Which was better? I personally like them both equally, but I feel that bm behemoth was under rated. Their first album, Svetavith, had some of the best bm/ pagan bm songs from that time in my opinion. At the same time, they have one of the most intense sounds of the blackened death metal scene. So what are your opinions on the two eras of the band?

When you say blackened death behemoth I take more from their Thema 6 and Santanica albums cause I feel once they went further they were just a death metal band.

Those two are my favorite out of all their albums so I guess that would make me a fan for that era.

I have Grom and it's a good record. It's pretty ambitious while not being too far-fetched or revolutionary for its time. There are a lot of good ideas and some not so good ones littered here and there. The cleanly sung male vocals in "The Dark Forest" are plain bad. It's really the only example I can think of, I never listen to this album. It's lacking a certain something; it doesn't have the identity of later Behemoth releases. Also, the production is too fuzz-laden and the guitar tone sounds fake, for lack of a better word. That said, there's an indescribable pagan feeling about the album. The riffing is solid, folky black metal, akin to early Satyricon.

Grom comes off as a melange of good, but scatter-brained material as compared to the tightness and decidedness of Behemoth's blackened death metal. There's so much control over songwriting, especially in Demigod and Evangelion. Although their productions are crystal-clear and sterile, I still get a lot of atmosphere from the intensity and execution, which I prefer to the campy atmosphere of Grom.

I have a few holes in my Behemoth discography that need filling, so I can't give a complete comparison. And for what it's worth, I liked Zos Kia Cultus when I first got it, but nowadays I just find it boring and like Grom, never listen to it.

I'm a fan of everything Behemoth has done from "The Return of the Northern Moon" onwards. The early stuff is damn great even though I do prefer them as a death metal band. As was said before "Grom" is a little overambitious but some of the moments where their aspirations exceed their resources are the most memorable.

Personally I prefer "Demigod" and "Zos Kia Cultus" of their ridiculously badass discography but I definitely enjoy the old stuff.

Also I think it's fucking awesome that they still dust off some ancient stuff for live performances:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCatslGrjNM

The early stuff. Their death metal is 5/10 material max.

And the Forests dream eternally is a neat little EP I liked their demo from the Pagan Vastlands, I've heard some of Storming the Baltic and it was decent though I prefer the rawer efforts of early Graveland and Infernum. Their death metal material gets more spins from be on account of Demigod and Zos Kias cultus just being massive albums

Old Behemoth is far better than their stale, over produced new material. Their BM albums had tons of passion and emotion. It oozed out of the speakers effortlessly. You need not go further than Transilvanian Forest to hear what I'm talking about. That song crushes anything from Satanica onward.

Modern Behemoth is best Behemoth. One of the best dm bands going. Evangelion is a classic.

I prefer their more recent material, but I do love their black metal material as well. Zos Kia Cultus and Demigod are probably my favorite albums by the group.

+1.

I like mostly everything they've released, but Zos Kia Cultus is a true behemoth of an album, mixing the best both black and death elements. Satanica and Thelema 6 are huge albums too.

All their era's are a derivative of some other bands, but I prefer their black metal stuff the most.

I personally think Sventevith is one of the best black metal albums ever made. The rest of their black metal stuff is pretty hit and miss. And the Forests Dream Eternally is decent but just doesn't feel as well thought at as Sventevith. Grom is solid but nothing brilliant. I think they picked up with Pandemonic Incantations which is a great album, then went down hill as they moved more and more into death metal. Really the only album I listen to very often from their death metal era is Demigod. It might be the flat production but the last couple haven't done anything for me, they just sound kind of... flat.

Black Metal Behemoth. I have tried the later death metal era but it crashes for me with the sound production and drum triggers. Can't stand them.

Their early black metal stuff is pretty good. I think their best stuff is anywhere between Pandemonic Incantations to Demigod. The apostasy was alright and evangelion were still decent though. Behemoth is one of those rare bands that successfully modify their sound over time yet still produce awesome album after awesome album.

This thread reminds me I've been meaning to check out Behemoths BM-material for a while. I only have Satanica, Zos Kia Cultus, Demigod and Evangelion on CD but I like them all, especially Satanica.

I like pretty much everything by Behemoth. Of their black metal stuff, Grom is my favorite. That title track is just killer. Of their later, death metal stuff, either The Apostasy or Evangelion.

Demonica is one of the best compilations ever released.

EP and debut LP are solid too.

The only Behemoth album I consistently listen to is Satanica. On this album they're not trying to "be" anything, other than Behemoth.

I really like Grom and the demo which has some of my favourite Behemoth songs. The debut album was great too but I didnt like the production.

The black/death albums of Behemoth contain some great songs but I dont enjoy the albums so much, for example Satanic, is a great record but I dont listen to the full album quite usually, I only chek the few songs I really like. I prefer his 100% death metal era with albums like Demigod or my favourite record, The Apostasy.

So the black metal era wins, closely followed by the death metal era, sorry black-death era, you loose.

I think probably you'd be better off treating them as two separate bands, each with their own fan base. There is definitely a split between their earlier black metal efforts and their current blackened death sound. I don't think it's a case of musical evolution either. If you listen to their albums one after the other, there's no transition. Starting with Pandemonic Incantations, they just ain't black metal anymore. Some people liked the change, some didn't.

It's not unique to Behemoth by any means. You can throw out the earlier/later question about practically any band with a well known discography, and you will get people in one camp claiming that the first demo was really amazing and it was all downhill from there, and people in the other camp claiming that the last release was the best yet. In the middle there are people who just like the band and don't care one way or the other, and only pop up when people say patently crazy things like Demigod is death metal.

But Demigod is death metal!

I don't have much love for the pre-Satanica releases, although I recognize they have musical value and are good albums. The same can be said for the post-Demigod albums, and to a certain point Demigod itself. With that being said the only Behemoth period I really enjoy is their black/death era, from Satanica to ZKC, although I still derive some mild enjoyment from Demigod.

The old BM stuff is great if you need a Polish BM fix and you're tired of spinning the usual Graveland/Infernum/etc. I think the later stuff is very generic and uninteresting but the band kills live no matter what is being played. That and the fact that Nergal is such a cool guy make Behemoth one of the few "big" DM acts I won't talk shit about all day.

what, no Zos Kia Cultus?

I'm surprised Pandemonic Incantations always seems to fall by the wayside, though I suppose it's really the most transitional of Behemoth albums (though it probably leans a little more toward black metal IMO.) It was the first Behemoth album I bought and I still think it's a great album; sort of a black metal base with sharper production and vocals halfway between BM and DM. The riffing and drumming are a little chaotic to the point of sounding muddled at times, but that just contributes to the frenzied atmosphere. And I love all the occasional atmospheric touches with the keyboards including the deliciously cheesy intro (DOMINUS SATHANAS DOMINUS!) - Probably the last time the band had any kind of extensive keyboard use.

Hell, even the outro song is awesome; as obnoxious as hearing "HAIL! HAIL!" over cheap string synths should be, it just contributes to the bizarre ritual atmosphere so well.

Old Behemot was better , good pegan black metal band.They play nice , powerful melodic music . My favourite song is "Moonspell Rites". Now the are very commercial band . They can play 50 concerts in year , really !

Black Metal Behemoth gets my vote, no contest.

Behemoth are, and always have been a band I have the upmost respect for... One of the Best Black Metal bands and now (regretfully) one of the best Death Metal bands...

Everything upto and including Sventevith, I love... Grom is 50/50 and everything since has not been to my taste... but I'm glad they've "made it" and have been so successful with their Death Metal even tho I don't enjoy listening to it... it was a trasition made for all the right reasons on Nergal's behalf and I don't think his principles have wavered through their success... The music has totally changed but he seems to be the same person...

This post actually got me to listen to that album. It's excellent. It's such a different style compared to both eras of the band that it really makes it stand out to me among their discography.

Also, I don't really understand the blackened death metal label as it pertains to Behemoth. I see that most people in this thread just call the later material death metal without the blackened label thrown in there too. What elements of black metal are there really? The atmosphere? Maybe, but I don't think that it's something seperate from death metal necessarily. And the vocal stylings of Nergal are a little odd for death metal, but they are far from black metal.

I recommend listening to Pandemonic Incantations. That right there is their most blackened death metal release, probably a little bit more black than death as Smoking_Gnu said.

so you're saying you don't hear the black metal influence in songs like Ov Fire and the Void or Decade of Therion? It's definitely there. Their later stuff, post-Demigod is less black metal influenced, but it's still somewhat there if you really listen for it.

You can like or dislike albums like Demigod or The Apostasy, but they are far from being generic death metal. Both are great albums but my favourite one is The Apostasy with this unbeatable mixture of DM and epic arrangements. Demigod has only one flaw, the production of the vocals, they sound so overproduced and weird...

The 'blackened' label may just come from the subject matter of the lyrics. I don't know, I just call them death metal anyways. As for the vocal stylings, I'd have to agree, they are odd, although I think they got a lot better on the latest. I think the vocals are probably my least favorite aspect of Behemoth's music. It just sounds as though Nergal's voice is overly strained, like it doesn't flow naturally, which I feel like is perhaps mainly due to the syllable-cramming lyrical content.

As for the topic of the thread, I like newer Behemoth.

I like both the eras of Behemoth, I really love their black metal era however find myself listening to the death metal albums more as my partner prefers their death metal stuff.

Live they are one of the best bands around I think, the vocal attacks between Nergal, Orion and Seth are incredible, Orion's deeper vocals are brilliant!

My favourite albums of theirs are probably Grom and Zos Kia Cultus. Regarding Demigod, I definitely agree about the production on the vocals, I believe I read once that there are 8 layers of vocals recorded for the album.

I think they got better once they introduced the death metal influence, their old black metal stuff isn't that great, theres a hell of a lot of other bands from the same era (and earlier) with the same sound doing it way better, but I reckon by Satanica they started to get really interesting.

Agreed with syx on their live performance being incredible. The tri- vocal attack is deadly. Personally I also enjoy all eras but i find more depth in the black metal releases overall, superficially the death metal albums are more " fun" and î tend to pull those out more for light listening.

I'll take Demigod or Evangelion over their early stuff any day, personally. Zos Kia Cultus and Satanica are also quite solid. Not to say that Sventevith and Grom weren't great, but Behemoth really improved with time and there are plenty of other seminal BM records from that era to focus on. Demigod was one of my first experiences with the genre, and it has remained my favorite even after hearing or purchasing their other material.

I loved the raw production and sound on their early black metal albums, but as is the case with most black metal found their song structures overly linear and repetitive. Their newer material is far too polished for my tastes, not to mention compositionally sluggish. As for their stylistic shift, I don't see how it represented any kind of artistic progression, only change (and I find "blackened death metal" a bit of a nebulous concept to boot.)