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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 11:40 pm 
 

failsafeman wrote:
it's very funny until you realize from her actions (and lack of reaction when things get violent later) that she absolutely knows about her son's drug dealing and at least tacitly condones it, maybe even lives off of it herself.


Ha, you know, I didn't catch that when I saw it. I'm overdue to see it again sometime soon anyway - that makes it even more interesting.
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shouvince
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 4:44 am 
 

Well, I agree with what Empyreal said...expectations play a huge role. I was disappointed after waiting for so long. Maybe I was a tad harsh and focused only the negative aspect of the movie. All I'd say is that it was watchable but I wouldn't watch it again.

Also, yep...JGL was really weak in TDKR. It remains to be seen if they'll actually pursue Robin as a character in future franchises. I'm a little skeptical about him as that character and would really see how he approaches that role if it sees the light of day.

Thanks for the recommendations guys, I now know what to do this weekend - Brick, Lookout and Mysterious Skin.

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darkeningday
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:33 am 
 

I'd avoid Brick, shouvince; I wouldn't wish that two hours of inept, nauseatingly contrived poser-noir storytelling on my worst enemy. Just like everything in Rian Johnson's hackwork filmography (his episode of Breaking Bad notably included), the entire film was based on gimmick rather than substance (in this case, teens acting out a Dashiell Hammett novel in the modern day). Most of Brick was simply ripped from the pages of early 1900's grocery store novels and then up-converted into a twee, Sundance Channel approved milieu. Levitt was pretty good, I guess, and Haas was far better than usual, but watching this movie instead of real noir cinema (e.g. The Big Sleep, The Maltese Falcon, Touch of Evil, Chinatown etc etc etc) is like going for the Franzia instead of the Château; it's just cheap and you should feel ashamed.

Mysterious Skin was monumentally pretentious, but it was still quite watchable. Still nowhere near as good as anything in the director's "Teenage Apocalypse Trilogy," though.
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Necroticism174
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:44 am 
 

I tried to watch Brick but just couldn't. Made it half an hour in before turning it off. I almost never do that.
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shouvince
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:51 am 
 

Ah, mixed opinions I see. Now that my expectations have been lowered, all the more reason to watch them. I'll let you know what I think.

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Under_Starmere
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 9:18 am 
 

@Necroticism: Same here. Couldn't stomach that claptrap. I've always hated "breathless" dialogue, and that film was basically the epitome of pre-loaded, infuriatingly pat repartee. Kinda made me want to hurt someone.
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Necroticism174
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 4:45 pm 
 

The new Evil Dead trailer makes it look like they're going for full on gross out, with a ridiculous amount of blood and guts. I am vaguely optimistic.
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failsafeman
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:23 pm 
 

darkeningday wrote:
I'd avoid Brick, shouvince; I wouldn't wish that two hours of inept, nauseatingly contrived poser-noir storytelling on my worst enemy. Just like everything in Rian Johnson's hackwork filmography (his episode of Breaking Bad notably included), the entire film was based on gimmick rather than substance (in this case, teens acting out a Dashiell Hammett novel in the modern day). Most of Brick was simply ripped from the pages of early 1900's grocery store novels and then up-converted into a twee, Sundance Channel approved milieu. Levitt was pretty good, I guess, and Haas was far better than usual, but watching this movie instead of real noir cinema (e.g. The Big Sleep, The Maltese Falcon, Touch of Evil, Chinatown etc etc etc) is like going for the Franzia instead of the Château; it's just cheap and you should feel ashamed.

Except I've seen all the movies you've listed and read the books they're based on (where applicable) too. I'm a big fan of "real" noir film and have seen far beyond the incredibly obvious films you cite, not to mention I've read quite a bit of Raymond Chandler, Dashiell Hammett, etc., and not just their "greatest hits" either. It's precisely because I enjoy "real" noir film and hardboiled detective literature so much that I really enjoy Brick. I can see how the rapid-fire dialog could turn people off, but that was just the style for a lot of that stuff. Your wine analogy is just absurdly pretentious even for you, and smacks of someone regurgitating film nerd bullshit you picked up from other wannabe screenwriters. I mean look at your criticisms: they read like someone trying really, really hard to sound smart and dismissive, but contain nary a shred of actual substance. What is contrived? What is inept? What early 1900s grocery store novels does it actually rip from? No, I'm afraid as usual you're just full of yourself, which is to say, full of shit.
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TheMizwaOfMuzzyTah
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:28 pm 
 

You know, I forgot how awesome Raising Arizona is. I saw it once a few years ago, and thought it wasn't bad, but I watched it the other night and was totally mowed over by it. I cried at the end. Hilarious, thought-provoking, strangely uplifting, sometimes eerie. An all-around superb film. I can't even wrap my mind around half of the symbolism they throw down in that movie. This is why I, and so many others, love the damned Coen Brothers.

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dontlivefastjustdie
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:34 pm 
 

Necroticism174 wrote:
The new Evil Dead trailer makes it look like they're going for full on gross out, with a ridiculous amount of blood and guts. I am vaguely optimistic.
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Subrick
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:41 pm 
 

Necroticism174 wrote:
The new Evil Dead trailer makes it look like they're going for full on gross out, with a ridiculous amount of blood and guts. I am vaguely optimistic.


Well if there's any way to do an Evil Dead remake, it'd be that way. Better than making a PG-13 shitfest out of it like they did with Prom Night.
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darkeningday
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:13 pm 
 

failsafeman wrote:
I mean look at your criticisms: they read like someone trying really, really hard to sound smart and dismissive, but contain nary a shred of actual substance. What is contrived? What is inept? What early 1900s grocery store novels does it actually rip from? No, I'm afraid as usual you're just full of yourself, which is to say, full of shit.

M'kay.

failsafeman wrote:
Rian Johnson's earlier film with Joseph Gordon-Levitt, Brick, is even better however. The premise is a wacky (neo-noir crime thriller set in high school) but it's played totally straight rather than for laughs, and the plotting, characterization, and dialog are very tight. It's not a 'high school movie' by any means, rather the setting serves to cast the noir archetypes in a new light.

How are the plotting, characterization and dialog "very tight?" Any actual examples, or do you just like using banal buzzwords? What is inherently good about a wacky premise played "totally straight"? How does the setting cast its well-mined noir lineage into new light?

Something involving blacks and kettles comes to mind. And look; I managed to avoid all the shitty ad homs that belie your supposedly serious criticisms.
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Napero
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:38 pm 
 

I went to see The Hobbit last night with the kids. 'twas fun.

They've beefed and fleshed up the story quite nicely by adding stuff, and even though I was initially irritated by the character of Radagast, I ended up liking the interpretation. Overall, a nice movie.

But.

I can't describe how heavily I dislike everything that has anything to do with 3D. I loathe it. Deeply. And even though we went to see the 2D version, because that was the only thing I wanted, it was obvious that several scenes, especially the Goblin Caves part, were meant to be "enjoyed" as a 3D thingy. Sorry, not for me. I can watch someone playing Rayman for a while and even enjoy it, but whenever a movie contains a scene with the obvious intention to have things flying around and a pseudo-platform NES game going on, the only thing I can thin of is the ancient first game featuring Star Fox. Sorry, I just can't handle that, and while I'm certain that I'll enjoy the movie on DVD numerous times in the future, those parts will leave me utterly cold. No. Just no. 3D, at its current form, is a needless, redundant and an annoying gimmick. Please, just don't do it. Please.

On the positive side, Gollum was portrayed perfectly for the purpose of the whole series (including LotR itself of course), and I did in a strange way enjoy the way it was made as an adaptation of a fairy tale rather than as a sequel/prequel to the main trilogy itself. The book has a wholly different feel than the LotR trilogy, and the movie indeed maintained that to an unbelievable degree.

And the ending, with Smaug's eye? Perfect...
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inhumanist
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:51 pm 
 

I agree. Gollum was imo the best thing about that movie. I didn't enjoy it as much as I'd liked, but there were a few amazing scenes like that one that made it worthwhile nevertheless. At other times it was kinda dragging. I watched it drunk though so my judgement might be impaired. In 3D I might add, which yes, was pretty unnecessary.
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failsafeman
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:53 pm 
 

darkeningday wrote:
How are the plotting, characterization and dialog "very tight?" Any actual examples, or do you just like using banal buzzwords? What is inherently good about a wacky premise played "totally straight"? How does the setting cast its well-mined noir lineage into new light?

Answering a question with a question to attempt to imply equivalence between our comments. Hilarious. Notice I'm not taking issue with Under_Starmere's criticsm of the film, as what he said had substance and made sense, even though I disagree with it. At least everyone in this thread already knows not to take your opinions seriously. I wonder why you even post here.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:16 am 
 

Subrick wrote:
Necroticism174 wrote:
The new Evil Dead trailer makes it look like they're going for full on gross out, with a ridiculous amount of blood and guts. I am vaguely optimistic.


Well if there's any way to do an Evil Dead remake, it'd be that way. Better than making a PG-13 shitfest out of it like they did with Prom Night.


Yeah, I gotta admit it doesn't look too bad. Looks like it at least has some balls to it, and if nothing else it at least will have cool horror imagery and settings. I just don't think they can best the original. And frankly I don't really trust Sam Raimi to do well by us anymore.
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Subrick
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 1:22 am 
 

They won't beat the original, but Raimi's made consistently good and entertaining stuff. The only real scary thing for me in this movie's creation is that Raimi's script was rewritten by, of all people, Diablo fucking Cody.
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darkeningday
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:50 am 
 

failsafeman wrote:
Answering a question with a question to attempt to imply equivalence between our comments. Hilarious. Notice I'm not taking issue with Under_Starmere's criticsm (sic) of the film, as what he said had substance and made sense, even though I disagree with it. At least everyone in this thread already knows not to take your opinions seriously. I wonder why you even post here.

Dude, I can't even take you seriously with all of your atrocious spelling, logical fallacies and hilariously childish personal attacks. If you want to have a discussion about the structural flaws in Rian Johnson's beat-free, overly antagonistic dialog or the fact that Brick is basically just a standard David Goodis plot soldered onto Dashiell Hammett mechanics (and then of course made "quirky" by setting it in a modern day highschool), fucking fine. But check your unearned, condescending attitude at the door.
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Necroticism174
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:54 am 
 

I'm currently writing the Ad Hominem theme song in honour of this thread. Malice In Wonderland: the existence of this movie is unecessary. A poor "gritty" adaptation of Alice in Wonderland with nothing memorable or noteworthy happening. There really isn't much to say. Just a boring story, boringly filmed, boring ending, mediocre acting. All in all, not offensively terrible but a waste of time.
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PhilosophicalFrog
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:04 am 
 

:nono: Not even a sexy adaptation.
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Subrick
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:07 am 
 

The only truly sexy adaptation of Alice is the Alice in Wonderland musical porno from the 70s.
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darkeningday
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:14 am 
 

Doesn't Alice in Wonderland hold the record for the greatest number of porn adaptations for any book ever? Which is creepily pederastic when you think about it; isn't Alice supposed to be... like... seven?

Ah well; knowing Lewis Carroll's generally odd... tendencies (which may have included paedophilia), I can't help but think he would posthumously approve.
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Subrick
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:20 am 
 

Well the musical version is the only one I personally know of. I've no doubt there are a crapton of them online if I go looking hard enough. The hilarious yet kinda creepy thing about the musical porno is that the songs in it are not only memorable, but they sound like songs that should be in a children's movie.
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Calusari
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:26 am 
 

:o There's such a thing as musical porn?

When it comes to Alice adaptations, I'd be interested to see what a film version of the "American McGee's Alice" games (coincidentally, origin of my favourite Halloween costume) would look like - though I suppose that every being realised is quite unlikely, given the way the rights have been passed from owner to owner. I know, I know, game adaptations... still; given the right director, it could work.

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Subrick
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:32 am 
 

Well they were very much in the process of making one 7 or 8 years ago, right down to releasing promo shots of Sarah Michelle Gellar as Alice. I personally would love to see it go back into production. It was a great game with a great concept.
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Calusari
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:47 am 
 

Yeah, though unfortunately the project's been passed around from studio to studio; Gellar herself supposedly (rumour) bought the rights at one point. I do hope it'll get off the ground one day.

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darkeningday
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:57 am 
 

Calusari wrote:
:o There's such a thing as musical porn?

Oh, I can one-up this. Observe.
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Calusari
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:17 am 
 

:eek: Oh, wow. Just when I thought the 70s couldn't get any better. And they say the internet age has the weirdest porn... (Note: not a challenge; sorry for lowering the level of debate there).

This reminds me of a really weird film that a friend of mine keeps showing at parties - something like The Muppets but far, far dirtier; can't think of the name, for the life of me.

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darkeningday
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:23 am 
 

Meet The Feebles? Sprung from the depraved mind of Peter Jackson, crazy as it may sound...
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Calusari
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:33 am 
 

Yes, that's it! Thanks! I think... at least I won't be going crazy trying to remember the name anymore.

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failsafeman
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:52 am 
 

darkeningday wrote:
failsafeman wrote:
Answering a question with a question to attempt to imply equivalence between our comments. Hilarious. Notice I'm not taking issue with Under_Starmere's criticsm (sic) of the film, as what he said had substance and made sense, even though I disagree with it. At least everyone in this thread already knows not to take your opinions seriously. I wonder why you even post here.

Dude, I can't even take you seriously with all of your atrocious spelling, logical fallacies and hilariously childish personal attacks. If you want to have a discussion about the structural flaws in Rian Johnson's beat-free, overly antagonistic dialog or the fact that Brick is basically just a standard David Goodis plot soldered onto Dashiell Hammett mechanics (and then of course made "quirky" by setting it in a modern day highschool), fucking fine. But check your unearned, condescending attitude at the door.

One typo is "atrocious spelling" :lol: Good job not actually addressing any of my actual points yet again, though. But in case you haven't noticed, calling my posts ad hominems and personal attacks is ridiculous, because I have never been arguing with your opinion; my issue has been with you and your behavior in this thread the whole time. I'm going to tell you bluntly, either shape up or ship out. There's nothing wrong with disliking films other people like or expressing a negative opinion, but if you're going to spend so much time throwing grenades and calling anyone who doesn't agree with you stupid, you're going to do it somewhere else. Finally in this last post you actually barely start to describe what you actually dislike about the movie in question, even if I had to drag it screaming from you. I warned you about this before. When you come back, I expect that to be the norm from you.

darkeningday wrote:
But check your unearned, condescending attitude at the door.

The irony of this statement is...well, it's just wonderful.
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Subrick
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:08 pm 
 

darkeningday wrote:
Meet The Feebles? Sprung from the depraved mind of Peter Jackson, crazy as it may sound...


That movie is hilarious. As much as I enjoy Peter Jackson since he's become a big A-list director, I would love it if he did another splatter comedy like Dead Alive or another depraved festival of offending people like Meet the Feebles.
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Necroticism174
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:08 pm 
 

Don't forget Bad Taste!
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failsafeman
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 3:28 pm 
 

He should definitely go back and make another movie like Bad Taste, so good. Movies like that just seem like a lot of fun to make, too. Sam Raimi seems to be doing that with the Evil Dead, so maybe Jackson will want to do the same after the Hobbit business is over? I doubt either would be able to recapture the exact feel of the originals, but considering both have enough money and clout to do basically whatever they want these days, I'm sure any remakes/sequels/throwbacks would be entertaining at the very least.
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Subrick
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:16 pm 
 

Well with the Evil Dead remake, Raimi and Bruce Campbell have said in the past that they weren't gonna try and recreate the feel of the original. Aside from the "duh" things that would be in the movie, like the first person view from the "Evil", the tree rape (which actually looks like it's gonna be more explicit than the original), and just the general premise, the trailers show that it's definitely gonna be different, mainly in that it looks like they're going for a straight splatter exploitation film. Bruce also said that it's not gonna be campy at all, that they're playing it straight, and the trailer also shows that, at least to me it does. It seriously looks freaky at times in the trailer.

In terms of the violence level that will be in it though, I do think that the film will be better paced than other gross out splatter movies of the here and now, such as the Saw sequels which just immediately smack you in the head with buckets of blood and guts. Since Sam Raimi, Bruce Campbell, and the original movie's producer Robert Tapert are all producers on this, I think the film will have a bit more of an older vibe to it when it comes to story structure and pacing. It really doesn't seem like this movie's gonna immediately start with someone's innards spilling out all over the ground and similar gory tactics that Saw II-VII did to gain attention. Raimi definitely knows better than that.
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volutetheswarth
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 10:52 pm 
 

Personally I would like another Peter Jackson effort in the style of The Frighteners as that is my favourite work of his. Perfect mixture of humour and dread. Jeffrey Combs is superb as an off the wall antagonist and it's nice to see Michael J. Fox in a darker, more quirky role. I can't really get into his other stuff. The trailers and clips of Braindead and Bad Taste haven't sold me, I don't like that the wacky humour is at the forefront. I'm a fan of the Evil Dead trilogy though so maybe I might enjoy them, I was apprehensive on my first viewings of 2 and 3 with the comedy being far more prevalent but I grew to enjoy them.
failsafeman wrote:
He should definitely go back and make another movie like Bad Taste, so good. Movies like that just seem like a lot of fun to make, too. Sam Raimi seems to be doing that with the Evil Dead, so maybe Jackson will want to do the same after the Hobbit business is over?

I doubt it will happen. Examples being the overblown, melodramatic style of King Kong and The Lovely Bones. It's like Lord of the Rings changed him to where everything has to be bigger and more powerful than before. A little fun throwaway horror film is beneath him unless he were to serve as a producer. Whereas Sam Raimi seems to genuinely love gross out horror/comedies as seen recently with Drag Me To Hell.

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failsafeman
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:00 pm 
 

I haven't seen The Lovely Bones but I hated his version of King Kong. Way too overblown, and most of the characters were totally unlikable (except for the heroine). Also it couldn't decide whether to be a gritty, realistic depiction of the King Kong story or an exaggerated, fantastical one. On the former end you have pretty much all the scenes leading up to them landing on the island, then on the island itself you get hit with ridiculous "evil" islanders and enough silly monsters to fill a hundred Z-grade sci-fi and horror movies. Dinosaurs I could have bought, but giant flesh-eating crickets? Fucking come on, Peter Jackson. Also I really don't like Adrien Brody in general.

You should at least pirate Bad Taste or something, it's fairly short and entertaining throughout. You might not love it, but I doubt you'll be bored. I should see the Frighteners myself, I haven't yet.
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Subrick
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:06 pm 
 

Both Bad Taste and Dead Alive are probably up on Youtube in full, so I'd say to look there before torrenting them.
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Metantoine
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Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:09 pm 
 

King Kong was 2 hours too long, it's not bad, but god, sometimes Jackson should cut his movies. I thought The Hobbit was too long too, I expect the 2nd movie to be full of fillers and a total cashgrab.

Also, I just finished my LOTR extended version boxset and I must say the longer versions are much better. It feels more complete for a non reader and I have no idea why Jackson removed Saruman's scene in Return or Aragorn's scene where he says his age to Eowyn. I'm perhaps only a geek, but I think many scenes are important for the enjoyment of the movie. These extended versions are now the only way I'll enjoy LOTR, no way around it.
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volutetheswarth
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Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 8:37 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:22 pm 
 

I think I suffered some kind nausea when I watched King Kong. I was zoning in and out every ten minutes wondering if I was watching a graphics card test or an actual movie. All I remember is Jack Black's teary eyed face looking at me.

I've give 'em a watch at some point. I don't want to miss something that could potentially be good.

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