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Erotetic
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2010 8:05 pm
Posts: 929
Location: New Zealand
PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 6:47 am 
 

Zelkiiro wrote:
Even if you want to say rock isn't dead, it sure as hell hasn't been relevant for nearly 50 years.

No, I don't consider metal to be part of rock. And neither should you.


given that MetalArchives is so diligent as to keep numetal off the archives, how do you account for the presence of a myriad of genres of Rock on the archives if there's no relation?
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Erotetic
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2010 8:05 pm
Posts: 929
Location: New Zealand
PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 6:56 am 
 

MetalMaidenMal wrote:
Can you imagine Taylor Swift or Ke$ha still filling stadiums when they're in they're 60s? I doubt it. But guess who's still going? Aerosmith. AC/DC. Megadeth. Motley Crue. Rush. Motorhead. The list goes on. I've never heard someone say they were really into Iron Maiden for a week and then got over it. These are the bands that have staying power.


those guys, though, come from an era where people looked forward to albums, went to stores and paid for albums, went home and listened to albums, read liner notes and learned lyrics.

even if all things were equal (fond of equally "good" music), I'd be willing to bet that 'kids today' (skimming through youtube, downloading rars, 'deleting' songs they don't like, building their own libraries instead of cherished perfect mixtapes, etc.) just wouldn't have the same appreciation for it. there's way too much to hear to care about the little mediocre filler songs on some album and replay it over and over again while there is another 20 bands from 10 other nations putting out the same kind of music.
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MetalMaidenMal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:31 am
Posts: 29
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 7:48 am 
 

Erotetic wrote:
.
those guys, though, come from an era where people looked forward to albums, went to stores and paid for albums, went home and listened to albums, read liner notes and learned lyrics.


People like that still exist, although fewer of them. I was born in '91, so those guys are before my time, but I still look forward to albums, pay for CDs (and even vinyl), read liner notes and learn lyrics. So do plenty of other people. A comparatively small group, yes, but a loyal group. That keeps the music alive, whether it's on the radio and the average teenager appreciates it or not. Plus the internet makes it easier for fans to interact with each other and with the bands, and for bands to self-promote and distribute their music.

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the_raytownian
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 1:09 am
Posts: 2318
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 8:19 am 
 

MetalMaidenMal wrote:
People like that still exist, although fewer of them. I was born in '91, so those guys are before my time...



wut.

I was born in 88 (not a big difference in age)... I didn't even start really getting into music until the late 90's, but I (and everyone) still "got into" their new tapes/CD's, looking at the inserts and reading the lyrics/info... and I think it's only changed for me in recent years because I've since turned into a dumb collector who can't stand getting fingerprints on stuff, or playing records/tapes without a perfectly maintained turntable/deck... so I hesitate to mess with booklets and stuff (I die a little every time I see a brand new, clean booklet I've left a seemingly uncleanable oily fingerprint on--I have considered wearing gloves for this shit, and kick myself for all the times I haven't! TURN THE PAGE, WASH YOUR HANDS...).

It's just a normal thing to do with a packaged items. Purchasing digital music didn't become a really common thing until about 5 years ago.
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MetalMaidenMal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:31 am
Posts: 29
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 7:55 pm 
 

Okay, I know it's not like I was born into the world of digital music. I remember cassettes. But the point is you and I are both fairly young people who are still doing what most people of our generation no longer bother with, and I think that indicates that it's a matter of personal taste that won't go away entirely. There will always still be some percentage of the population that continue to buy records, learn all about their favorite bands, and be passionate about music instead of just downloading a few of the most popular songs on iTunes, and that means there will always be people who still know and love the old sounds.

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the_raytownian
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 1:09 am
Posts: 2318
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 9:31 pm 
 

I see what you're saying.

To be honest, though, I think most people who weren't big music fans either simply listened to/dubbed off of the radio, or didn't listen to much music at all before buying mp3's became common. I think the only difference now is sometimes playing your favorite songs is a little more convenient for casual music listeners. I believe that a lot of people still prefer the physical product, if only for the sake of having a hardcopy, due to the volatile nature of information stored on a hard drive.

BTW, I never actually stopped using cassettes. I'm kind of happy they are making a "comeback", regardless of how short-lived and faddish it might be, because they are usually cheaper, and I probably have more tapes than I do CD's and records combined (though a lot of them are either just home dubs or random crap I got to dub over/harvest samples from).

If it ain't broke...
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BottomFeeder1
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Oct 23, 2009 7:09 am
Posts: 342
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:52 am 
 

No, it's not dead but radio djs need to grow a pair of balls and start seeking new bands and playing some b-sides instead of trying to sound like some half assed rebel cool guy chumps."rockers" writing for radio safe play miss the mark and thats a trap that wipes out the relevance of majority of the potential note worthy honest rock bands.

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inhumanist
Metal freak

Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:09 pm
Posts: 4632
Location: 50 Forts Along the Rhine
PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 7:52 am 
 

Erotetic wrote:
Zelkiiro wrote:
[not a] part of

no relation
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ACM
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 6:55 pm
Posts: 1269
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:29 am 
 

Rock has been called "dead" for at least the past 40 years. I never understood why anybody would care. 20 years ago it was they took off Headbangers Ball, and bands like Nirvana are destroying music. 30 years ago it was bands like Air Supply were ruining music. 40 years ago people were saying people like T-Rex and Bowie were killing rock. Who cares? Listen to the music you like, go to shows, and support the bands you like. When I got the first Maiden album very few people had heard of it. It was a great feeling to not only have something few knew about, but to be able to share something with others that few knew about. Rock has been called "dead" for 40 years, maybe even longer. It never died, and it never will. People will claim it is dead, but the ones claiming rock is dead were never really fans in the first place.

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lancasterdrummer
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 8:13 pm
Posts: 38
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 9:16 pm 
 

As long as there is a younger generation wanting to give the finger to the older generations, there will be a place for rock music.

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Zelkiiro
Pounding the world with a fish of steel

Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 5:30 pm
Posts: 4130
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 12:00 pm 
 

ACM wrote:
but the ones claiming rock is dead were never really fans in the first place.

Or at least not fans of the dry, dull, lifeless rock that The Beatles revolutionized. The very same dry, dull, lifeless rock that the pre-metal artists of the late 60s were trying their damnedest to split away from.
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ScratchMyBack
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:04 am
Posts: 1077
Location: Malaysia
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 4:37 am 
 

Well, Nas did claim that Hip-Hop was dead a few years back I still do see a lot of rap groups appearing with Political themed lyrics and rhymes that does not involve stupid lines like in a Far East Movement song.

It's just that mainstream music got shittier and shittier by the minute. Every genre still has their own flagbearers in the underground or what ever space in the music world is there. Tarantino still got John Legend to do a kick ass for his movie. Last week I heard a band jamming to their rock tunes that could easily rival Hellacopters. No, rock is not dead. Radio sucks ass nowadays.

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TheMizwaOfMuzzyTah
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 2:18 pm
Posts: 1259
Location: Abyss of Hallucinations
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:35 am 
 

You know, I think I figured it out. We're dead. Everything else is still alive and kicking: rock and roll, pickled fish, hip-hop, Surge, all of it. It is just us. We are all dead. WOOHOO!!

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innocent3
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:34 pm
Posts: 6
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 3:07 pm 
 

The SHM wrote:
Adriankat wrote:
^ I cringed a little reading this post. You'd have to be pretty obnoxious to other people to get them to say things like that to you. I never experienced anything like that (real life or online gaming) and I'm pretty open about my taste.


Actually, when I just started a new school and passingly told someone that I listened to 'old school rock', I immediately got called lame and that I don't have any musical taste, and when I said I loved 'heavy metal'- "Do you need help? Do you fucking need help?" And they were serious- they thought I was going to kill myself.
And when I do meet a metal head-
"this bland grindcore band or that bland grindcore band?"
"No, more like (this bland doom metal band)."
"You suck. That's not metal."
"I also like Judas Priest. Ever heard Painkiller?"
"They ain't metal either. They're pussy metal. They don't scream, they're gay-ass metal."

Unless you meant that the others were obnoxious, I have to disagree with you. When you're slightly open about musical preferences, it does become a tad obvious what the trends are.
That's why I never talk. Usually, I say things that wind up getting people pissed off. (Oh, I like this movie! "Why?!? That movie sucks!!!" *Cue 20 minutes of movie discussion.*)
I might need to move.


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They will come in handy, may they serve you well.

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Via_Nocturna
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat May 04, 2013 11:30 am
Posts: 33
Location: Sweden
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2013 11:54 am 
 

Considering how Mick Jagger - one of few remaining veterans/dinosaurs of Rock Music - whores himself out with https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjIwmJMqrco I'd say yeah. The integrity is gone, with the remaining artists selling out for easy money and exposure and what have you. Slash collaborating with Black Eyed Peas comes to mind too.

There's probably Rock Revivalists out there (as a response to the claim that "Rock is Dead") but I haven't searched for hem yet...

When it comes to Rock, I still hold on to Led Zeppelin and disregard the rest.

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ChaosGoatKills
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2011 11:38 pm
Posts: 84
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2013 2:14 pm 
 

the_raytownian wrote:
No offense, dudelette, but all I think of when reading the OP is:

Quote:
YOU SAY JUSTIN BIEBER, I SCREAM METALLICUUUUUHHHH!

92% of teens have turned to pop and hip-hop.If you are part of the 8% that still listens to real music, copy and paste this message to 5 other videos. DON'T LET THE SPIRIT OF ROCK AND ROLL DIE!!!!!!!


It's a ridiculous question and a really trivial concern.

So, no, I don't think it's "dead"... I also think refusing to diversify your interests (like every high school-aged stoner who's just discovered "Classic Rock" and now considers himself an ultimate authority on "REAL music") is as bad as being "one of those people" only listening to what is spoon-fed to them on the radio, or otherwise only following musical fads to seem "cool".

FYI, classic/"retro" rock was "cool" and "trendy" once. Look no further than Wolf-fucking-mother... uuuuuugh.

They have radio stations for people like that. It's called Classic Rock Radio, and its played in just about every workplace I've been employed at because its generally accepted as music everyone likes. Kids who listen to rap and pop, rednecks who listen to country and of course your run of the mill old guys all dig classic rock, at least in my experience. I'm the only one who's apparently sick of Tom Petty and Journey.

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John_Sunlight
President Satan

Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:41 am
Posts: 4748
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2013 6:07 pm 
 

Rock is dead. The mantle of popular music has been taken by other genres. Did you think rock would be the default forever?
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TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 615
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2013 6:20 pm 
 

In the mainstream, it probably is dying sort of (and I don't think anyone who genuinely likes any form of rock gives a damn). Overall - no it isn't, and it's not going to die anytime soon, it keeps expanding and growing.
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The SHM
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:54 pm
Posts: 134
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2013 9:59 pm 
 

Rock isn't dead just because it's not the number one genre. Classical isn't dead, nor is big band music. When I see "Rock is Dead", I hear Marilyn Manson.
*Reads back over previous comments* What the hell was I talking about? None of that ever happened.
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92% of teens have cleanly divided themselves according to genres. If you're part of the 8% that doesn't give a shit why others listen to their music, then I don't care. Just enjoy the damn music.

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Hellrisen
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:48 pm
Posts: 542
Location: thE ocEAN
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 12:13 pm 
 

Rock is dead (or might as well be). Think about it. Bands like Led Zeppelin, The Doors, Jimi Hendrix, Aerosmith, Van Halen, etc. all did their own thing 35/45 years ago. I just don't see any more point in that style of music being made today though. It would most likely just be derivative of those bands mentioned or others. And those bands really rocked anyway, so what's the use on trying to play similar music to them?

Anyways, most people nowadays want all their music to be made by computers I guess. I really hate that shit. I say this because it directly correlates with modern rap. Most of the rap out nowadays doesn't even feature many samples. Shit is all computers. They're taking over the world.
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TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 615
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 12:28 pm 
 

^ I think we're not talking only classic rock, rock as a whole is an absolutely massive genre.
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Exigence
Age: 29 (Wait, what?!)

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:42 pm
Posts: 951
Location: New Orleans
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 3:12 pm 
 

I'm 27. All I know is you can't whitewash entire social trends as 'dead'. In the age of the internet and an unlimited access to anything - nothing is truly dead. I can check Blabbermouth and skim past a 'press release' from a reunited thrash band that should've been forgotten about 18 years ago.

More to the point, all these folk revival acts that surf by as 'indie' rock don't make sense when you think that teenagers would have to be finding bluegrass music to listen to. In order to get inspired. That would've never happened before the internet. Now a kid in Portland, Los Angeles, Miami, Boston, etc. can wikipedia/amazon/youtube/torrent all this random old folk shit and emulate it in their next band.

Then on the flipside, electronic-based music continues to evolve and get more irritating to my ears. Which is funny because if you asked people 30 years ago what music would sound like, they'd probably describe computery, mechanical beats ala dubstep. That sort of became a self-fulfilling prophecy.

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The SHM
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:54 pm
Posts: 134
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 3:59 pm 
 

What is it with dubstep anyway?
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You say "Justin Bieber", I say... OK. So?
92% of teens have cleanly divided themselves according to genres. If you're part of the 8% that doesn't give a shit why others listen to their music, then I don't care. Just enjoy the damn music.

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John_Sunlight
President Satan

Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:41 am
Posts: 4748
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 5:25 pm 
 

The SHM wrote:
Rock isn't dead just because it's not the number one genre. Classical isn't dead, nor is big band music.

Right, that's what "rock is dead" means. It's not the default form of popular music anymore.
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hells_unicorn
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:32 pm
Posts: 2253
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 6:03 pm 
 

If a genre being dead is defined by it being the first go-to genre for the masses, rock music pretty well folded its tents at some point in the 1970s. If you include pop/punk and grunge, it had a slight resurgence in the early to mid 90s. I don't consider metal itself to be rock, though I do accept that certain metal bands still retain some of the rock roots that spawned them in the late 70s.

As far as people yelling in my face that rock is dead, I graduated high school in 1998 and rarely socialized with anyone outside of an inner circle of friends who listen to what I listen to. Personally I couldn't care less how many albums Darkthrone or even Helloween sells in comparison to the latest fad. As long as the bands I listen to can make ends meet and continue putting out albums, I will endeavor to continue not giving a shit. Then again, I don't plan on subjecting my kids to public school so there will be a couple generations of reclusive, cynical types with my DNA with a similar inclination to not seek social acceptance by going with whatever art/cinema/music is the flavor of the moment.
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Grave_Wyrm
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 5:55 pm
Posts: 2225
Location: At the bottom of the lake
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 7:02 pm 
 

the_raytownian wrote:
Pickled Fish's Not Dead.

Hazelnut-dusted roasted dill and lemon trout is trending at my house.

edit: Also, it will be hard to believe rock is dead while Springsteen still walks the earth.
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JT Rager
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:44 am
Posts: 120
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 8:55 pm 
 

I really struggle to think of a 2000s rock band that's going to be regarded as a "classic" as compared to any other decade before it. Biggest rock (including alt rock ) groups in the 2000s were probably Radiohead, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Muse, and Nickelback. Nickelback's not going to be a classic for obvious reasons. Radiohead and RHCP hardly count, they got big in the 90s. That leaves probably Muse, and as good as they are they probably aren't going to be regarded as "classics" the same way that Nirvana, RHCP, and Radiohead are. Lots of great non-mainstream alternative rock from the 2000s, but it's not in the same position it has been in the past.

Of course, if rock is dead because it's not the #1 genre, then metal has been dead for over 20 years.
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John_Sunlight
President Satan

Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:41 am
Posts: 4748
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 10:38 pm 
 

Grave_Wyrm wrote:
the_raytownian wrote:
Pickled Fish's Not Dead.

Hazelnut-dusted roasted dill and lemon trout is trending at my house.

edit: Also, it will be hard to believe rock is dead while Springsteen still walks the earth.

If a literal zombie roaming the earth isn't proof enough, then I don't know how to convince you.
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Grave_Wyrm
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2012 5:55 pm
Posts: 2225
Location: At the bottom of the lake
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 2:21 am 
 

:) Is rock undead?
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Scorntyrant
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 5:55 am
Posts: 1117
PostPosted: Sun May 19, 2013 2:52 am 
 

all I can say is Hey hey, my my....

:p
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somefella
Veteran

Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:57 pm
Posts: 2662
Location: Singapore
PostPosted: Sun May 19, 2013 5:08 am 
 

Erotetic wrote:
Scorntyrant wrote:
For sure. Nobody under 25 allowed on the internet. :P


even that's generous.
anyone over 25 who still can't use their/there/they're properly needs to be terminated.


Fucking yes. Locked in a cell of 600 criminally insane rapists and no lube in the facility.
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Dux_Saxoniae
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 6:56 am
Posts: 102
PostPosted: Sun May 19, 2013 7:21 pm 
 

John_Sunlight wrote:
Right, that's what "rock is dead" means. It's not the default form of popular music anymore.

This. And in that sense, rock has been 'dead' for a good long time, arguably since the decline of 70s rock. (It was revived by grunge, but then only briefly as a backlash against '80s pop metal which was, well, pop.) Other forms of music have begun sharing that place, but I don't think any type of music has become quite as much of a cultural leader as rock once was.

But of course innovative, quality new rock music is appearing all the time even if we exclude metal. Some of it can break into the mainstream (The Black Keys), but most is marketed to a collector demographic. Some of my favourite rock artists in recent years have included The Gaslight Anthem, and a couple of acts that go the roots rock/Southern rock route (Ryan Bingham, Drive-By Truckers, Blackberry Smoke).

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baron samedi
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 11:26 pm
Posts: 56
Location: Kyoto, Japan
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 4:42 am 
 

Poisonfume wrote:
ralfikk123 wrote:
SHM, are you 15?


I hate it when people do this on forums. There should be a rule.

Why? because you're 15?

It happened to me plenty when I started posting on forums when I WAS 15, and I would be like Nuh uh I'm 16 and then everyone would bwahahaha everything you say is stupid and you'll realize that when you grow up.

Then I grew up, and I realize that everything I said WAS stupid.

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TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 615
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 8:19 am 
 

I also realise that a not so small share of stuff I wrote when I was 14-16 was indeed stupid, but a) age doesn't automatically make everything teenagers say/do worthless (and no matter what, the worst obnoxious assholes I've met on the internet were 20+, and I'm not exaggerating), b) this really is among the lowest levels of "ad hominem" attacks, above maybe only "ur mom".
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The SHM
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:54 pm
Posts: 134
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 10:27 am 
 

As a person young enough to write stupid stuff but old enough to realize that it's stupid, I digress with part of that statement- 90% of the stuff early teenagers write on the Internet is sophomoric gibberish.
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92% of teens have cleanly divided themselves according to genres. If you're part of the 8% that doesn't give a shit why others listen to their music, then I don't care. Just enjoy the damn music.

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TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 615
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 11:26 am 
 

Nah, I don't think so. Some if it is indeed dumb, but the thing is that it's mostly also fairly stupid in a strangely hilarious way. When I think of "not smart internet teenagers", what comes to my mind is those in online games shouting "LIBATION BIG NOOB". It's kind of hard to get annoyed by them most of the time.

Genuine, intolerable assholes are usually a bit older.
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Exigence
Age: 29 (Wait, what?!)

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:42 pm
Posts: 951
Location: New Orleans
PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2013 10:39 pm 
 

You know I once attended a music forum with Ian Mackaye (Minor Threat, Fugazi) about 9 years ago and as a I joke I asked him "Do you ever look back and laugh?" as a joke. You see, there's a minor threat song called "look back and laugh" about kids growing up and laughing at all their childish behavior.

He gave the douchiest answer about how that song was sarcastic and h doesn't laugh because he is the same person as he was 20 years prior. It was so disappointing.

There could be a whole "list your own juvenile regrets" thread...

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vgmaster9
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun May 26, 2013 1:26 am
Posts: 71
PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 10:32 pm 
 

As long as there's underground forms of rock, no.

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