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LotF
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2008 8:39 pm
Posts: 463
Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:02 pm 
 

It's hard saying this. Wintersun is one of my favorite bands. Jari really hasn't made anything bad; though I feel this time something unusual may happen.

He could really blow us all away. Now that he is actually putting time into it, and got a new computer (Mac with ProTools... I hope it is good then) the album is on its way.
Being such a long and drawn out project, we can expect the best pieces to make it on. Of course, how much will make it on? There are choirs, hundreds (!) of tracks all lined up and made from Jari + probably an MIDI device, along with drums + bass + guitar (and solos). This sounds like a dream, right?
It seems though from the way Jari and Kai have been talking, this will be really spread out. There will be acoustics, clean vocals, harsh vocals, a large Japanese influence (somehow), a full blown orchestra and tons of other stuff. Fanboys are creaming their pants over it and going "this will be the biggest and best album in the history of mankind." I do not disagree, but I find that when artists try things like this... sometimes too much occurs at once. Too many ideas permeate the album, and it could come out as a mess. I've thought "What if it is too classical oriented? What if it is too clean?

Jari said he wants more slower songs. Of course songs like Death and the Healing are great, but Winter Madness + Beautiful Death blew my mind. I don't know about you, but he is quite great in the speed field. I'm not trying to take away from his slower side, since the Ensiferum song "Eternal Wait" rocks my boat like no other.


My question is, do you think this will end up being a mess? I've seen people saying "It will kick ass on this board", yet others saying "This will be a massive disappointment."
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Nahsil
Clerical Sturmgeschütz

Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2006 2:06 pm
Posts: 3859
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:12 pm 
 

I'd rather wait to hear it than waste time on conjecture.
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Mark777
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:08 pm
Posts: 131
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:14 pm 
 

no such thing as too classical oriented.

I can't wait.
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Snowgrave
Under The Plaintive Sky

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:31 pm
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Location: U.S.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:14 pm 
 

It's going to pwn. Just stay optimistic.
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Uamenti
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 6:07 pm
Posts: 42
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:19 pm 
 

Personally I think It will slay. Jari has yet to put out a bad album.

hope it keeps the wintery atmosphere.

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Hjorlejf
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2008 10:06 pm
Posts: 250
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:32 pm 
 

Jari has stated on more than one occasion that the new album will be heavier than their debut, so it won't be too clean I suppose. I'm really looking forward to this album personally, I can't really picture Jari Maenpaa doing any bad music.

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MapleKit
34 going on 14

Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:43 pm
Posts: 529
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:33 pm 
 

I enjoy this band quite a bit and I am looking forward to hearing what's next. I doubt it will disappoint.

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CountBlagorath
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2008 7:11 pm
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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:49 pm 
 

I'm very excited about this album. Jari has done nothing but great work.
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Pfuntner
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 9:33 pm
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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:26 pm 
 

My friend and I were actually joking about this a few days ago. We thought that maybe all the delays were attempts to make us forget that he was actually going to release the album because it sucked so much.

In all seriousness, I think this album is going to rule and can't wait for it. Hey, if Chinese Democracy can have an official release date, Time can be released too.
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Grynfisher
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:43 pm
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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:36 pm 
 

He'd have to fashion the audial manifestation of Christ to live up to the expectations he's accrued.

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Expedience
Veteran

Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 4:22 am
Posts: 3761
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:07 pm 
 

He should have stayed in Ensiferum. Then again, Ensiferum are doing great without him...

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Scourge441
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:38 am
Posts: 839
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:12 pm 
 

Every album has the potential to be a disappointment. With Time, there will likely be as many people who love it as there are who hate it. Some people who loved Wintersun's debut will despise Time, and some who hated the debut will find Time to be a huge improvement. This happens every time a hyped up album is released.

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MeltedFace
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 12:29 am
Posts: 439
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:14 pm 
 

Nahsil wrote:
I'd rather wait to hear it than waste time on conjecture.



This sums up my thoughts. I hope it is a good album, but I haven't set up unattainable expectations in my mind.
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0kill
Patron Saint of Burglary

Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:26 am
Posts: 857
Location: Cascadia
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:28 pm 
 

It will be a good album, but I would prefer they release a few s/t-esque albums before they took on a gigantic five-year project. It probably won't be better than s/t anyways.
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norilor
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 7:27 pm
Posts: 336
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:09 pm 
 

Well time takes time.....you cannot rush an album like this.....

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BastardHead
Magic Mike

Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2005 7:53 pm
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Location: Oswego, Illinois
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:36 pm 
 

I'm calling it now, it'll be a let down, but the rabid fanboys will find reasons for it to be the greatest thing ever released. The self titled had two good songs (Beyond the Dark Sun and Winter Madness) and a bunch of boring filler crap (every other song). He left Ensiferum to make a band that was fairly similar. Wintersun sucked and Victory Songs was awesome. I smell a pattern in the works.
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Nahsil
Clerical Sturmgeschütz

Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2006 2:06 pm
Posts: 3859
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:49 pm 
 

BastardHead wrote:
I'm calling it now, it'll be a let down, but the rabid fanboys will find reasons for it to be the greatest thing ever released. The self titled had two good songs (Beyond the Dark Sun and Winter Madness) and a bunch of boring filler crap (every other song). He left Ensiferum to make a band that was fairly similar. Wintersun sucked and Victory Songs was awesome. I smell a pattern in the works.


Haha.

Beyond the Dark Sun was the radio hit. Winter Madness is alright but overrated. The best songs are everything after those two. Victory Songs sucks shit and Petri is a god awful vocallist.

Sometimes I truly believe people don't "get" Wintersun/Ensiferum. They're not in the same league as Kalmah and Norther and Skyfire and all those other Finnish shitstain bands. Jari has songwriting talent that shows up in everything he does. When he left Ensiferum it was OBVIOUS in the songwriting department.
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Uamenti
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 6:07 pm
Posts: 42
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:56 pm 
 

The songs on the s/t get better as the album progresses

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LindisfarneAnno793
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2007 1:09 am
Posts: 447
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:15 am 
 

Nahsil wrote:
Beyond the Dark Sun was the radio hit. Winter Madness is alright but overrated. The best songs are everything after those two. Victory Songs sucks shit and Petri is a god awful vocallist.

Sometimes I truly believe people don't "get" Wintersun/Ensiferum. They're not in the same league as Kalmah and Norther and Skyfire and all those other Finnish shitstain bands. Jari has songwriting talent that shows up in everything he does. When he left Ensiferum it was OBVIOUS in the songwriting department.


I agree with you completely. The departure of Jari from Ensiferum was associated with an immediate decline in that band's quality, but that being said, Jari is far from faultless, talented though he may be. I thought the Wintersun self-titled was good, but it could have been so much better. Ensiferum's post-Jari albums have been pale shadows of their achievement on the selt-titled album, which is a classic in my eyes.

Wintersun and Ensiferum are both talented projects, but on comparison I realise that the qualities I liked most about the self-titled Ensiferum were contributed by Jari (particularly his vocals, which are superbly fitting for the music they play). My grounds for saying this are that these intangible qualities were absent from the Ensiferum albums after Jari's departure (though this may be attributable to the band's potential wish to change their sound) but present on the Wintersun self-titled. Whatever the case, I'll continue to pay attention to both, but my hopes for Wintersun are far brighter. I am definitely looking forward to the new Wintersun album.

Grynfisher wrote:
He'd have to fashion the audial manifestation of Christ to live up to the expectations he's accrued.


:lol: It's funny because it's true.
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zeingard
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 7:49 pm
Posts: 545
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:17 am 
 

BastardHead wrote:
The self titled had two good songs (Beyond the Dark Sun and Winter Madness) and a bunch of boring filler crap (every other song). He left Ensiferum to make a band that was fairly similar.


Thank fuck someone else has a similar opinion to me, except for the 'Victory Songs' comment.

Wintersun are a horrendously pretentious band who play some awful hybrid of Children of Bodom and Ensiferum. The first two songs smoke but the rest is drawn out and fucking tedious; there's the occasional good riffs but it's sandwiched between boring riffs or unnecessary acoustic/folk/keyboard sections.

Rambling aside, 'Time' will suck the mighty suck.
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ZackP
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 1:36 am
Posts: 41
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:20 am 
 

Grynfisher wrote:
He'd have to fashion the audial manifestation of Lucifer to live up to the expectations he's accrued.


fixed.

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SepticTomb
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2008 11:56 pm
Posts: 515
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:32 am 
 

Nothing that he makes can possibly live up to the ball-clenching hype he's been generating over it. Nothing.
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Grynfisher
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:43 pm
Posts: 93
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:44 am 
 

ZackP wrote:
Grynfisher wrote:
He'd have to fashion the audial manifestation of Lucifer to live up to the expectations he's accrued.


fixed.


Clever, but this is Power Metal; flowery isn't the devil's adjective of choice.

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Bezerko
Vladimir Poopin

Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:50 am
Posts: 4806
Location: Venestraya
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:55 am 
 

Wintersun is not power metal, stop insulting power metal.

This band = :zzz:

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TheJizzHammer
Metalhead

Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 10:47 pm
Posts: 1205
Location: United States
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:55 am 
 

He's had more than enough time to work on this for it to not seem rushed. I don't know if it will slay, but I don't really think it will be a mess, either.

Unless he spent the past few years doing nothing but masturbating and eating cheetos, until he finally said "fuck, I'm supposed to be writing an album!"
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Grynfisher
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:43 pm
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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:58 am 
 

I never said that it isn't terrible, but it sure as hell isn't Death Metal.

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McCannFan
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:23 am
Posts: 338
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:04 am 
 

zeingard wrote:
BastardHead wrote:
The self titled had two good songs (Beyond the Dark Sun and Winter Madness) and a bunch of boring filler crap (every other song). He left Ensiferum to make a band that was fairly similar.


Thank fuck someone else has a similar opinion to me, except for the 'Victory Songs' comment.

Wintersun are a horrendously pretentious band who play some awful hybrid of Children of Bodom and Ensiferum. The first two songs smoke but the rest is drawn out and fucking tedious; there's the occasional good riffs but it's sandwiched between boring riffs or unnecessary acoustic/folk/keyboard sections.

Rambling aside, 'Time' will suck the mighty suck.


Well said.

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Bezerko
Vladimir Poopin

Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:50 am
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Location: Venestraya
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:12 am 
 

Grynfisher wrote:
I never said that it isn't terrible, but it sure as hell isn't Death Metal.


What are you on about? I know you never said it isn't terrible, you said it was power metal, which is clearly wrong. Of course it isn't death metal though, nobody ever said that.

They're definitely melodic death metal though, with other influences yes, but their core is ye olde melodeath.

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Grynfisher
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:43 pm
Posts: 93
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:38 am 
 

Bezerko wrote:
What are you on about? I know you never said it isn't terrible, you said it was power metal, which is clearly wrong.


Every aspect of their music, be it the keyboards, riffs, solos, song lengths, or tone, sounds like Power Metal to me.

If they're Death Metal, then so is Children of Bodom.

Quote:
Of course it isn't death metal though, nobody ever said that.

Melodeath is Death Metal, technically.

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Kruel
Veteran

Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:56 pm
Posts: 3426
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:41 am 
 

How? So nu metal is technically metal?

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VictimsOfDeception
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2006 5:00 pm
Posts: 1481
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:54 am 
 

Kruel wrote:
How? So nu metal is technically metal?


His logic would say so. :)

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Grynfisher
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:43 pm
Posts: 93
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 2:03 am 
 

Kruel wrote:
How? So nu metal is technically metal?


I was under the impression that early In Flames or At the Gates, for example, were objectively considered Death Metal against my will, but I'm no genre connoisseur.

Even if not, I don't see how Wintersun's music, sans for vocals, couldn't be considered Power Metal.

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Bezerko
Vladimir Poopin

Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:50 am
Posts: 4806
Location: Venestraya
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 2:34 am 
 

:durr: Sigh, here we go again...

BECAUSE IT SOUNDS NOTHING LIKE POWER METAL.

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Grynfisher
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2008 8:43 pm
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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 3:03 am 
 

:shock: Concise and informative. Sir, I concede.

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OlioTheSmall
Handsome (marsupial) Beast

Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:08 pm
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Location: Australia
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 4:01 am 
 

BastardHead wrote:
I'm calling it now, it'll be a let down, but the rabid fanboys will find reasons for it to be the greatest thing ever released. The self titled had two good songs (Beyond the Dark Sun and Winter Madness) and a bunch of boring filler crap (every other song). He left Ensiferum to make a band that was fairly similar. Wintersun sucked and Victory Songs was awesome. I smell a pattern in the works.


The first album I've found myself disagreeing with BastardHead. The Wintersun debut is perhaps my favourite album of all time. As far as "Time" is concerned; there is no telling until we hear it. Jari is incredibly talented and won't put out an album that he knows is bad. I'm willing to bet that it will be very good (well I certainly hope it will be), whether or not it matches the quality of the debut is another story.
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Humanity_Lost
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2008 1:07 pm
Posts: 80
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:13 am 
 

What are you guys talking about, "Battle against time" was a really good song, not a filler.

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MokomakiKusimuki
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 12:23 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Finland
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:17 am 
 

It will disappoint like everything that Jari has been involved with so far.

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Wet Pussy
Waterlogged

Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 12:13 pm
Posts: 4323
Location: Pakistan
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:36 am 
 

Bezerko wrote:
:durr: Sigh, here we go again...

BECAUSE IT SOUNDS NOTHING LIKE POWER METAL.


Put clean vocals over Wintersun and they will sound like Dragonforce.
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Traver
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:10 am
Posts: 247
Location: Denmark
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:58 am 
 

Hjorlejf wrote:
Jari has stated on more than one occasion that the new album will be heavier than their debut, so it won't be too clean I suppose. I'm really looking forward to this album personally, I can't really picture Jari Maenpaa doing any bad music.


Yeah, and whenever a band has said "GUYS THIS NEXT ALBUM WILL BE THE HEAVIEST SHIT WE'VE EVER DONE WOW", it has always been true.

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Hybrid_Killer
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 1:32 am
Posts: 652
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 6:06 am 
 

Traver wrote:
Hjorlejf wrote:
Jari has stated on more than one occasion that the new album will be heavier than their debut, so it won't be too clean I suppose. I'm really looking forward to this album personally, I can't really picture Jari Maenpaa doing any bad music.


Yeah, and whenever a band has said "GUYS THIS NEXT ALBUM WILL BE THE HEAVIEST SHIT WE'VE EVER DONE WOW", it has always been true.


As opposed to to people who'll flame the album before its out and will hate it no matter what?

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