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soul_schizm
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 8:55 am
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 11:47 pm 
 

Empyreal wrote:
Element_man wrote:
Pic of Geoff Tate in a speedo


I just have such a hard time believing this loser performed on great classics like The Warning and Operation Mindcrime. :(


There's no limit to what ego + stupidity can do to a person. Seriously.



Also, Geoff isn't the first vocalist to completely lose his sense of reality.

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Zodijackyl
Lazy Wizard

Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:39 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 11:53 pm 
 

Perhaps the Queensryche Cabaret was the breaking point for the rest of the band. It is pretty embarassing.

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Ribos
Radioactive Man

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 1:11 am 
 

Zodijackyl wrote:
Perhaps the Queensryche Cabaret was the breaking point for the rest of the band. It is pretty embarassing.
I have no problems with a heavy metal cabaret. I mean, if Nocturnal Breed can use strippers in their live shows, why not some burlesque stuff in Queensryche?

...But then I witnessed the execution of that idea, and instantly fell in line with the masses on this one: really, really fucking stupid idea. I mean, we're talking ideas on par with the Stonehenge/midget incident with Spinal Tap. Except this was real life and not a comedic movie.
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ENKC
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 7:47 am 
 

Ribos wrote:
Zodijackyl wrote:
Perhaps the Queensryche Cabaret was the breaking point for the rest of the band. It is pretty embarassing.
I have no problems with a heavy metal cabaret. I mean, if Nocturnal Breed can use strippers in their live shows, why not some burlesque stuff in Queensryche?

...But then I witnessed the execution of that idea, and instantly fell in line with the masses on this one: really, really fucking stupid idea. I mean, we're talking ideas on par with the Stonehenge/midget incident with Spinal Tap. Except this was real life and not a comedic movie.

Actually, that incident was based on events from Black Sabbath's Born Again tour, which was also real life and not a comedic movie.
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SleightOfVickonomy
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Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:26 pm
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 8:34 am 
 

Geoff Tate has a great voice whose influence became clearly marked on other singers at that time including Ray Alder, James LaBrie, John West, Harry Conklin, Carl Albert and so on. It is unfortunate that he feels totally apathetic towards metal and I am saddened by that. I guess I can understand why the guys struggled with him all those yaers and stayed...he can be a pretty exhausting person. I remember hearing from Dream Theater who had toured with Queensryche in 2003 say what an exhuasting and "bad vibey" period it had been for them. Mike Portnoy would later in interviews say that he thought Geoff was a douche and Petrucci of course penned lyrics to "As I Am" about an incident involving him and Mike Stone, Geoff's hired gun around the time of O:M2 who thought he could enlighten him aout guitar playing.

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DeathBySuicide
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 7:58 am
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Location: Denmark
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:52 am 
 

Mike Portnoy was there??????????????????????
http://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?m ... mID=176740

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Zodijackyl
Lazy Wizard

Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:39 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:23 am 
 

DeathBySuicide wrote:
Mike Portnoy was there??????????????????????
http://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?m ... mID=176740


Yeah, that's been known for a while Bobby Jarzombek had already committed to another show (I believe in the same city) with another one of his bands, so Fates Warning had MP fill in again. Fates Warning were opening for Queensryche. Oh, and Mike Portnoy is always involved in disputes that are publicly drawn out on the internet.

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Lightsbane
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:17 am
Posts: 233
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:47 am 
 

theoctavarius wrote:
The_Minstrel51 wrote:
LOL.
I just came across this ridiculous video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akTwO-HB398

Now, I'm all for T & A, but it looks like the friggin' Cirque de Soleil meets your local strip club... and that bloody song! :brick:
Wot a joke.


That video has to be one of the most pathetic things I've ever laid eyes on.


Couldn't agree more. Probably the gayest thing involving boobs to ever exist.

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WaywardSon
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:48 am
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 1:25 pm 
 

Contrary to what some people might think, the other Queensryche members have been writing these past ten years.

Here are some production themes, used mainly for commercial and promotional work, that Michael Wilton and Scott Rockenfield made some years ago. These were apparently ideas that Wilton had made for Mindcrime II before being turned down by Tate. Not all of the tracks/samples are theirs, just the ones credited to them.

http://www.sonofind.com/search/html/pop ... sprache=EN

Also, here's a track from Soulbender, Wilton's project from about 9 years ago.

Basically, unless the new members have a hand in the songwriting, we can expect modern rock/"metal." It sounds more like Creed and other post-grunge acts than anything albeit with some decent soloing.
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juicebitch
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 2:55 pm 
 

Couldn't play any of the tracks in the first link. I need to login, apparently.
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TadGhostal
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 2:57 pm 
 

http://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?m ... mID=176805

Wilton, Jackson, and Rockenfield get to keep the name, for the time being.

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Metal_Detector
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 2:59 pm 
 

Good.

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DarthVenom
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 3:07 pm 
 

Hmm...

A control freak who channels all facets of the organization through him, and who enacts violent retribution on any who displease him?

Has it occurred to Tate that he's basically Dr. X at this point?

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OzzyApu
Metal freak

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 4:20 pm 
 

Good news on keeping the name for this new line-up. As long as the band can work out some metal songs that aren't crap, this won't be wasted potential.
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theoctavarius
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 4:38 pm 
 

TadGhostal wrote:
http://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176805

Wilton, Jackson, and Rockenfield get to keep the name, for the time being.


Hot damn. Good news, indeed.
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Thiestru
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 4:18 am 
 

I'm excited that they got to keep the band name, and I'm confident that they'll pull a great (or hell, at least good) album out of their hats. Now, allow me to dream for a moment. The following tour needs to happen: Queensryche, Arch/Matheos, and Psychotic Waltz. Holy damn would that be amazing. Now, if they wanted to throw in, say, Manilla Road or Crimson Glory (if Todd can take that much stress on his voice), so much the better. I would attend this tour and then promptly expire of a heartgasm.

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The_Erlking
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 4:34 am 
 

Thiestru wrote:
Now, allow me to dream for a moment. The following tour needs to happen: Queensryche, Arch/Matheos, and Psychotic Waltz.


Heir Apparent should also regroup and join this tour!
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Thiestru
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Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:18 am
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 4:38 am 
 

The_Erlking wrote:
Thiestru wrote:
Now, allow me to dream for a moment. The following tour needs to happen: Queensryche, Arch/Matheos, and Psychotic Waltz.


Heir Apparent should also regroup and join this tour!


Yes! I actually just started listening to them. Damn fine band.

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Kveldulfr
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 11:02 am 
 

FUCK YES! Hopefully they'll release a decent album!

And we need more Arch/Matheos gigs.
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SleightOfVickonomy
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 1:34 pm 
 

great news! I want a new Queensryche album that can at least restore some glory to that name!

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Metallic Shock
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 2:16 pm 
 

With Geoff Tate out I feel like that shipwrocked cruise with him is gonna be extremely awkward for whoever wins. But then again you'd have to be a strange person to want to hang out with a guy like Tate while watching bands like Godsmack, Sevendust, Five Finger Death Punch, and P.O.D so who knows?

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iAmDisturbed
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Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 10:31 am
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 6:44 am 
 

SleightOfVickonomy wrote:
Geoff Tate has a great voice whose influence became clearly marked on other singers at that time including Ray Alder, James LaBrie, John West, Harry Conklin, Carl Albert and so on. It is unfortunate that he feels totally apathetic towards metal and I am saddened by that. I guess I can understand why the guys struggled with him all those years and stayed...he can be a pretty exhausting person. I remember hearing from Dream Theater who had toured with Queensryche in 2003 say what an exhuasting and "bad vibey" period it had been for them. Mike Portnoy would later in interviews say that he thought Geoff was a douche and Petrucci of course penned lyrics to "As I Am" about an incident involving him and Mike Stone, Geoff's hired gun around the time of O:M2 who thought he could enlighten him about guitar playing.


Carl Albert and Harry Conklin were not influenced by Geoff Tate! Conklin draws a lot from Dickinson he actually does sound a lot like the man come to think of it and he did front a Maiden tribute band called Powerslave.
Ray Alder's voice is deeper than Tate's although somewhere on "Parallels" he does seem to be channeling Tate.

Shadow Gallery's Brain Ashland is the real Tate disciple...at least he sings that way!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lej74M6s8F0

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Oblarg
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 2:39 pm 
 

Carl Albert sounds quite a bit like Geoff Tate at times, especially on his pre-Vicious Rumors stuff where he had less of that aggressive snarl. I'd say he's a better vocalist, though. More versatile.
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soul_schizm
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 2:55 pm 
 

I haven't heard Albert pre-Vicious. I can't hear Tate in his VR stuff, at all.

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Oblarg
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 3:02 pm 
 

It's there, just covered with a lot of hard-rock attitude and (especially on Welcome to the Ball) a Bobby Blitz-esque snarl that Tate never had.
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manowar are literally five times the band that fates warning are: each member is as good as fates warning alone, then joey's bass solos are like an entire extra fates warning

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FateMetal
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Joined: Sat Mar 22, 2008 8:09 am
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 5:53 am 
 

Carl Albert and Midnight are the vocalists most easily comparable to Tate. I can hear bits of Tate's tone in Albert's voice but like Oblarg said there's a snarl to it especially after Digital Dictator and overall he is a more versatile singer...as was Midnight!

Tate was really good on Rage For Order and Operation:Mindcrime and John Arch, James LaBrie and Ray Alder all have moments in their early days where it feels like they were trying to deliver in a similar style. Dream Theater's "Innocence Faded" is classic Tate and FW's "Eye To Eye" sounds like a leftover from Empire.

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The_Erlking
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 6:06 am 
 

More versatile than Tate? No way man. Just listen to what he is doing in Roads to madness. Tate in his prime were like Halford in the 70s: there was like nothing he couldn't do with his voice.
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WaywardSon
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:19 am 
 

What impressed me about Tate wasn't just his range, but how easy it sounded for him. He sounds like he's hitting the stratosphere effortlessly. Even prime Halford at times sounded like he was belting it out a little forcefully at times. One of the most emotionally charged singers ever to me.

As far as Albert goes, tremendous vocalist, but he's the one who sounds a bit more one dimensional to me. Queensryche's music has gone through a lot of changes, not much of it good, but Tate's voice isn't what's wrong with it. He sounds natural over the grunge of HitNF, hard rock of Q2K and Tribe and pop of Dedicated to Chaos. I don't think Albert could quite pull those off.
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Oblarg
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:59 am 
 

The_Erlking wrote:
More versatile than Tate? No way man. Just listen to what he is doing in Roads to madness. Tate in his prime were like Halford in the 70s: there was like nothing he couldn't do with his voice.


Oh yes, there was. I don't think Tate could have ever managed, for example, this. He never had to sing over such twisted, odd material.

Though, comparing vocalists who are not John Arch to John Arch is rather unfair, so let's stick to the Carl Albert comparison. While Tate was great at the whole "subtle, complex emotion" delivery, I don't think I've ever heard him just come straight out and rock. Granted, Queensryche wasn't really a band to do that (they came closest on the debut EP). Carl Albert could do emotion (just listen to Villain's Only Time Will Tell, but he also just had this effortless, straightforward charm and attitude that Tate lacked. Tate was undeniably the absolute best vocalist for Queensryche's classic material (which happens to almost all be on The Warning), but I feel Carl Albert was capable of more.
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SleightOfVickonomy
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Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:26 pm
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2012 1:48 pm 
 

Oblarg, I mean you no disrespect but your John Arch worship seems to always cloud your judgment somehow.
Yes, the man is a fantastic singer but he is really not some strange creature that sounds unlike any other. His voice to me is a cross between Geddy's and Bruce's.
And I can safely say Tate at the time of "Rage For Order" could sing over complex stuff like "Epitaph"-just listen to "Gonna Get Close To You"!

Arch even when he is mellow, you don't feel he really is doing much of a stretch from when he is manic and high pitched. Tate on the other hand could pull out a whole array of tones.
The guy might be a prick but we can't deny that he is one of the finest metal musicians to ever hold a microphone.
Could Arch sing this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1eKGy3ElkY
I don't think so!

As for Carl Albert, he was influenced by Tate but also by a whole bunch of other things and thus he was able to have a rockier edge to his voice because that was part of what he was feeding off.

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Terminus
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2003 12:55 pm
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 11:44 am 
 

SleightOfVickonomy wrote:
Oblarg, I mean you no disrespect but your John Arch worship seems to always cloud your judgment somehow.
Yes, the man is a fantastic singer but he is really not some strange creature that sounds unlike any other. His voice to me is a cross between Geddy's and Bruce's.
And I can safely say Tate at the time of "Rage For Order" could sing over complex stuff like "Epitaph"-just listen to "Gonna Get Close To You"!


Gonna Get Close to You was a cover. And I'm pretty sure the vocal melody doesn't stray too far from the original.
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Abominatrix
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:03 pm 
 

I know i've heard a few metal singers try to sing like Tate, but I'm surprised that iwen talking of influence noone has mentioned Michael Kiske. Especially in his deeper range, Kiske is a near-perfect aping of Tate, only with a thick German accent.

Anyway, there's no doubt in my mind that Geoff Tate is one of the best rock/metal singers of our time, or any time, for that matter. Doesn't help their new material be any good, nor does it absolve him in any way of being a huge douchebag. Actually, I never had much opinion about him as a person before reading this thread, but that interview especially solidified it. Isn't it funny that a guy who spits at his fellow bandmembers, punches and kicks them, knocks over drums and screams obscenities and so on is calling rock fans "boneheaded"? :lol:..fuck him.
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Kveldulfr
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:41 pm 
 

I, for instance, would kill to see Arch doing the earlier 'rÿche material. If there's someone who can handle the material, has the experience, versatility and has this vocal skills intact is him.
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Woolie_Wool
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:15 am 
 

Abominatrix wrote:
I know i've heard a few metal singers try to sing like Tate, but I'm surprised that iwen talking of influence noone has mentioned Michael Kiske. Especially in his deeper range, Kiske is a near-perfect aping of Tate, only with a thick German accent.

Anyway, there's no doubt in my mind that Geoff Tate is one of the best rock/metal singers of our time, or any time, for that matter. Doesn't help their new material be any good, nor does it absolve him in any way of being a huge douchebag. Actually, I never had much opinion about him as a person before reading this thread, but that interview especially solidified it. Isn't it funny that a guy who spits at his fellow bandmembers, punches and kicks them, knocks over drums and screams obscenities and so on is calling rock fans "boneheaded"? :lol:..fuck him.


Well, Kiske worshiped constantly at the altar of Tate throughout the '80s so now it seems like it's time for Tate to return to favor and start acting like a raging, alcoholic Michael Kiske. Next thing you know he's going to be saying the next QR album is inspired by Satan.

Speaking of Satan, did Michael Kiske expect anyone to believe that shit after "Save Us"? And then when his former bandmate started writing songs like "No Return" and "Fantasy Knight Jesus" "Abyss of the Void"? Kai Hansen loves him some Jesus. Well at least he did until "Real World".

Kveldulfr wrote:
I, for instance, would kill to see Arch doing the earlier 'rÿche material. If there's someone who can handle the material, has the experience, versatility and has this vocal skills intact is him.

I don't understand why people think John Arch's skills are so unique. Both Rick Myasthin and the guy from Immaculate have done perfect covers of "The Apparition", which is probably his most difficult song.

I'd like to hear Ralf Scheepers try his hand at some Queensryche songs. Say what you want about Primal Fear but the man can fucking sing.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:21 am 
 

For me, Tate being held in such high regard is rather funny, since I consider his most acclaimed work (Operation: Mindcrime) to have a lot of annoying vocal parts and too many Big Dumb Hooks (TM). I guess it suffers because they're spending so much time trying to tell that crappy story line.

Abom is right about Kiske; the dude obviously loved Queensryche. I've said it before, and I'm pretty sure there's an OlympicSharpShooter review on this site that expresses a similar sentiment, but you can take a lot of The Warning, turn up the pop-factor significantly, speed up the riffs, chew on some gum and then you'll get something resembling Keeper of the Seven Keys.
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Kveldulfr
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:51 am 
 

Woolie_Wool wrote:

Kveldulfr wrote:
I, for instance, would kill to see Arch doing the earlier 'rÿche material. If there's someone who can handle the material, has the experience, versatility and has this vocal skills intact is him.

I don't understand why people think John Arch's skills are so unique. Both Rick Myasthin and the guy from Immaculate have done perfect covers of "The Apparition", which is probably his most difficult song.

I'd like to hear Ralf Scheepers try his hand at some Queensryche songs. Say what you want about Primal Fear but the man can fucking sing.


So, Arch's vocals are average? I think his vocals sound perfectly different from anyone, not just his tone (which isn't common), but his range, passion and especially his approach of vocal lines makes him a totally different singer from your average prog/heavy vocalist. If you add a maestro in songwriting like Jim Matheos to his vocal skills you have a brilliant band and material, which is what early Fates stands in prog metal (Alder is good, but Arch is better and how many prog metal bands don't recognize/show a huge fellation and influence from Fates?). If you listen the new Arch/Matheos album, you hear the guy and without a mistake you know is Arch. How many singers can say that? after decades, how many of those unique singers can sing exactly ike they did before and also handling perfectly the older material? even less. Also, the guy is a great lyricist. He's just the whole package, like Dio was.

I understand people not liking Arch for his nasal tone and odd vocal melodies, but those elements are exactly what makes him different.
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SleightOfVickonomy
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:13 pm 
 

I love John Arch too but come on!
There are moments especially on Night On Brocken where it feels like he is out of tune.
And I know I'll get massacred but he does not sound as he did in the '80's. On Sympathetic Resonance he sounds mellowed somewhat but he still has it!\

Asking about singers who still sound as good as they did in their initial heyday? Try HARRY CONKLIN!
Have you heard Satan' Host's By The Hands Of The Devil?
He is belting like he just turned 20!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lW4yPJBIOOA

Geoff Tate's strength has always been his versatility...Suite Sister Mary? Could Arch have delivered that gut wrenching emotion oh so subtly approached? I THINK NOT!

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Kveldulfr
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:15 pm 
 

SleightOfVickonomy wrote:
I love John Arch too but come on!
There are moments especially on Night On Brocken where it feels like he is out of tune.
And I know I'll get massacred but he does not sound as he did in the '80's. On Sympathetic Resonance he sounds mellowed somewhat but he still has it!\

Geoff Tate's strength has always been his versatility...Suite Sister Mary? Could Arch have delivered that gut wrenching emotion oh so subtly approached? I THINK NOT!


Not mellowed, more 'elegant' I dare to say. Also, think that Arch/Matheos it's modern prog metal, whereas early Fates had more power and speed elements and given the experience, he just learned how to deliver the same odd vocal lines smoothly. I think he's even better now, from a pure vocal perspective.

Check this out, Arch playing Fates material this year:

Damnation/The Apparition
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDKb_-DWp7Q
The Sorceress
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pnv4apmwBI
Guardian
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5E8YkJ7ri5Y
Exodus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nyqzr1Vu_40
Epitaph
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qnRmxjs9rM

Anyway, the Arch thing it's a dream, just like a Fates Warning 30th anniversary tour with both Alder and Arch doing vocals.
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SleightOfVickonomy
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:26 pm
Posts: 330
Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:18 pm 
 

This thread is about Geoff Tate...let's not turn it into John Arch worship.
There's so many altars set up for that round here, just contact Oblarg!

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DeathBySuicide
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2009 7:58 am
Posts: 186
Location: Denmark
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:35 pm 
 

Oblarg wrote:
Oh yes, there was. I don't think Tate could have ever managed, for example, this. He never had to sing over such twisted, odd material.


That song is dreadfully boring! And I have listened to The Spectre Within numerous times since this site recommends it immensely!
Give me Ivory Gate Of Dreams any day! John Arch is a terrific singer and I can actually see songs like Queen Of The Reich, Warning and Speak fitting him like a glove but overall Geoff Tate is a better singer because he is more well rounded. He just isn't as wonderfully idiosyncratic as Arch, but maybe that isn't a terrible thing after all!

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