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Stabwound
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 6:46 pm
Posts: 194
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 1:51 pm 
 

John_Sunlight wrote:
I don't mind the direction, but that song is still badly written.


Agreed. It's like you can't dislike the song itself without being called out for whining about them not being black metal anymore. That full song feels overly long and disjointed, just meandering around shittily; reminds me of Metallica's Death Magnetic in that way.

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Illuminati322
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:55 pm
Posts: 297
Location: Grand Chute, WI, USA
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:29 pm 
 

For the last several years Darkthrone has been one of the most polarizing bands in metal. I know black metal purists who feel slighted by their stylistic shift, which they liken to that taken by Satyricon post-Rebel Extravaganza and, in death metal, Entombed's Wolverine Blues. But I also know classic metal and metal n' roll (think Motorhead, Tank etc) fans who are all over them (the latter is generally indifferent to the band's origins and early work). As a retro fetishist and a fan of the bands they've lately been influenced by I personally enjoy the new albums but wish they'd reblacken their sound. Like other upcoming new releases (namely those by Slayer and Metallica) I await this rather nervously.

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John_Sunlight
President Satan

Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:41 am
Posts: 4673
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:49 pm 
 

Stabwound wrote:
John_Sunlight wrote:
I don't mind the direction, but that song is still badly written.


Agreed. It's like you can't dislike the song itself without being called out for whining about them not being black metal anymore. That full song feels overly long and disjointed, just meandering around shittily; reminds me of Metallica's Death Magnetic in that way.

Good comparison. Music is technically sound, but completely iffy.
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Acrobat
Eric Olthwaite

Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:53 am
Posts: 6517
Location: Fortress Northallerton, North Yorkshire
PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 5:39 am 
 

Illuminati322 wrote:
As a retro fetishist and a fan of the bands they've lately been influenced by I personally enjoy the new albums but wish they'd reblacken their sound.


I really hope they don't "re-blacken" their sound (not that I think will ever release a black metal album again). I think those early 2000s albums aptly demonstrated that they've said all they have to say in the black metal field. Like, there's nothing wrong with an album like Hate Them but I just can't find much to get excited about, either.
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Illuminati322
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:55 pm
Posts: 297
Location: Grand Chute, WI, USA
PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 9:19 am 
 

ANationalAcrobat wrote:
Illuminati322 wrote:
As a retro fetishist and a fan of the bands they've lately been influenced by I personally enjoy the new albums but wish they'd reblacken their sound.


I really hope they don't "re-blacken" their sound (not that I think will ever release a black metal album again). I think those early 2000s albums aptly demonstrated that they've said all they have to say in the black metal field. Like, there's nothing wrong with an album like Hate Them but I just can't find much to get excited about, either.


Well keep in mind they've been milking the black n' roll thang since '05, so at this point it's nothing new, and it's nothing that will last forever. Given the restlessness of their muse they have to move onto something new eventually, and I'd rather see them return to black metal than dip into 'ambient' or 'noise' experimentation, or some other false path that mistakes pretension for innovation. "Traditional speed metal" was mentioned before; imagine how odd, although strangely predictable given recent mutations, it would be if they became a straight up trad band!

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metaldiscussor666
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:09 pm
Posts: 560
PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 9:55 am 
 

From the small number of tracks I have sampled from their later material, I've come to the conclusion that darkthrone is a band that takes no innovative steps stylistically in creating their music. It's no secret that they meld old school sounds together to create something, that to me is the equivalent of a modern day remake of a classic movie; Sure, the new movie may have a lot of throwbacks and may please some people, but it will never recapture what made the originals so great. If you know what I mean. Bands like agent steel, venom, and bathory have already been through their heydays. So at this point, I kind of feel like I will never be truly interested in any of darkthrone's later thing.
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Ilwhyan
Metel fraek

Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 1:41 pm
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:20 am 
 

That's a really terrible analogy. Remaking an old movie would be equivalent to recording a cover album. Retro is not at all the same thing as a remake.

I don't actually care one iota whether someone's new album is particularly innovative or not. It matters whether it's enjoyable or not.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 12:06 pm 
 

metaldiscussor666 wrote:
From the small number of tracks I have sampled from their later material, I've come to the conclusion that darkthrone is a band that takes no innovative steps stylistically in creating their music. It's no secret that they meld old school sounds together to create something, that to me is the equivalent of a modern day remake of a classic movie; Sure, the new movie may have a lot of throwbacks and may please some people, but it will never recapture what made the originals so great. If you know what I mean. Bands like agent steel, venom, and bathory have already been through their heydays. So at this point, I kind of feel like I will never be truly interested in any of darkthrone's later thing.

:lol: Ah, a "small number of tracks" led you to this conclusion? Maybe you should actually listen to a whole album before you jump to any large conclusions about the sound? Also like Ilwhyan mentioned that's stupid and doesn't apply to later Darkthrone at all.
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John_Sunlight
President Satan

Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:41 am
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 12:58 pm 
 

metaldisCUSSor is on the right track. It's more like a reboot. Like the Star Trek reboot.
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Veracs
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:56 pm
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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 2:51 pm 
 

metaldiscussor666 wrote:
From the small number of tracks I have sampled from their later material, I've come to the conclusion that darkthrone is a band that takes no innovative steps stylistically in creating their music. It's no secret that they meld old school sounds together to create something, that to me is the equivalent of a modern day remake of a classic movie; Sure, the new movie may have a lot of throwbacks and may please some people, but it will never recapture what made the originals so great. If you know what I mean. Bands like agent steel, venom, and bathory have already been through their heydays. So at this point, I kind of feel like I will never be truly interested in any of darkthrone's later thing.


Seems more like a logical progression to me from their shitty punk crap, to a stripped down awful attempt at playing the sounds of their youth. Does it sound like shit yes and will the album absolutely suck more than likely, but haven't they only released one song to promote this monstrosity? Where did you hear another track?
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metaldiscussor666
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:09 pm
Posts: 560
PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:40 pm 
 

Empyreal wrote:
metaldiscussor666 wrote:
From the small number of tracks I have sampled from their later material, I've come to the conclusion that darkthrone is a band that takes no innovative steps stylistically in creating their music. It's no secret that they meld old school sounds together to create something, that to me is the equivalent of a modern day remake of a classic movie; Sure, the new movie may have a lot of throwbacks and may please some people, but it will never recapture what made the originals so great. If you know what I mean. Bands like agent steel, venom, and bathory have already been through their heydays. So at this point, I kind of feel like I will never be truly interested in any of darkthrone's later thing.

:lol: Ah, a "small number of tracks" led you to this conclusion? Maybe you should actually listen to a whole album before you jump to any large conclusions about the sound? Also like Ilwhyan mentioned that's stupid and doesn't apply to later Darkthrone at all.

I don't feel like listening to an entire later darkthrone album. Is listening to several tracks of a certain album sufficient enough to get an idea? Also, I think it doesn't even matter how much of it I listen to, because it's not my JOB to listen to and interpret everything, and say things in the most deepest possible way, pulling up my most heartfelt and reflective opinions. I just don't really care. Haha! Is it still funny to you?
Ilwhyan wrote:
That's a really terrible analogy. Remaking an old movie would be equivalent to recording a cover album. Retro is not at all the same thing as a remake.

I don't actually care one iota whether someone's new album is particularly innovative or not. It matters whether it's enjoyable or not.

Image I see you have an opinion. I have one too ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
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Last edited by metaldiscussor666 on Sun Feb 03, 2013 5:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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metaldiscussor666
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:09 pm
Posts: 560
PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:46 pm 
 

Veracs wrote:
metaldiscussor666 wrote:
From the small number of tracks I have sampled from their later material, I've come to the conclusion that darkthrone is a band that takes no innovative steps stylistically in creating their music. It's no secret that they meld old school sounds together to create something, that to me is the equivalent of a modern day remake of a classic movie; Sure, the new movie may have a lot of throwbacks and may please some people, but it will never recapture what made the originals so great. If you know what I mean. Bands like agent steel, venom, and bathory have already been through their heydays. So at this point, I kind of feel like I will never be truly interested in any of darkthrone's later thing.


Seems more like a logical progression to me from their shitty punk crap, to a stripped down awful attempt at playing the sounds of their youth. Does it sound like shit yes and will the album absolutely suck more than likely, but haven't they only released one song to promote this monstrosity? Where did you hear another track?
I have heard the one song from the upcoming release. The other tracks I was talking about are from their earlier releases such as FOAD and circle the wagons which also didn't do much for me. This is what I meant when I said "later material." My description is based mostly off of the upcoming release though, as I couldn't describe how I felt about the earlier releases without going back and listening to them. That's what I mean when I mention agent steel, is I was referring to the upcoming track.

Honestly, what I think metal needs is not a throwback. Instead I think it needs to take a look at itself and not try to be something that it once was. Instead what I wish I could see in metal is more innovation.

I remember seeing a comment to me in the off topic thread once where some moron was all like "you say new osdm is a rehash, I say it's a homage to something we love." Well opinions aside, I think that kind of mentality as bad for music. Why keep recreating the same sound over and over again? The thing that made those sounds great in the first place is that they were innovative! So the idea should be, whether or not you want to become great (which doesn't matter) you should try to be creative. No creativity, besides creating copies of things that already happened = not interesting to me.
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Ilwhyan
Metel fraek

Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 1:41 pm
Posts: 6358
Location: Finland
PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2013 6:12 pm 
 

metaldiscussor666 wrote:
...

Clearly you're an even bigger jackass than before. To the ignore list it is.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
Posts: 18742
Location: Where the dead rule the night
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:05 am 
 

metaldiscussor666 wrote:

Honestly, what I think metal needs is not a throwback. Instead I think it needs to take a look at itself and not try to be something that it once was. Instead what I wish I could see in metal is more innovation.

I remember seeing a comment to me in the off topic thread once where some moron was all like "you say new osdm is a rehash, I say it's a homage to something we love." Well opinions aside, I think that kind of mentality as bad for music. Why keep recreating the same sound over and over again? The thing that made those sounds great in the first place is that they were innovative! So the idea should be, whether or not you want to become great (which doesn't matter) you should try to be creative. No creativity, besides creating copies of things that already happened = not interesting to me.


All that matters is good songwriting. People who debate this are idiots.
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John_Sunlight
President Satan

Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:41 am
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:06 am 
 

All that matters? Guess I'm an idiot, but I think form counts for something.
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Metantoine
The XVI, dominar to over 258714 subjects

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
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Location: Québec
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:11 am 
 

You're not really better than MD666 by saying that, Empy.
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Xlxlx
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Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:16 pm
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Location: Argentina
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:11 am 
 

Empyreal wrote:
All that matters is good songwriting. People who debate this are idiots.

I wouldn't say it's all that matters, but it's definitely the main thing. Songwriting comes first, sure, but having a fitting production and good musicians (among other things) helps a lot.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:13 am 
 

I just don't think it really matters about innovation or staying true to roots or whatever. If you can write good songs that's really about it, for me at least.

Xlxlx, well yeah sure, but I can overlook those other things in some cases - not dealbreakers, ya know.
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Xlxlx
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:18 am 
 

Empyreal wrote:
I just don't think it really matters about innovation or staying true to roots or whatever. If you can write good songs that's really about it, for me at least.

This I completely agree with. I think you should've worded it that way the first time around, Emp.
Empyreal wrote:
Xlxlx, well yeah sure, but I can overlook those other things in some cases - not dealbreakers, ya know.

They certainly aren't definitive traits to decide whether an album is good or not, but if great songwriting is paired up with an atrocious mixing/production values, unimpressive musicianship and/or embarrassing aesthetics..... Well, that'll certainly hurt the compositions.
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Metantoine
The XVI, dominar to over 258714 subjects

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
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Location: Québec
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:19 am 
 

Yep, instead of calling everyone who disagree with you "idiots". I share your views by the way.

Oh sorry, for the MD666 comparison, this was low.
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John_Sunlight
President Satan

Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:41 am
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:21 am 
 

Songwriting and presentation reinforce each other. They are both integral, so to consider one as the superior is incorrect. One may be more important in certain circumstances while the other is more important in others, but this does not confuse the point that they are joined.
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Stabwound
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 6:46 pm
Posts: 194
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 6:07 pm 
 

So this finally leaked. I'm not really sure what to make of it, you can't really categorize it in any particular genre, and it certainly doesn't sound like their previous albums. A lot of it sounds like they sat down and said "let's write and record songs that sound like they came from the 80's" but for some reason it doesn't come across as insincere. After listening to it once, my favorite song is Lesser Men, which sounds closest to the old Darkthrone sound. I guess the album is better than Leave No Cross Unturned lead me to believe it would be, but I still think the clean vocals sound goofy.

I think they wore out their punkish sound so it's good that they're doing something new.

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Razakel
Nekroprince

Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:36 pm
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:10 pm 
 

The album gets BETTER than Leave No Cross Unturned, you say? Holy shit balls, I really need to get the fuck home from work.

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Metantoine
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Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
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Location: Québec
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:28 pm 
 

Album of the year. Album of the decade.
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Xlxlx
May contain traces of nuts

Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:16 pm
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Location: Argentina
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:33 pm 
 

I am soooooooooooo buying this thing.
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shouvince
Veteran

Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2005 9:11 am
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:44 pm 
 

I can hear Metantoine furiously typing out a review as we speak :) Those samples sounded really promising so it's a no-brainer that I'm getting this as well! Will post my preliminary thoughts in a couple of hours.

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tomcat_ha
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Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 8:05 am
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:58 pm 
 

based on no cross unturned it seems like they wanted to sound like every true 80s metal album.

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Subrick
Metal freak

Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2010 7:27 pm
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:35 pm 
 

I'm gonna listen to it tonight after the WWE show ends. Might review it depending on my reaction to it.
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Kveldulfr
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:46 pm 
 

I don't like it that much but it's good to see them trying something different. The punk albums sucked so hard. My only grip with late Darkthrone is how disjointed sounds compared to the time when they actually wrote songs together and reharsed them.
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Mysticaloldbard
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:07 pm 
 

Shoot, I was going to wait until the record comes in the mail, but this is too tempting.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 12:06 am 
 

I've had my fill of being moral with the new Stratovarius album - I'm checking this shit out now!
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Zelkiiro
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 12:09 am 
 

Same here. Off I goooo~
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 1:22 am 
 

I'm not loving this. It sounds OK, and I even think it could grow on me - hopefully it does. But while the riffs are solid and the songs are pulpy and old school to the max, this just doesn't sound as fun as the last four albums have. The production sounds way worse than Circle the Wagons and the songs aren't as catchy or unique. I have no doubt they didn't care about doing anything but aping their 80s heroes, but for the first time a Darkthrone album just makes me want to go turn on an Omen or Venom album instead of actually listening to the Darkthrone album.

We'll see if it grows on me though...maybe.
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Metantoine
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 1:31 am 
 

Empy doesn't like it, so you know it's good!

Quote:
The production sounds way worse than Circle the Wagons
NO WAY, the vocals are much better here and so is everything else, I also should check it out again (when I'll be able to have a clear mind about the album, it really kicked my ass) but the production is something I enjoyed about the album and it really features the best vocals of Modernerathrone.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 1:47 am 
 

The vocals were great except for the first song - they were pretty crappy on that one. And I dunno man, there weren't any songs that lept out at me like "Stylized Corpse" or "These Shores Are Damned."
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Xlxlx
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 2:06 am 
 

Actually Emp, Tony is right about the production; it's pretty strong. It has kind of a dry yet very powerful sound, which brings to mind the aesthetics seen in the album's artwork. Actually, this is what I imagine Manilla Road would sound like with a somewhat higher budget (not to say that their production works are bad, though). As for the music itself..... It's pretty cool, but it doesn't blow my mind. Yet. I expect it to grow on me with further listens, to be honest, and I still plan on buying it :-D
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LlamaTrainer
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 3:23 am 
 

I'm a bit disappointed, from the first listen only Valkyrie and Leave No Cross Unturned really struck me as great songs (ESPECIALLY Valkyrie!). Granted, it took quite a few listens before Circle the Wagons started to grow on me, so I'll have to give this album some time.
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lord_ghengis
Metal freak

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:39 am 
 

It's certainly a good album, but I'm thinking it won't be getting into my end of year list. I love the production, the energy, and even the goofy shitty vocals, my main gripe is that the riff count seems a bit too low. Much of this album is fast speed metal type stuff, and they're pretty damn good at it, most of the riffs here are somewhere between solid and awesome, with a few (the one 4:40 into "Come Warfare, the Entire Doom", all of the fast riffs in "Leave No Cross Unturned") totally killer ones, but I find that they're spread a bit thin. Tracks like "Dead Early", "The Ones You Left" and "Valkyrie" seem to be propped up by two or three riffs, and then drag them out to four or five minutes where two to three and a half would have sufficed, given their tempo. Either less duration or more riffs would have helped make the songs feel more dynamic, Although "Lesser Men" gets through it's four and a half minutes without dragging since the tempo is slower and single riff sections don't feel so repetitive. As it stands, Leave No Cross is clearly the best track here, it also over stays its welcome a little, with the second slow section being rather superfluous, and is the only time the transition really sounds sloppy, an 11 minute Fast-Slow-Fast song would have been suitably epic, the added three minutes of slow just doesn't stick. Still it's catchy as fuck and I'll be going around humming "Leave. No. Cross. LEAVE NO CROSS UNTURNED" under my breathe for at least the next three days, and it's the stand out. That speed change in Come Warfare mentioned earlier makes it another great song overall, as is the slower Lesser Men.
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reven
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:14 am 
 

I freaking love every second of this, the only song that maybe falls a bit short than the rest is The Ones You Left Behind, but even that one has one kicking riff section I love.

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Chaosmonger
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Apr 29, 2006 5:59 pm
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:23 am 
 

Kveldulfr wrote:
I don't like it that much but it's good to see them trying something different. The punk albums sucked so hard. My only grip with late Darkthrone is how disjointed sounds compared to the time when they actually wrote songs together and reharsed them.


The last album they wrote together as a group was A Blaze in the Northern Sky.

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