All you whiners talking about depression. Stop feeling sorry for yourself. I once felt sorry for myself, I was cold, sandy and it was the middle of the night and I had no prospect of sleeping for about 3 days. I was feeling bad for myself, really bad... and I was showing it. So my instructor decided to teach me a lesson about feeling sorry for myself. He dropped me and left me in the pushup position and started pouring water over my head with a hose, talking about how he has seen good friends die, hes had to take a persons life, and he sees me feeling sorry about myself over some cold and a bit of sand in my pants... Gave me a bit of perspective. Always think about other people and how much worse it could be.

I just got back from visiting Nagasaki yesterday, and if you want to introduce some perspective into your life, go to a site of a massacre or great tragedy and realize that these people were just minding their own business when their life was taken from then or changed forever in an instant. Stop complaining about the little shit, and realise life is great if you take all you can in.

I understand people go into funks, every one does. Just realise it for what it is, some days you wake up and just dont have the same amount of motivation or zeal that you might have had the day before. You just have to push yourself to keep yourself motivated and enjoy every minute you have, because you never know when you might get shot at or something.

Anyways, I know that post is a bit preachy for not having hung around these parts in about 2 years, but anyways, Hello from Sasebo, Japan. Enjoy your day friends

I respect Nappy's appeal for the depression circle jerk to chill out, but I could never stand this viewpoint. People have it worse, that doesn't mean somebody suffering legit depression suddenly isn't anymore. Your skin cancer is irrelevant because other people have brain cancer. Some people do go into funks, yes, but depression is a real problem and can't be fixed by being yelled at and called a crybaby pussy.

Also, every time somebody recommends dealing with depression by looking on the bright side or some other optimistic nonsense, I want to headbutt them in the the throat. I suppose you can get over cancer by simply feeling better as well, right?

(I realize I use the cancer comparison a lot but I promise it's only in principle, I'm not so thick to think depression and other mental issues are as severe as cancer).

Could you actually hear through all that water or are you just assuming these are the things he was talking about? Seems a terrible thing to be doing while trying to give someone a talking to.

Also, on a different note, Ordo Ad Chao is really quite good, not sure why it's taken me so long to listen to it. And I really could've done a pun about a Wall of Water there...

I love Engrish.

I'm more looking at it from the viewpoint that most of the people who claim to have depression, unless they are actually diagnosed with it by a medical professional, are just living a dull life were nothing excites them in either a good or bad way. I'm not trying to diminish someone who does suffer from depression. But a lot of people who seem to have depression seem to stem from the lack of something (sometimes material) in their life. Thats why I come from the angle of look how others have it.

I am not one to say that I haven't been depressed, I've lost loved ones and have felt that feeling of emptiness, but I motivated myself to do something about it. I found something that I love doing, and now its my job, I found someone I love being around, and now shes my wife.

Depression is all within the mind, that is why I believe that you can by looking at things in new perspectives get out of it, while another ailment such as cancer cannot be treated the same way. From my experience, I have seen people with all the physical tools in the world fail out of one of the hardest military training in the world, and people who struggled every step of the way physically, but they persevered and even succeed even just because they made a conscious decision to do so. I truly believe there is a lot that the body can ignore if the mind tells it to. I've witnessed a guy with two broken legs make his way over two miles to complete a task just because he wanted to that badly. He would rather die than give up. I am proud to know that these are the type of people I work with.

Well they roll a bit differently in BUD/S. And yeah, it wasn't a fire hose, just a normal garden hose... and he was more or less yelling, not talking... SEALs dont generally whisper.

This is my main point, this misperception that depression is just a mind-over-matter deal. You can't just wish away an imbalance in your brain, you can't just fix it all by simply trudging forward and wanting to beat it, it just doesn't work like that. If you can or did, then chances are you dont/didn't have real, diagnosable depression. I get that mental illnesses aren't the same as physical illnesses, but I see this weird sentiment that suggests that since they can't see them, they don't exist. My best friend is really steadfast in this belief and advises against seeking professional help for most problems because she's so hardheaded in her belief that all medications for such issues are placebos and mental woes are made up or exaggerated because they can't be seen. Maybe I'm just touchy because I've had this fight a zillion times over the years with her but I see it in a lot of people and it's rather worrying to me.

Eric, I respect your opinion, but you don't really know what you're talking about. As BastardHead has said, you can't wish away something like that. I would be a much happier individual if I could.

That's all I will say on the matter.

I expect this is true some of the time. But don't forget teens go through emotional and physical changes, especially during puberty, as they grow into adulthood. I believe it takes a few many years, before they feel "comfortable" with themselves. Some miss this sometimes dibilitating experience altogether and can't relate, hence saying "pull yourselves together".


It's Your World As I See It
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92zAY1ir ... creen&NR=1
(Can't find one about growing up, so here's one about fish

(Let me know if I'm over doing the Jim Varney gags guys).

I respect all of your opinions on this matter, and I am not simply trolling, I have too much respect for you guys as individuals. I am not saying you can wish away depression or pain or disease. I am simply trying to say, that from my experiences, that the mind is a much more powerful being than what many people give it credit for. It can quite simply make you do one more [of whatever, say a pushup, or bench press], when you truly believe you cannot. You can push yourself past limits that you placed on yourself, and really for no good reason. I am not saying that the brain itself cannot fall victim to a chemical imbalance that could create a depressive state. I am not trying to say that you can wish away cancer. Nor could one think away autism. I am saying the mind controls a lot of things in the body, and a positive attitude can make a huge difference in approaching life. I know that when I'm getting shot at or in 50 degree water, my body will be saying "QUIT YOU STUPID MOTHERFUCKER" but because of my experiences and training I know that you can overcome whatever your body is telling you.

To some, depression is the feeling of unknowing of who they are and where they fit in the world, and to me that is more of something that you have to find within yourself.

I am not against one finding medical help when the situation dictates. If you are bleeding profusely, no amount of hopeful thinking can do what a well applied tourniquet can. No amount of helpful thinking can change how chemicals interact within ones own body, but when you just think life is dull or there is nothing in life that makes you happy or something to that effect, I tell people to stop feeling sorry for themselves and do something actively to change their situation.

Once again I respect all of your opinions, and will leave this conversation at that.

Because both bands are from Ukraine, and seeing the mallcore act is well received over in the U.S. just drives home the fact that the good band will never play live in the U.S.

The fat dude from that "funniest black metal video ever" has died.

http://www.metal-archives.com/artists/B ... gref/13828

ahh, wonder why. diabetes?

I thought Detsorgsekalf was pretty funny.

Sucks that he died.

Listening to Windir's Arntor and gaming Skyrim is all I seem to be interested in doing lately.

Made a few dungeon synth sounds today, kinda like making this.

I have depression and come from a line of depression sufferers, but less-than-recent studies have indicated that that whole brain chemical imbalance thing is bogus*. The stuff about neurotransmitters is pretty much debunked and the reason that information hasn't been disseminated to the public is pharma-industry profiteering*. Disgusting, isn't it? From what I've read*, those drugs, in addition to having no appreciable positive effect, appear to assist in making the condition chronic (another boon for drug profiteers). Depression is a normal thing, but it has roots in physical, personal and social circumstances. The root of the widespread depression we are seeing is on the social and physical sides as so many are unhealthy and unhappy as a result of the conditions of their physical being. Our society places virtually all its members in conditions where depression of some form to some degree is the completely reasonable response. The "cure" for the "epidemic" of depression is to change these conditions. The hyper-individualistic perception that has been crystallizing of depression lately seems to fuel this problem as well, since whether one focuses primarily on an individual's sex life, the person being a loser or having a genetic problem as the primary causative factor you tend to forgo a larger, holistic look at the social issues involved which I believe currently carry the onus of influence on this phenomenon.

Not saying that there aren't any genetic or chemical factors involved but it doesn't stand to reason that somehow in the recent past a large swath of the population has suddenly manifested these genetic features that were not apparently present before. It's more logical that rapid changes in our lifestyle and social relationships is more closely correlated to the rapid changes in the mental health and experiences of so many.

Obviously, things which are entirely personal and individual are present as well, such as depression after an injury or loss of a friend/family member, etc. I'm trying to get at the wider phenomenon we are seeing of supposedly "angsty" depression in the population as a whole and want to include explanations for "normal" depression that has always followed the human race so you guys can't jump in and say they disprove my perfect theory.

Incidentally, my thoughts on this matter are informed by my personal experiences, news/med-science articles I've read and Marxist social critique, so you guys can take my thoughts as having as much or as little validity as you like...

[edit]: http://www.alternet.org/health/154915/h ... rs/?page=2

^article about depression with a part about the neurotransmitter theory

article is by this guy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Levine

"Bruce E. Levine, PhD, is a clinical psychologist, often at odds with the mainstream of his profession, in private practice in Cincinnati, Ohio. He has been in practice for nearly three decades. Levine writes and speaks widely on how society, culture, politics and psychology intersect."

I don't think Levine is an alt-medicine huckster by any means.

People wanted some citation for my claims about drugs.

[edit2] link response from Morrigan: http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/ind ... tion-bias/

John_Sunlight: Interest article, morrigan

John_Sunlight: Of course it comes to the conclusion I do, to a large degree

John_Sunlight: That a broader view needs to be taken of the proper way to ameliorate depression

John_Sunlight: It does show that anti-anti-depressent studies are imperfect

John_Sunlight: But it doesn't show that pro-studies are correct either, rather that certain kinds of depression can be to some degree effectively treated with current medicinces

Morrigan: that's a far cry from your post, anyway

John_Sunlight: I don't see this as in any way controverting the things I said except perhaps by a small degree

John_Sunlight: Since I tried to make allowances for the multiplicity of causes of depression as much as seemed reasonable

We're living too fast, unwilling passengers on an overcrowded road that never ends

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkfL-3c7CJs

Please stand in front of one of those buses for us. Thanks!

What?

That was an interesting article, John. I think I've finally sworn off trying those medications.

The first line from John's post is straight out of Tom Cruise's Scientology garbage. The rest is mostly unsubstantiated, paranoid CT weasel words. And all you guys need to know about this Levine character is that he writes a bunch of cleverly marketed populist self-help books, that he is a regular contributor to that bastion of alt-med woo that is HuffPo, and that he pals around with Alex Jones. Thanks but no thanks...

Like I said in the chat, I've read Levine's work and don't think he's an alt medicine huckster. I also accept that saying that common anti-depression drugs are universally ineffective is incorrect. That said, I firmly stand behind the conviction that the science behind pharmacy industry claims about anti-depression drugs is doubtful and plagued with corruption.

This threads starting to remind me of what I remember the Symposium being like just with some random posts thrown in.

Better shut it down!

The pharmaceutical industry is indeed filled with corruption, but that doesn't invalidate the idea of chemical imbalance.

Every industry is filled with corruption.

Welcome to the machine

That's my favourite Floyd song ^

I like fast moving life. It would fucking blow to live any other time.

Pink Floyd...my one weakness! Argh!

Free-For-Some I: If you are a false don't entry!

Depressed people, here's an exercise for you. Complete this sentence:

If life gives you the back...

...grab its ass?

"grab the bitch and start to fist fuck?"

or something equally as vulgar...from gomorro? I don't remember.

Metal Archives Publcations presents : Gomorro's best quotes! Stay tuned for the next release, Napero's funniest lockposts.

Since my family knows the person who operates Far Wreck Candada, I got a tonne of punk CDs for my birthday. Around ten in all. Among them is a Rebel Spell CD. First saw the band in a basement of a record store a few years ago. They were supposed to be supporting Leftover Crack, but Leftover Crack wasn't allowed in the country. Can't wait to listen to it.

Edit - Yup, the album is fucking awesome.

...pack you lost in the 4th grade because you were on a field trip and were just a dumb kid, then you'd probably not care."

Goddamn it I said depressed people, not autistic manchildren.