tried, man. But I'm not undercutting the value it as as a gateway band for you. I'm certain if you ask anyone, moderator or not, about the bands that they love and helped them get into metal, they wont all be listed here. It's not a bad or sad thing to enjoy music that doesn't qualify for acceptance here.

Azmodes has told me he will email you your review for that single.

As I said in the second paragraph of my initial post, we are still in the process of checking the entire "medieval metal" scene, so yes, Schandmaul, Subway to Sally, Saltatio Mortis and many others are "on our list" as well. Many partially checked. It's just that In Extremo was the first band we got done (i.e. had assessed all the albums and received input from a variety of staffers to arrive at a consensus).

Unless you would prefer us to delete numerous bands wholesale based on assumptions about who's heavier than who?

Thanks for the discussion and thanks for sending me that review. I'm simply surprised that In Extremo is the first band to be checked out since they are known as one of the heavier bands of that genre and I'm not the only one to consider bands like Schandmaul to be much more borderline. If you end up deleting all of them after a while, you will at least be consistent and that would be acceptable for everyone. Since I'm a fan of this genre, I could send you dozens of bands to re-evaluate and delete.

It's simply weird that some approaches on this site are inclusive and others are exclusive or exceptional. If you want to be coherent, then you can't have bands like Deep Purple and Rush on here either.

Somebody mentioned Rammstein. In my opinion, NDH is a subgenre of heavy metal music and should therefor be accepted and I consider Rammstein a metal band. Most people I know do. Nobody can tell me that a band with such a heavy sound is simply rock or hard rock. But I can accept that such a band is excluded here if all bands of that kind are also excluded. It's curious to me that bands such as Die Krupps, Ministry and White Zombie are accepted however.

I know these things have been discussed countless times and the reason why this is brought up over and over again by different users is the lack of consistency. If this site ended up being more consistent with these re-evaluations, then it would all be perfectly fine.

The thing is though, we do have consistency. Like Derigin stated, you may think something is metal and the site doesn't and that's perfectly fine and if that's where you believe we are inconsistent, then so be it. We will not please everyone.

But we actually are consistent. If a band is borderline, we don't just base what we take on one opinion. We get a moderation consensus and if the staff feels it's metal, we take it. If not, we reject it. If we find a band or someone brings up a band here that they want us to re-evaluate, we do so as a staff and make a decision. If a band is blacklisted and someone wants us to check it out, if it's borderline we get moderation consensus before whitelisting.

So really, the only inconsistency is that what's metal to one listener may not be to others. But in terms of what we do at the site, we follow the same steps to evaluate every band and if someone makes a poor decision, we rectify it with moderation consensus like is being done above.

Well, remember, too, that it's not the *band* that's used to judge acceptance, but the *album*. It's an important distinction.

So long as a band has released a predominantly metal album then they will get accepted. This is regardless as to whether a band is better known for their non-metal material or the band has non-metal albums. It's why the whole argument of "Why is X band here, but not Y" doesn't fly; that line of thinking presumes we accepted X based on their entire catalog (when in reality it could be a single lesser-known album). Generally it's the case that the vast majority of accepted bands are bands that play exclusively heavy metal music, but we wont remove a band or exclude them because at some point they played non-metal music. Imagine how butt hurt most of our userbase would be if we did that.

Kluseba sounds like someone who discovered the site yesterday.

No, those who deleted In Extremo sounded like people who had just discovered that band and I explained why I though that. I simply wanted to have some more information and explanations and everything is fine now. I will though check if the moderation is going to be as consistent as they claim and going to delete all similarly sounding bands like Schandmaul and the likes that definitely don't have a predominantly metal album.

Please don't delete Black Sabbath for being ''heavy blues rock with pseudo-occult lyrics''

We will be sure to only delete the bands you love.

Why was Axcutor accepted? They seem to have one digital single and nothing else.

They were added in 2009 so I guess they had a physical release back then since digital releases weren't allowed. TGW is a good contributor anyhow, he probably knows.

Yeah, that sounds about right. Thanks for the answer.
If anything, it seems like the band mentioned there being a CD version here, so I guess I'll add it.