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dreadmeat
emere vendere cambire

Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:50 am
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:48 am 
 

DIDX is Sony related: http://www.discogs.com/label/DADC
And what you are talking about is the matrix: http://www.discogs.com/help/submission-guidelines-release-format.html#CD_Matrix
You can actually see Sony DADC in that example there.
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The Lions Den
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Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:12 am
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Location: Italy
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:58 am 
 

^ Right thanx.

I thought they were bootleg
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dreadmeat
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:03 am 
 

Well they might be... what are the CDs?
Why do you think they are bootlegs?
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The Lions Den
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Location: Italy
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 6:32 am 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
Well they might be... what are the CDs?
Why do you think they are bootlegs?


Cause other Roadracer cds I own does'nt have the DIDX inscription but SONOPRESS, if I don't go wrong.
If I have time, will post a scan of the disk later.

But the absurd want to know what? Is that I bought it on ebay for a few euro years ago and is signed by the whole band!!!
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The Lions Den
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Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:12 am
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:01 am 
 

Here it is:

Image

Image

Image

Image
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DigitalDictator
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:41 pm
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Location: Italy
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 10:42 am 
 

In my opinion your cd is original:

http://www.discogs.com/Obituary-The-End ... se/4207728

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The Lions Den
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:06 am 
 

DigitalDictator wrote:


Eh si, a questo punto fortunatamente si.

Non avevo notato che c'era su discogs :ugh:
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androdion
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Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:51 pm 
 

metalbrain wrote:
Sure...

3984-14001-2 (V) . MASTERED BY NIMBUS

Mine is:

122549-R2-4084-1 DISCTRONICS USA **14001**

I was under the impression that the "Mastered by Nimbus" matrixes were EU versions, but you said you bought the US version back then?! For instance, the Peaceville CDs from the early nineties used those pressing plants. Or am I wrong?

PS: This is also interesting, as it has the same playing times as mine. Especially when compared against this. Is it possible that the first batch of the first press was just badly cut and they made a new press still in 1992 to correct it? It wouldn't be the first time a first press was screwed.
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Last edited by androdion on Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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DigitalDictator
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:54 pm 
 

Ahahah non avevo notato che sei italiano ;)

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The Lions Den
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 1:12 pm 
 

DigitalDictator wrote:
Ahahah non avevo notato che sei italiano ;)

:beer:
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dreadmeat
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:35 pm 
 

The Lions Den wrote:
Here it is:
Image
It looks legit to me, probably just a newer repress, signed by the band is cool :nods:
androdion: that sounds about right yeah
The only copy of this album I have is a two from the vault reissue with World Demise and the cassette which I bought when it first came out.
I remember the lady in the shop playing it for me saying "if there's any swearing I'll have to turn it off" ha ha ha she was in for a treat! :lol:
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The Lions Den
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:37 am 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
The Lions Den wrote:
Here it is:
Image
It looks legit to me, probably just a newer repress, signed by the band is cool :nods:


I remember get it on ebay from an American guy and I remain very surprise when I won the auction for just 7 or 8 euro include shipping :eek:
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dreadmeat
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:46 pm 
 

A repress [of that album] isn't very valuable at all, just be happy you got a good deal :grin:
Also 8 euros isn't that cheap, it's probably 5 euros just for the postage...
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metalbrain
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Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2004 8:03 pm
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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:16 pm 
 

androdion wrote:
metalbrain wrote:
Sure...

3984-14001-2 (V) . MASTERED BY NIMBUS

Mine is:

122549-R2-4084-1 DISCTRONICS USA **14001**

I was under the impression that the "Mastered by Nimbus" matrixes were EU versions, but you said you bought the US version back then?! For instance, the Peaceville CDs from the early nineties used those pressing plants. Or am I wrong?

PS: This is also interesting, as it has the same playing times as mine. Especially when compared against this. Is it possible that the first batch of the first press was just badly cut and they made a new press still in 1992 to correct it? It wouldn't be the first time a first press was screwed.


According to Discogs, Nimbus had several manufacturing plants in the US back in the early '90s (in Vermont, Utah and California) although I don't know their current status. This is pure speculation on my part, but maybe the distributor Relativity received the CDs from different plants and manufacturers, depending on the part of the US the discs were being shipped to. I have no idea how that part of the process works and I'm not sure who you could ask to verify it.

I guess a pressing error is a possibility, but it's not exactly a gigantic error that would cause the discs to be immediately pressed again.
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androdion
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:45 am 
 

Yeah, I reckon there's a lot of possibilities there. It's was just one damn quirky thing to witness. ;)

I have a question regarding IPFI codes to anyone willing to respond. How can the same (and only) edition of an album have two exactly matching copies, equal in everything up to the matrix, but with one of the IPFI codes being different. It's only the termination (ie: the last two digits), but still... Wasn't it supposed to be a match when the matrix is the same? It got me a bit confused here because both CDs are clearly originals and not bootlegs.

PS: I was reading this (fourth page) and the difference is indeed in the Mould code, whereas the Mastering code is the same. Is then possible for this to happen, same matrix and different Mould code?
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japc
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2004 10:35 pm
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:53 am 
 

Different mould codes means different pressing plants or different moulds in the same plant (if only the last two digits change it should mean the latest, see http://wiki.killuglyradio.com/wiki/Matrix_Numbers).

As they have the same mastering code the same master was used for both.

That's how I see it.
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androdion
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 12:07 pm 
 

Yeah, pretty much that. Same pressing plant/master but different mould. Always learning with each passing day! :)
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dreadmeat
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:01 pm 
 

Huge plants evidently have numerous machines in use, I've tripped over releases at Discogs where I was about to add variant 6 and I saw one that had about a dozen [a classical CD from memory] :eek:
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DestruicaoMetalica
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Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2010 12:54 pm
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:05 pm 
 

I have had two Running Wild CDs in my collection that I have thought for a long time to be bootlegs. Now, I have decided to get rid of them, but would like to be sure that they aren't originals before I just give them away. The main reasons I think that they are boots is that they register the year 2012 in the songs' info on iTunes and they look somewhat sloppy, as well as having come from a Russian trader from whom I received at least one other bootleg in the same trade as these ones.
Here's Port Royal - The matrix reads N01223 MPO 01 @@ 1 02
Front:
Spoiler: show
Image

Back:
Spoiler: show
Image

Here's Blazon Stone - The matrix reads 7 96280 2
Front:
Spoiler: show
Image

Back:
Spoiler: show
Image

Thanks a ton to anyone that can help!
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dreadmeat
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 1:20 am 
 

That itunes info means nothing, it's the same as Freedb or CDDB etc and not really version specific, the repress, reissue and original could all just be lumped together.
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DestruicaoMetalica
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:24 am 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
That itunes info means nothing, it's the same as Freedb or CDDB etc and not really version specific, the repress, reissue and original could all just be lumped together.

I didn't know that, although it seems kinda obvious now, thanks for the info! I probably should have done this before, but I looked up the matrices and they both check out for the most part. On Blazon Stone, Ironforce Shop posted it as 7 96280 2 A, whereas mine is lacking the A. As for Port Royal, the CD has the same matrix as the French edition based on info from Discogs, but the inserts have the barcode of the German edition. Is this info, even with its slight discrepancies, enough for me to know definitely that these aren't bootlegs?
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DigitalDictator
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Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:41 pm
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Location: Italy
PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 12:40 pm 
 

Unfortunately I am 99% sure that you have two (damned!) azintex bootlegs:

http://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y44 ... 1cb806.jpg

look at the matrx: it looks exactly like your Port Royal copy... Blazon Stone is totally different but it doesn't match with my original copy.

Hope this helps...

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DestruicaoMetalica
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:13 pm 
 

DigitalDictator wrote:
Unfortunately I am 99% sure that you have two (damned!) azintex bootlegs:

http://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y44 ... 1cb806.jpg

look at the matrx: it looks exactly like your Port Royal copy... Blazon Stone is totally different but it doesn't match with my original copy.

Hope this helps...

Damn. Thanks a ton for the response, though, I'm glad to know that since I wouldn't want to sell them and give myself a bad reputation. I actually ordered what looks like a legitimate copy of Blazon Stone a few days ago without thinking about the possibility of mine being real so at least I'll have a legit copy of what is my favorite of the two.
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dreadmeat
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:24 pm 
 

If you bought them from this shifty Russian bootlegging scumbag recently on Ebay you could report him and try to get your money back.
Remember the follow up feedback too.
The important thing about Discogs is it's a database of music, legitimate and not, so if it's there it can be found, if your CD's aren't there feel free to add them :nods:
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DestruicaoMetalica
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:44 pm 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
If you bought them from this shifty Russian bootlegging scumbag recently on Ebay you could report him and try to get your money back.
Remember the follow up feedback too.
The important thing about Discogs is it's a database of music, legitimate and not, so if it's there it can be found, if your CD's aren't there feel free to add them :nods:

It was actually from a trader on here, I forget the name but it started with a K, I'll have to look that up. I'll also try to find the time to add those two as boots on discogs so that anyone else with my problem can just look there.
Edit: The guy's name is Speedyk, I'm not sure if he still posts here, but be wary of trading with him.
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chaos_orb
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:30 pm
Posts: 73
Location: Bavaria, Germany
PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:32 pm 
 

dreadmeat wrote:
If you bought them from this shifty Russian bootlegging scumbag...:


Reading through the past few pages of this thread, it seems that a lot of the recent bootlegs come from countries like Russia and Greece...
Whenever i check through Discogs for a rare CD i want for my collection, the first (and cheapest) few results are always greek or russian federation sellers. Coincidence?
Do you guys think that it is in general a higher risk to buy stuff from these countries? (sorry here to the serious traders and collectors from these countries)
I have become very careful as of lately when buying CDs, as there seems to be a lot of bootleg stuff from almost everything that is 20€ and upwards.

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japc
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Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2004 10:35 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:43 pm 
 

chaos_orb wrote:
Do you guys think that it is in general a higher risk to buy stuff from these countries? (sorry here to the serious traders and collectors from these countries)

Yes.
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androdion
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 21, 2013 11:39 am 
 

japc wrote:
chaos_orb wrote:
Do you guys think that it is in general a higher risk to buy stuff from these countries? (sorry here to the serious traders and collectors from these countries)

Yes.

I second this notion, and if memory serves we discussed that some pages back. Might have been on a different thread though. Be wary of other Eastern countries too because they tend to snag copies of the Russians bootlegs.

Just follow the golden rule of "if it's too good to be true then it's probably fake". That is, unless you have a non-bootleg copy from a friend or acquaintance to double check.
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welten
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Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2008 6:36 am
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Location: Russia
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:25 am 
 

Hi all!
i have a Tiamat "Sumerian cry " cd, MetalCore

matrix AREACEM DIGIP CMFT 6 ifpi1A01

on label - made in england
Text around the top edge of the label - made in france
back cover - printed in france

very hope what it's not bootleg ;)
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XcKyle93
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:29 pm 
 

Hey everyone,

I recently purchased Garden of Shadow's "Heart of The Corona" from an individual on eBay from Bulgaria. It was not their self-released Casette; it was the CD from X-Rated Records. The CD seems legitimate, but there's one thing that's bothering me: I've read that the release is supposed to be an MCD, which I believe is a mini-CD. The thing is, the CD I have is definitely not a MCD; it's standard size. I know I've read that one should be wary of sales from eastern countries, but this guy had a very good rating, and I don't think that GoS is that sought after of a band for people to create bootlegs. It's also difficult to compare because the only version of the album that is up on discogs is for the self-released Cassette.

Could someone help me out here?
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androdion
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:58 pm 
 

Isn't MCD another acronym representative of an EP? As in "mini-album"? :???:
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XcKyle93
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 11:32 pm 
 

androdion: I do believe that you are correct, but I was under the impression that it's usually EPs/mini-albums that are usually placed on MCD (Mini-CDs).

I'm still a bit confused, but apparently MCD can also stand for Maxi single, which is something that's longer than a standard single (like an EP I guess). Apparently Cassette Maxi-singles exist, and I do believe that this is what was being referred to when I saw "MCD" next to Heart of the Corona. I believe it represents the original 4-track demo, a cassette maxi-single. I mixed this up with the album (on CD) that was released via X-rated Records.
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Chaosmonger wrote:
The Red in the Sky is Ours and select songs off With Fear... is the compositional height of death metal, if not all of metal. Better than ten Super Bowls.


Ah yes, the death metal phenomenon that is the Super Bowl.

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androdion
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:15 am 
 

You're a bit confused indeed, let me talk some sense into you. :P

The differentiation between a Single and a Maxi Single is the number of available songs, while at the same time retaining the song that's the actual "single". Think of it as something along the lines of a 2 track CD (Single) vs a 4 track CD (Maxi Single). Those can be released in whatever format though, and the acronym MCD is used for that kind of releases. Likewise, an EP can be printed to vinyl, CD or tape, but it's always an EP (Extended Play).

Hope this clears your doubts. ;)
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chaos_orb
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 2:02 pm 
 

androdion wrote:
You're a bit confused indeed, let me talk some sense into you. :P

The differentiation between a Single and a Maxi Single is the number of available songs, while at the same time retaining the song that's the actual "single". Think of it as something along the lines of a 2 track CD (Single) vs a 4 track CD (Maxi Single). Those can be released in whatever format though, and the acronym MCD is used for that kind of releases. Likewise, an EP can be printed to vinyl, CD or tape, but it's always an EP (Extended Play).

Hope this clears your doubts. ;)



That was interesting, thanks! :)

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XcKyle93
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:45 am 
 

androdion wrote:
You're a bit confused indeed, let me talk some sense into you. :P

The differentiation between a Single and a Maxi Single is the number of available songs, while at the same time retaining the song that's the actual "single". Think of it as something along the lines of a 2 track CD (Single) vs a 4 track CD (Maxi Single). Those can be released in whatever format though, and the acronym MCD is used for that kind of releases. Likewise, an EP can be printed to vinyl, CD or tape, but it's always an EP (Extended Play).

Hope this clears your doubts. ;)


Well, that certainly was an educational experience! I understand what a Maxi-single/MCD is now :).

Unfortunately, I am still very confused about this Mini-CD though. In this interview, the guitarist from Garden of Shadows explicitly mentions the 6-track, Mini-CD version of "Heart of the Corona":http://www.roughedge.com/features/gardenofshadowsinter.htm

Perhaps both a Mini-CD and CD version exist, but I haven't been able to verify that myself. I've actually been in contact with one of the guitarists from GoS, so maybe I'll just ask them.
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Chaosmonger wrote:
The Red in the Sky is Ours and select songs off With Fear... is the compositional height of death metal, if not all of metal. Better than ten Super Bowls.


Ah yes, the death metal phenomenon that is the Super Bowl.

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androdion
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:07 pm 
 

To be honest I think it's a matter of interpretation there. People have by now stated countless times that the demo put to CD format became sort of their debut album. But back then bands would just call that kind of stint an EP (mini-album), because it was just a slightly redone demo and not a proper full-length. Reverend Bizarre for instance have EPs which are over an hour long, and why?! Because they say something along the lines of "it only has like three real songs, rest is interludes/covers".

I've done some checking and there's the demo tape self-financed by the band. Then they signed to X-Rated which reissued the demo on CD with a new song, and later on the "proper debut" Oracle Moon. So all in all I think it's just a case of interpretation, even more when you read his words in that interview. If you trade "mini-CD" with "EP" the sentence still makes sense. That's my honest opinion.

Either way, you can do one thing to appease your mind. Ask for pictures of other X-Rated matrices and compare font type and size, as well as pressing plants (although that may not prove anything in the end). Check other albums from the label on MA users' collections and PM them. Or in alternative, if any kind soul has an actual X-Rated original CD to post it here... ;)
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XcKyle93
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:32 pm 
 

androdion wrote:
To be honest I think it's a matter of interpretation there. People have by now stated countless times that the demo put to CD format became sort of their debut album. But back then bands would just call that kind of stint an EP (mini-album), because it was just a slightly redone demo and not a proper full-length. Reverend Bizarre for instance have EPs which are over an hour long, and why?! Because they say something along the lines of "it only has like three real songs, rest is interludes/covers".

I've done some checking and there's the demo tape self-financed by the band. Then they signed to X-Rated which reissued the demo on CD with a new song, and later on the "proper debut" Oracle Moon. So all in all I think it's just a case of interpretation, even more when you read his words in that interview. If you trade "mini-CD" with "EP" the sentence still makes sense. That's my honest opinion.

Either way, you can do one thing to appease your mind. Ask for pictures of other X-Rated matrices and compare font type and size, as well as pressing plants (although that may not prove anything in the end). Check other albums from the label on MA users' collections and PM them. Or in alternative, if any kind soul has an actual X-Rated original CD to post it here... ;)


I think you're right; it's a matter of interpretation. I will try to message someone on here just to check though. I'll post here when I get a response.
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narsilianshard wrote:
Chaosmonger wrote:
The Red in the Sky is Ours and select songs off With Fear... is the compositional height of death metal, if not all of metal. Better than ten Super Bowls.


Ah yes, the death metal phenomenon that is the Super Bowl.

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DestruicaoMetalica
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2010 12:54 pm
Posts: 407
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 8:04 am 
 

Hi, I'm back again with another Running Wild question. I bought two CDs from ebay seller "PostalMadness" of Blazon Stone and Death or Glory. The matrix of Blazon Stone, "Sonopress F-1876 / 7962802" appears to be legitimate, but the Death or Glory CD seems a bit odd. Firstly, the matrix is the same as the Catalogue number with an added "01!" at the end (The whole thing is "WK 45495 01!") - is this common with US Noise CDs? What I find to be the more weird thing is that it is the original US press from 1989, but it includes the four bonus tracks featured on the reissue, with no mention of those anywhere but on the CD itself. They look more much legitimate than those boots I posted earlier, but is there any chance that either is a bootleg? I can also scan them in like I did last time if that would help.
Edit: I was just looking at my other Running Wild CDs, and I'm worried that my copy of Gates to Purgatory is a bootleg too. The matrix is "CD 001 = NCD 001 MPO 07 @@@@ 9 05" - There's a picture of the Azintex bootleg that I found but I can't make out it's matrix. Sorry to ask so much, I just love Running Wild and really want to be sure that none of my CDs of theirs are fakes.
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thomasaus wrote:
Front door king's lord declares on the spot that need not again wait Hou the other party, because Thomas Sabo has already left roseate clouds mountain, don't know a Zong.

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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
Posts: 5149
Location: Portugal
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 11:16 am 
 

Running Wild CDs are a bitch when it comes to bootlegs. :(

I'm aware that the Noise US editions have those kind of matrices, with WK followed by the five digit CAT#. Can't vouch for the rest, but it isn't unusual for matrices to have "01" and that kind of stuff. Never knew what it was all about but I've seen it a lot. Now if it features bonus tracks...

Case in point is that Noise CDs floating around nowadays are virtually 99% bootlegs. Either you know you're buying from a trusted seller or it just isn't worth it.
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DigitalDictator
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:41 pm
Posts: 20
Location: Italy
PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:02 am 
 

I could help you only with Gates of Purgatory: post a photo of the matrix and I'll compare it to my original cd ;)

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