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Marmer
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:59 am
Posts: 777
Location: Netherlands
PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 4:49 am 
 

Im Born to make people laugh mate. Enjoy.
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dreadmeat
emere vendere cambire

Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
Posts: 6006
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Sat Aug 10, 2013 5:03 pm 
 

Just tripped over a bootleg of Immolation - Dawn Of Possession
Maybe it's old news maybe it isn't but thankfully someone posted some good quality images

That font is all wrong but the text is accurate
Image

The image printed onto the centre of the disc shouldn't be there, it should be clear, and is darker
Image

Odd looking barcode and darker artwork etc
Image
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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
Posts: 5145
Location: Portugal
PostPosted: Sat Aug 10, 2013 6:47 pm 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
Just tripped over a bootleg of Immolation - Dawn Of Possession
Maybe it's old news maybe it isn't but thankfully someone posted some good quality images

Spoiler: show
That font is all wrong but the text is accurate
Image

The image printed onto the centre of the disc shouldn't be there, it should be clear, and is darker
Image

Odd looking barcode and darker artwork etc
Image

You tripped over it?! :p

Anyway, the matrix picture is very telling. Anyone who has seen a SONOPRESS matrix before would easily identify that font as being off. Sucks to see that bootlegs keep coming from everywhere and affecting any possible title... :(
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goro_stern502
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2010 5:25 pm
Posts: 8
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:05 pm 
 

I recently bought a Dissection "The Somberlain" first press CD released by No Fashion Records (NFR 006). My friend also bought a first press but not sure it really is a first press. All the first press editions I've looked at look like mine, black CD, distributed by House of Kicks and has the fan mail addresses of No Fashion Records and Dissection's too. My friends CD is purple, not black. the booklet and the back of the CD look the same but not the CD. Can someone help me with this issue??? It doesn't look like the Japanese version either.


Last edited by goro_stern502 on Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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dreadmeat
emere vendere cambire

Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:13 pm 
 

http://www.metal-archives.com/board/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=92986 <==[ check out this thread mate

My copy is a 2 CD reissue on The End Records which doesn't really help you
http://www.discogs.com/release/1373134
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Zodijackyl
Lazy Wizard

Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:39 pm
Posts: 5011
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:46 pm 
 

There were multiple pressings of the CD made of the original NFR edition. Discogs lists three different matrix codes found on the first NFR version. http://www.discogs.com/Dissection-The-S ... ase/378324

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dreadmeat
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Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:55 pm 
 

I have requested that someone separates these, clearly they are totally different.

Matrix / Runout (Variation #1): CD PLANT MFG NFR 006 CDM01
Matrix / Runout (Variation #2): NFR006 00070418
Matrix / Runout (Variation #3): DCM Digital Communication Media™ (logotype) 23072303 NFR 006


edit: less than a minute ago shouldn't be on the end!
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Last edited by dreadmeat on Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Stone69
Metalhead

Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 am
Posts: 501
Location: Filipinas
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:48 am 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
I have requested that someone separates these, clearly they are totally different.

Matrix / Runout (Variation #1): CD PLANT MFG NFR 006 CDM01
Matrix / Runout (Variation #2): NFR006 00070418
Matrix / Runout (Variation #3): DCM Digital Communication Media™ (logotype) 23072303 NFR 006 less than a minute ago


If you don't mind me asking, what's the difference between the 3 Variations komrade? I hope you could enlighten me I'm new on this things. :brick:

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dreadmeat
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:52 am 
 

Different manufacturers, pressing plants, replicators, duplicator, glass masterer etc
Variant 2 may eve be incomplete, maybe missing a logo or even a url, no mould or mastering SID codes
Anything could be missing really :scratch:
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Stone69
Metalhead

Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 am
Posts: 501
Location: Filipinas
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:01 am 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
Different manufacturers, pressing plants, replicators, duplicator, glass masterer etc
Variant 2 may eve be incomplete, maybe missing a logo or even a url, no mould or mastering SID codes
Anything could be missing really :scratch:


Thanks for the enlightenment komrade!
So there is no issue like: "Variant #1 being the first press, #3 being a third press"? All Variants [#1,#2,#3] are all considered first press with different CD matrix because the discs were manufactured by different manufacturers and pressing plants? :-D

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dreadmeat
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Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:05 am 
 

That's right, the variants are just added in the order they are added by whoever adds them
They should all be separate releases on Discogs, different manufacturer = unique release

Never take Discogs, GEMM, Ebay, Musik Sammler etc as 100% accurate
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Stone69
Metalhead

Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 am
Posts: 501
Location: Filipinas
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:11 am 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
That's right, the variants are just added in the order they are added by whoever adds them
They should all be separate releases on Discogs, different manufacturer = unique release

Never take Discogs, GEMM, Ebay, Musik Sammler etc as 100% accurate


:metal: Thanks komrade! Horns Up!

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dreadmeat
emere vendere cambire

Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:14 am 
 

And you guys thought you just had CDs, philistines! :roll: :lol:
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Stone69
Metalhead

Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 am
Posts: 501
Location: Filipinas
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:17 am 
 

Question about:
Arckanum - Fran Marder [Necropolis Records 1995]

Discogs and Ebay tells this matrix [first press] NR-008 MADE IN TAIWAN 950627-22 67513XK1 IFPI L601.

My personal copy has this matrix:
IFPI LN46 NR-008 79265-80008-21

Any idea on this? Is mine a bootleg or what?
Thanks!

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dreadmeat
emere vendere cambire

Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:22 am 
 

Who says the person selling it on Ebay knows what they are talking about and may even be the person editing the Discogs page [or worse, copy/paste]
It's not necessarily an original [I use that word to mean first press] also yours may just be a repress, reissue or just for a different market, eg
UK vs Europe vs US vs Asia will often all be quite different
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Stone69
Metalhead

Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 am
Posts: 501
Location: Filipinas
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:24 am 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
And you guys thought you just had CDs, philistines! :roll: :lol:


:durr: You're damn right komrade. I was very contented until I knew all about this "matrix" thing, made me a paranoid once the whole day - checking all my CD and their matrix and comparing it to what discogs and ebay says. :brick:
Did research about these codes in Wikipedia, but really doesn't understand 100% what Wiki says about them hahaha!

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dreadmeat
emere vendere cambire

Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
Posts: 6006
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:31 am 
 

Download this small pdf file
http://www.ifpi.org/content/library/sid-code-implementation-guide.pdf

And have a look here
http://www.discogs.com/help/submission-guidelines-release-format.html#CD_Matrix

And yes I freaked out too when I discovered all this stuff, I'm now committed to updating Discogs
I was on the receiving end of some counterfeit CDs not long ago too so this knowledge came in quite handy
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Stone69
Metalhead

Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 am
Posts: 501
Location: Filipinas
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:45 am 
 

Great help komrade, thanks!
Discovering a bootleg/counterfeit CD which you had in your personal collection in a very long time would be very depressive! :brick:
It's very nice to have knowledge on this information. Serves as a protection on serious collectors like ourselves! :snipe:

Horns Up! :metal:

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Zodijackyl
Lazy Wizard

Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:39 pm
Posts: 5011
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:33 pm 
 

Merged the Dissection thread into this one, now that I'm awake enough to use the merging tools without screwing up!

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dreadmeat
emere vendere cambire

Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
Posts: 6006
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2013 6:02 pm 
 

It's like, maggick :o

This thread is an excellent resource, I send people here from other sites too now
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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
Posts: 5145
Location: Portugal
PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:25 am 
 

OK guys, I need a hand in here. :p

I'm looking at original presses of Crypt of Kerberos' World Of Myths and I'm trying to figure out why there are two different "first presses" when there should only be one (allegedly). Take heed at the links below:

Supposedly the "true" first press, no IFPI and correct matrix:

Discogs
Ebay

Supposedly a repress of the first press, with IFPI and different matrix:

Ebay

There's also a very distinctive difference on the label of the CD, the DUPLI PRODUCTION logo is only present on the first and not in the second. Now the thing is that both are being marketed as first presses, although a keen eye and a sane mind will tell you that a 1993 CD can't have IFPI codes. But is the second version a known repress? I've never seen any mention of it, but to be honest Adipocere did repress for instance Sacramentum's debut album the same year as it came out.

Can anyone provide some info on this?
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dreadmeat
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Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 2:36 pm 
 

That second one to me looks like a Sony DADC repress, the matrix is quite distinctive, no way is this from 1993
The first one http://www.discogs.com/label/Disctronics+S may be a clue
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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
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Location: Portugal
PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 2:53 pm 
 

Yeah, that second one should be a repress. Thing is... there's absolutely no info on it whatsoever. That is, apart from the several copies that were sold on Ebay. Or that are still for sale as that link proves.

Maybe some of the old collectors know something more about this?!
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dreadmeat
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 12:12 am 
 

Maybe you should take one for the team and buy it so you can update Discogs :thumbsup:
If they claim it's a "first press" [aka an original] and it isn't, you can get your money back in theory.
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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
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Location: Portugal
PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 7:40 am 
 

Funny that you mention that. I purchased a copy of the second edition I mentioned above recently, which arrived yesterday. Hence my post. ;)

I just wanted some reassurance, although this feels pretty legit to me.
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dreadmeat
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 5:07 pm 
 

Oh you bought one? I didn't see that in your post :roll:
Does it smell like a Pirate's nutsack? if not then you're good to go
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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 7:52 pm 
 

I didn't actually mention it before, but yes, I bought a copy which is identical to that second one. As I said though it seems pretty legit, although I wanted to know more about it since there aren't any known represses, allegedly.

Guess I'm not getting any luck with that... :(
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Marmer
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:59 am
Posts: 777
Location: Netherlands
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 10:56 am 
 

I have a Crypt of Kerberos CD from when it came out. I can check f there are differneces?
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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
Posts: 5145
Location: Portugal
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 11:21 am 
 

Marmer wrote:
I have a Crypt of Kerberos CD from when it came out. I can check f there are differneces?

Please do! :)
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dreadmeat
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 4:50 pm 
 

And update Discogs too?
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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
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Location: Portugal
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 5:06 pm 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
And update Discogs too?

Easy boy, we have time for that. :p
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Marmer
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:59 am
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Location: Netherlands
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 11:32 pm 
 

I try to make Some pictures. And send em to ya ok?

From THE inner Side. Matrix booklet and so on.
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dreadmeat
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:59 am 
 

Hey cool, I accidentally bought a Dark Angel bootleg because I didn't read properly :roll:

http://www.discogs.com/release/4832184
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Marmer
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:57 am 
 

I mailed you the pictures of the cd and so on.. Cheerz.
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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 12:30 pm 
 

For those who care, I've added the COK release to Discogs. You can check it here. I've intentionally left the date of release blank because that's something I couldn't verify, and I've tried to make the information present as complete as possible.

After discussing this with innumerous people I've come to the conclusion that it's legit.
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dreadmeat
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 4:34 am 
 

I uncovered another version of Revenge - Attack.Blood.Revenge on CD if you guys are interested, check out the scans etc
They have numerous differences throughout

http://www.discogs.com/release/4843220
and
http://www.discogs.com/release/852992
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Stone69
Metalhead

Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 am
Posts: 501
Location: Filipinas
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:35 am 
 

Had anyone answered this issue regarding the Setherial - Nord CD? viewtopic.php?f=1&t=71177

Like him, I also possess both versions. I don't know which one should I dispose because I could not confirm which one is the original/first press. hahaha!

Also, just found out that my God Dethroned - Blood Blasphemy CD doesn't have the IFPI code, considered bootleg/counterfeit right?

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dreadmeat
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Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:38 am 
 

Stone69 wrote:
Also, just found out that my God Dethroned - Blood Blasphemy CD doesn't have the IFPI code, considered bootleg/counterfeit right?
Absolutely not, I have loads of legit CDs with no [visible] SID codes
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Stone69
Metalhead

Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 2:58 am
Posts: 501
Location: Filipinas
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:42 am 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
Stone69 wrote:
Also, just found out that my God Dethroned - Blood Blasphemy CD doesn't have the IFPI code, considered bootleg/counterfeit right?
Absolutely not, I have loads of legit CDs with no [visible] SID codes


Horns up komrade! :hyper: Glad to know that! :thumbsup:

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dreadmeat
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:44 am 
 

I see it's on Metal Blade? they often don't have any, Relapse too by the way, not sure why!
http://www.discogs.com/master/41167
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