I bet you a dollar the album is going to start out with some serious blasting and growls, like "woah lookout the grandfathers of gore grind are back!" then it will jump into some shitty Heartwork sounding death metal but with more predictable pathways to easy choruses. And there will be self referential lyrics.

Symphonies of Sickness is one of my #1 favorite albums of all time, the CD version my sister grabbed out of a fucking Wal-Mart dollar bin in the mid 90s had Reek as bonus tracks and that album completely consumed my life. I found all their other releases disappointing, I'm sure their progressions made sense to them but I find them extremely tedious and boring.

It is interesting there aren't many fans who enjoy all of their discography, its almost always an even split, and I consider later day Carcass fans 2nd class citizens who should be forced into slave labor.

Ken Owen pretty much wrote all their lyrics and came up with the imagery, so he is in a way classic Carcass, with him completely out of the picture, well whatever I'm over and out..

Yeah? Well, fuck you too, and have a nice day.

Again, I get this from not paying complete attention to the OP, but Owen's out? Damn, that sucks. Dude was a very important part of the Carcass sound, not to mention being an all around cool drummer. Wonder how their sound will adapt to his absence.....

Varth is gone for a short stay in a gulag. He's gonna reflect on what slave labor is.

Yeah he had a brain haemorrhage, and though he has been playing some gigs with them, I don't think he's recovered completely from it.

To my knowledge the only stuff Ken's done with Carcass since the reunion has been doing drum solos during some of their shows.

"I consider later day Carcass fans 2nd class citizens who should be forced into slave labor."

That's a little harsh. He's probably the dude that laughed at me that one time I stated that Necroticism is my favorite Carcass album.

As far as a new album, I am very excited to see what they have to offer us. Even if it winds up horrible I am very excited to hear new Carcass material. I personally thought ALL of their albums were excellent in their own different ways. Such a long time away from writing for Carcass may have a negative impact on them, though. Who knows? Maybe they'll pull a Celtic Frost and release an EXCELLENT return album.

Man, that's nasty! Seriously hope he gets better. A brain haemorrhage is no kidding matter.

Drum solo from Owen in 2009: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1K6PR4CHG0I

I loved Heartwork I would not mind if they went back in that direction. Swansong sucked, I love SOS, and Reek but they will never do an album like that again--no chance! Since they were dismissing Death and Grind way back in the mid 90's.

Othe bright side, a brain haemorrhage is the most metal thing that can happen to a goregrind musician.

I thought Necroticism was universally praised, but MA never fails to surprise me (see: Aliens discussion in the movie thread). Well I think it's fucking top notch and I'm one of the reek/symphonies people.

Safe and boring? Did melodeath even exist prior to Heartwork? It was a landmark record in pioneering and/or establishing a major new subgenre. How is that safe?

I have the complete Carcass box set and appreciate all of it.

Skydancer had come out a little under two months before Heartwork, but Carcass was the infinitely more well known band at the time, so that (and rightfully so, I feel) gets the credit of being the "inventor" of melodeath.

This interview with Bill Steer is 3 years old, but I read it recently and thought it may shed some light for this topic.

http://www.invisibleoranges.com/2009/10 ... d-carcass/









I thought this last paragraph was the most interesting.

My favourite album of theirs is Necroticism, but Heartwork is a damn fine album, so if they produce Heartwork part 2 , that would be okay by me...

I don't know I think Heartwork is more in line with what melodic death metal became a year or two later than Skydancer. Skydancer is kind of meandering and less structured. Heartwork laid the template, even if it was heavier than most other releases in the sub genre would be because when you think about it Slaughter of the Soul, The Jester Race and even The Gallery have more in common with Heartwork than Skydancer.

In the interview dvd that comes with the Heartwork reissue Bill Steer admits Heartwork is his favorite album. I'm hoping that with his side project taking up his interest in rock he will be more interested in making something that sounds like Heartwork rather than Swansong 2.0.

Thanks for this interview, it was a nice read. And +1.

You can use the same arguement about how Korn brought forth nu-metal... doesn't mean I or most people like it or care.

I don't like most melodeath, it all sounds rather similar and safe sounding. So pioneering a genere I don't like or care about doesn't make me grow any appreciation for what they did. I judge an album on my own tastes and well I don't like it. It sounds safe and boring to me and nothing is going to change that.

Wait, you're saying that Heartwork (one of or even the first melodeath album) is safe and boring because it sounds too similar to other melodeath albums?

No what I'm saying is I don't like melodeath, it all sounds safe and boring to me. And in conjunction to the whole genre of melodeath I think much of it sounds similar to each other, which can be said about every genre, but this is a genre I don't care about nor like much so then it become a detriment to it for me... cause I don't have to be fair, just, or non-hypocritical... I just don't care about it.
So it's sorta moot to argue with me on why I dislike something. Like I said, I don't care about the context of where it is placed in history of release and how it shaped a genre, i judged it on the merits of the album itself outside of any realm of refrence outside that I knew it was melodeath... tried it anyway. Found my eyes rolling back in my head out of boredum. Haven't listened to it since.

Let's compare it this way outside of music....

I don't like wine and here you give me what is the best wine the world has to offer and the cheapest shit out of a box... I won't like either or could tell the difference between them cause I don't like wine and I don't really care...cause to me it all tastes the same since I don't like it to begin with.

Now you give a slew of middle grade cheesecake that's almost practically indifferent to each other... I will most likely enjoy every slice since it's something I like to begin with and don't really care if they are the same cause it's more of what I enjoy to begin with and welcome more of the same there.

If they think Heartwork is their finest moment, be prepared for another run of the mill melodeath album. I'm with SLK, I just don't like melodeath that much excepting a couple of songs and don't simply care if they release another Heartwork (like I wouldn't care if At the Gates releases another Slaughter).

BAH. Tastes versus Knowledge, Freedom versus Respect and all that, folks (@Shaolin & now also Kveldulfr)...

There is some merit and even wisdom in a clean refusal to assess something when you acknowledge it is too far outside of your interests for you to form a relevant, fair opinion of it in its own context, I think. You couldn't care less about melodeath, and as a result, Heatwork sounds like the same old shit to you, fine. Just say so. Calling it "a sellout", "safe", "boring" or "run-of-the-mill" just because it's a genre you don't like (and like to make fun of, too; your comparison with nu-shite did not go unnoticed, mind you) makes you come across as immature and poorly informed. And for what result? It's not like you were going to convince us melodeath fans that we should be ashamed of ourselves or anything quite like that. The opposite stance (basically just saying "you're right, Legend and ENKC, thank you guys for enlightening us!") would be equally idotic: just because something is reverred by others, doesn't mean you have to pretend you love it too. But shitting all over a piece of history just for the sake of pissing people off doesn't serve any purpose, either. Just say you loathe melodeath, which again is fine. I love it, myself, but I'm not out on a crusade to rally all early Carcass fans to Heartwork.

Calling all these things are my clean assessment of it. I knew it was melodeath, and I didn't say I hated all melodeath... I like early Dark Tranquility, but overall as a genre I don't care for, and I have spent a good amount of money and time invested in it. So it wasn't something I immediately dismissed, it was something I kinda liked and grew to hate it more as time went on.

I'm not trying to convince anyone to hate heartwork, what I'm trying to convince is that everyone who thinks that I'm just saying what I'm saying to be a dick or detract from the piece of work... is wrong. I'm just expressing and further elaborating on why I personally don't like it. And thus far it has gotten more comments about people thinking I am 'ignorant' 'uniformed' or 'wrongly generalizing' something other than what it's meant is... I'm a fan of early Carcass, I don't like these albums cause of X. There really didn't need to be much further elaboration of that. I don't like what you like, welcome to the real world. I also don't care to drink and find that a waste of money and I hate sports. I don't need any rational reasons on to why I dislike something, nor do you need to stop liking of feel threatened that I'm trying to keep you from enjoying them.

So like you said you got my comparison to nu-metal. Clearly you didn't. I picked that cause I would assume most people would not give a shit who started nu-metal or whatever cause it's something that's unimportant to you. That's why I said it cause I don't care who started melodeath. You completely and totally didn't get the comparison at all.

I really guess I expected reading comprehesion to be better for some reason, though it hasn't proven so in the past.

Likewise, I expect better typing from you, SLK. These are posts are minefields of bad grammer (HA HA!).

Regarding Carcass being the first melodeath band: it's odd, isn't it? Heartwork is often called the first melodeath album (perhaps wrongfully, I'd say) and it really doesn't have all that much in common with the later melodeath sound which came to fame in the mid-1990s. Arsework always seemed to me like 1990s Megadeth meets Kreator's Coma of Souls with a groovier edge... as was par for the course in the early 1990s. An interesting album, sure, and for its time it was a unique one... but it's certainly not very good.

Seriously, this is getting ridiculous. My post was meant to be the "come on, let's hug it out, you guys!" call of reason in this Heartwork debate, dude! Not... whatever you read into it. Rest assured that I absolutely and utterly got your Korn parallel, along with your wine/cheesecake metaphor (I'm with you, on that one, by the way). It's just that, as an aside, I briefly noted that you happen to have picked an example which is vastly acknowledged by the metal community, not merely as not its cup of tea, but as actually being a derivative, lazy, piss-take of a bastard of a shit genre, thus further conveying a negative message towards melodeath by association, if ever so subtly. That's all, and it was just a quick note in passing, man; not my main point. Also, I really understood and even appreciated the bulk of your posts on this topic, as I told you earlier on. My previous post was not addressing everything you've said here, far from it: just this particular (and, as I now come to realize, mostly unintended) way of presenting Heartwork as if its influence and historical relevancy didn't exist; and in this I was also addressing Kveldulfr's post above. So please, don't take this the wrong way. Blame it on semantics or, as ANA joyfully pointed out, "grammer".

By the way, @ANA: ! Dude, nice try, but I'm not feeding you after midnight, ever. Lots of love, though.

Well like I said i picked it cause I knew most people wouldn't be defending it. It was the most pointless genre I could think of that attempts to claim to be metal outside of deathcore and whatever...

And hugging is not allowed in metal at any times. Shame on you. No damn brohugs here.... unless it's post-workout.... sweaty... and naked.

I hope the new album sounds exactly like Swansong, but with clean vocals. I want Jeff Walker to do falsettos.

@Shaolin: It's a date, then.

Back on track: so, it seems they are more likely to offer something that is aiming for the Heartwork style rather than their earlier or later styles (it's also good to know that Steer, in retrospect, thinks Swansong was too far removed from their previous styles to truly fit with Carcass).

The main issue I'm having with that is that, as I said earlier on, with Steer as the only guitarist, a very melodic, solo-heavy style does sound like a challenge. Amott's lead work totally dominated both albums he's been on, and I'm not sure Steer can match this on his own.

But at the end of the day, they might still surprise us; not necessarily quality wise (I'm not holding my breath, there), but at least with the direction they'll take. Each of the four Carcass albums took a different direction (going from more or less gory photographic artwork to a deliberately simplistic and naive "peace and love" sign photoshop artwork was one of their major "fuck expectations!" moves, in that sense). They might want to salute their own legacy by not emulating it too closely, which could be a good thing, because a band going back to the studio after 2 decades, especially with an altered line-up, is highly unlikely to achieve that even if it actively tries to.

Jesus guys. Your arguments just pointlessly circled each other for a whole page. Anyways, I'm wondering if Bill Steer will finally do vocals again for this. It seems unlikely, but I miss his retardedly deep grunts.

I'll try and remain cautiously optimistic on this one. I like early and latter day Carcass almost equally, so as long as it sounds like Carcass in some way, I might like it.

Yop. Well, at least, we made a... full circle.
How do you mean "finally"? Doesn't Steer do his vocal parts live these days?

One of the greatest things about Carcass as a band is they were innovative and they forged their own direction from album to album. They never made music solely to please their fan base, or play it safe and do what people expected them to. So whether or not not you liked what they did, at least they kept things interesting.

After such a long absence from writing and recording, who knows what they'll come up with? Perhaps the magic will have gone and like the Morbid Angel reunion, it will all be just a waste of time and a disappointment to many. No problem, I'll just play something else.

But I liken the guys from Carcass to Celtic Frost. There are similarities in their careers. They are the real deal and not second rate imitators. Tom Gabriel started out on the cutting edge with Hellhammer, helping to establish a new genre of extreme metal with his own unique sound and style. Celtic Frost evolved, experimented and took chances. They produced some great work, but then they tried to widen their appeal, made an album that misfired badly and annoyed a lot their old fans, just like Carcass did. They both ran out of steam and broke up. 15 years later, Celtic Frost got back together, produced Monotheist and surprised everybody, but really, we shouldn't have been surprised with their doomy avant-garde offering. It was in keeping with their spirit.

I'm hoping for something similar from Carcass, but in their own way, of course. It would be out of character for Jeff Walker and Bill Steer to produce a boring 90's retread. So yesterday when I posted they'll probably record Heartwork 2.0, what I really meant to say is perhaps they will produce a death metal album of that ilk, but a record for 2013, not 1996: something heavier, more crushing than their previous work, but incorporating fresh ideas with another 15 years of experience.

If it turns out bad, it won't be the end of the world. It will still be interesting to hear what they come up with. I don't see the point in being negative about it. We should be happy that Bill Steer got the rock guitar riffs out of his system and wants to play metal again.

http://www.decibelmagazine.com/featured ... ss-record/

Bill is doing vocals again.

It doesn't matter who invented melodeath; that isn't really the point. You don't see how music with simplified song structures (as most of heartwork has, in comparison with Necroticism) far fewer riffs in every song (sometimes as few as three), and all round embracing of melodic hooks and newer thrash riffs, plus lengthy melodious solos in the vein of Kreator's Coma of Souls is playing it safe compared with raging death metal or grindcore? When listening to heartwork for the first time, I'm sure people didn't think, "oh boy, a new genre of metal," they thought, "hey look, it sounds like Iron Maiden, but really heavy and with kickass growls!" it was death metal you could play for a guy not into death metal, basically; arguably not death metal at all. I'm not really a Heartwork hater as such (actually I'm pretty ambivalent toward it; a few of the songs really are good) but it's obviously way more accessible and commercially-minded than anything they'd done previously.

http://gunshyassassin.com/news/carcass- ... d-drummer/

Con-fucking-firmed. That and the drummer isn't the guy from Heaven Shall Burn, but rather former Aborted skinsman Dan Wilding.

I'll have one ticket for the hype train, thanks. Just as far as Satisfaction Street, no need to go near Disappointment Station.

That sounds quite interesting. The missing link between Necroticism and Heartwork, eh? I guess it'll be some kind of progressive death metal with quite a few melodic tendencies thrown in for good measure, plus the groove elements that Walker mentioned during the interview. I don't know about you guys, but that sounds like a good mix to me, and the fact that Bill's doing vocals again is the icing on the gory cake. No idea about this Wilding dude though, but he must be at least solid, considering that they chose him to replace Ken fucking Owen.

Dan played on Strychnine for Aborted, as well on two Trigger the Bloodshed albums and an album by The Order of Apollyon, as well as incidentally being the live guy for Heaven Shall Burn in 2011 and 2012.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgceGRYtLd4

Yeah, I think he'll do good in Carcass.

All things considered I'll definitely give it a listen. I'm not a fan of Heartwork and Necroticism isn't my favorite either but it will be interesting to hear what they come up with after 17 years. My hope would be to get one track along the lines of Reek, even in jest, as a nod to their early work.

I will secretly be hoping for them to do something along the lines of Flesh Ripping Sonic Torment and just be hyping it as something similar to their more widely popular records just to fuck with people but I know that won't happen.

Okay, I'm excited now. I can live with a Heartwork part 2 as I rather enjoyed the heck out of it. Carcass will show Morbid Angel how it's done.

I like everything Carcass has done, with the exception of swansong. I don't think it's a bad album, just slightly boring, and it doesn't sound like Carcass. And Amott being gone I think is good, as he only had a small input on the two albums he played on (contrary to popular belief, he only contributed a few solos to each album, and that was about it), and Arch Enemy has gone to mid-tempo shit these days. If they did something between Necroticism and Heartwork, I'd go find a homeless man and shit on him in celebration.

Either way, if they have a song on there with riffs as good as Carnal Forge, I'll die happy.