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gunnerdeath
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 100
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:51 am 
 

Hi there! I currently have an epihone explorer with sd sh6 superdistortion but I want to get a better, more professional, guitar.
I mainly play death and black metal, so I want a guitar that can put up with that.
I've looked up some models:
Dean Dixie Rebel
Dean ML Knight
DBZ Bird of Prey
Jackson RRTMG
Fernandes Monterey Deluxe

Any suggestions? I'm sure there're a lot of people that know a shitload about guitars!
Cheers!

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InThyKingdom
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 4:25 am
Posts: 156
Location: Bulgaria
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:54 am 
 

Get sum 7str. Schecter.
if u prefer V forms:
Spoiler: show
Image

And my favorite:
Image
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Last edited by InThyKingdom on Wed Jul 31, 2013 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Kain797
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 6:25 am
Posts: 14
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 10:04 am 
 

http://www.agileguitars.org/

Thank me later.

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somefella
Veteran

Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:57 pm
Posts: 2662
Location: Singapore
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:22 pm 
 

There's no hard and fast rule on what guitar can do what genre. Jim Root plays Slipknot with Fenders, Bill Steer from Carcass and Jon Schaffer from Iced Earth both use Gibson Les Pauls. Here's one general rule I heard from Jon though. If you're looking to play the more precise kinda metal, like tech death or thrash metal where you want to hear a lot of picking dynamics, go for a low-output pickup through a high gain amp, as opposed to the other way around. Not low as in single coil fender kinda low, but maybe a Seymour Duncan JB, as opposed to a Super Distortion or whatever.
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ShaolinLambKiller
King Asshole

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:10 pm
Posts: 12156
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:48 pm 
 

the pointier the better.

if you aren't in danger of losing an eye while playing then it's not right.

Actually i'm a big fan of the Deans. I'm not sure what the models are. one is an old flying V and the other looks like that Knight but in sunburst stain and an old 7 string.

I like Jacksons as well I have 4 of them. 2 kellys, a warrior, and a V. not sure the exacts. most I got 2nd hand and I just tried them out a good bit before purchasing.
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Zodijackyl
Lazy Wizard

Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:39 pm
Posts: 5010
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:48 pm 
 

Avoid any Dimebag guitars that Dean makes, they tend to be overpriced gimmicky shit. Oddly enough, I have liked the cheapest Deans that I have played ($99 new) better than some of the more expensive ones. I'm not a fan of them so I don't know them too well.

More recent production-line Jacksons have seen a significant decrease in quality. The older ones as well as some of the higher end ones are good, but I would avoid anything recent with a cheap Floyd Rose like the plague. I can't give a hard cutoff but I wouldn't go for a new Jackson right now.

Among the best new guitars I have played in recent years were the BC Rich NJ series, ESP's 400-series LTDs, and most of Schecter's guitars. ESP has been cheaping out on their affordable guitars in the last few years, cutting out good hardware in the more reasonably priced models, but Schecter seems to be quite good with that still.

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ShaolinLambKiller
King Asshole

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:10 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 2:39 pm 
 

Yea that's a note I left out, all my guitars are at least 10 + years old.
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gunnerdeath
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 100
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 3:01 pm 
 

Thanks a lot guys for replying.
Any thoughts on the DBZ?

I know Jackson's quality has decreased, so a model from the 90's could be a good purchase?
I'm surprised you said that about the DIME models, I've heard they're wonderful guitars, for $1000 you can get a dixie rebel which I've heard is a woderful guitar.
Yeah a lot of people have told me that Schecter guitars are awesome, but the shape just doesn't do it for me.

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infinitenexus
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 2:35 am
Posts: 1939
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 3:15 pm 
 

Haven't played any DBZs before, I've heard a few things about them and they look nice at least. That's the limit on my knowledge.

For $1000 you can have Carvin build you a guitar that'll be not only customized to your liking but higher quality than anything else new in that price range. It'll be a fairly standard (boring) shape though.

I second getting a used guitar. They're cheaper and often just better. Newer guitars are getting cheap. My favorite guitar and one of my main ones is from 1984.

I say just get anything like a flying V with a humbucker in the bridge position. You can't really go wrong with that, in terms of a metal guitar.
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ShaolinLambKiller
King Asshole

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:10 pm
Posts: 12156
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 3:16 pm 
 

i'd save my money and get the lower end Deans instead. I like schecter but never bought one.

I would say a 90's model is pretty good.

never played a DBZ. have no thoughts on it.
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somefella
Veteran

Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:57 pm
Posts: 2662
Location: Singapore
PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 1:33 pm 
 

Schecter all the way. Even the budget models are good enough for a pickup change to make em shine.
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Azat7
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:31 am
Posts: 3
Location: Ukraine
PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 2:01 pm 
 

At the moment I can not afford a lot of money on musical instruments. But kachestvunnuyu listen to music I like. And it can be done only on quality instruments.
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Chainsaw Omega
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 1:43 pm
Posts: 108
Location: United States
PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 8:30 pm 
 

It very much depends on what you play and how you play? If you are a shred guy, a floyd rose is great to have. I myself will never own a guitar with one as I simply have no use for it. Also, telling me you play death and black metal isn't much help. You could mean stuff like Obituary and Burzum, or you could mean Cannibal Corpse and Emperor, which would require an entirely different instrument approach. I personally prefer timeless instruments that can be used in multiple forms of music. I have a strong preference to Gibson and to a certain extent, ESP.

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Iron1
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:04 am
Posts: 73
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 6:56 am 
 

I've been drinking the Ibanez Koolaid for nearly two decades. Wicked fast necks, great sound (with the right pups/pedals/amp), well-balanced and are versatile for either chunky riffs or intricate scales.
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gunnerdeath
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 100
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 1:35 pm 
 

Thanks a lot guys for replying.
Chainsaw Omega, I play from technical death metal to old school death metal, and also from stuff like marduk to stuff like carach angren.. I want a guitar that's versatile. I liked what you said about timeless instruments or what Iron1 said about Ibanez, altought I don't know anything about Ibanez.
I think I'm gonna go for the DBZ or for an old jackson, or a Dean.

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ShaolinLambKiller
King Asshole

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:10 pm
Posts: 12156
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 3:47 pm 
 

I def say Dean is greater for OSDM though I've easily playing some tech death with it with adjusting a few settings on my amp. Jacksons, or at least the ones I have worked well for both without having to adjust anything aside from what I was playing.
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gunnerdeath
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 100
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 4:06 pm 
 

What about Charvel? I know it's not the first guitar you think of when you talk about extreme metal, but I can get a model 2 fom 86 for 450€ and I think that with the right pickup it may work... What do you guys think=

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ShaolinLambKiller
King Asshole

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:10 pm
Posts: 12156
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 4:12 pm 
 

Charvel's I see used more for 80's hair metal style. Never really played one that I actually liked.
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http://www.cavepaints.com <--Horrid art and musics.
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gunnerdeath
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 100
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 4:16 pm 
 

Me too, I know it's total EVH style. I'll try it out and see how I like it, I've never player a Charvel but I just because glam metal player use them more that doesn't mean it's not gonna work for death metal, imho.

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ShaolinLambKiller
King Asshole

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:10 pm
Posts: 12156
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 4:25 pm 
 

I know, I don't think that you picked up on the last thing I said... Never played on one I liked. I've tried them out. They just don't feel right on the neck, and most of them are dinky body type and I'm not really a fan of that.
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A bunch of mp3s is not a collection of anything.
http://www.cavepaints.com <--Horrid art and musics.
http://www.facebook.com/MaulerCustomCabs <--- huge heavy/loud boxes I build.
http://speedritualrecords.storenvy.com/ Check out my music here

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gunnerdeath
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 100
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 4:27 pm 
 

My bad mate. I'm trying a Dixie Rebel next week and I'll let you guys know! (not a big fan of the artwork on the guitar though).

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ShaolinLambKiller
King Asshole

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:10 pm
Posts: 12156
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 4:29 pm 
 

that's what power sanders are for.
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http://www.cavepaints.com <--Horrid art and musics.
http://www.facebook.com/MaulerCustomCabs <--- huge heavy/loud boxes I build.
http://speedritualrecords.storenvy.com/ Check out my music here

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Iron1
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:04 am
Posts: 73
Location: United States
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:30 am 
 

ShaolinLambKiller wrote:
Charvel's I see used more for 80's hair metal style. Never really played one that I actually liked.


I used to have a Charvel back in the day that I used for Thrash metal. Had a nice Exodus sort of tone to it. IIRC, it had Jackson's version of EMG pickups in it...
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Porman
Sweek Souvlaki Muncher

Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 5:00 pm
Posts: 1547
Location: Sweden
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 8:30 am 
 

I think you should focus on getting a guitar that you like, rather than getting a guitar that "fits" a certain type of music.

I've seen death metal bands use everything from Strats with humbuckers, Gibson SG's to the more common types generaly associated with extreme types of metal.
You can always change pickups and hardware.
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xpsychoblissx
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:18 am
Posts: 294
Location: Phoenix, AZ
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:38 am 
 

To be honest, the suggestion of Agile guitars is a great one. They make good quality stuff for the money...They have Agile Septors with active pickups for about $400, and they play as good as a guitar that costs twice as much.

OR, you can do what I did, and go to GuitarCenter.com, and find a nice used guitar. I found an ESP LTD MH-400NT on there for $330. When they were new they cost anywhere between $700-900. Probably one of the best guitars I've ever bought. Not only that, but if the guitar you buy isn't satisfactory there's a 30 day warranty even on used equipment.
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Dragunov
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Dec 29, 2004 6:34 pm
Posts: 2357
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:52 pm 
 

ShaolinLambKiller wrote:
Charvel's I see used more for 80's hair metal style. Never really played one that I actually liked.


I got lucky with mine. Got an old Charvel by Jackson Strat style guitar for $100, tore out the pickups, put in a single DiMarzio Super Distortion humbucker, and it was ready for mayhem. Balanced well, isn't too heavy, and that pickup swap made all the difference.
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infinitenexus
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 2:35 am
Posts: 1939
PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 4:53 pm 
 

Definitely go for a used one. I second the rec to get a used one from Guitar Center, my local one has a bunch of great metal guitars that are used and really affordable, like $300 and under. Definitely don't worry too much about shapes and brands and all fitting a type of music. If it has a humbucker in the bridge position, it can play any kind of metal. Get a shape you're happy with, that's about all that really matters with. A guitar you like.
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xpsychoblissx
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:18 am
Posts: 294
Location: Phoenix, AZ
PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:01 pm 
 

infinitenexus wrote:
If it has a humbucker in the bridge position, it can play any kind of metal. Get a shape you're happy with, that's about all that really matters with. A guitar you like.


+1 on that...

I bought my wife an ESP LTD M-50 for $120 and it works just fine. I actually recorded an entire song with it because it's such a neutral sounding and playing guitar. A lot more enjoyable to play than my old Agile Reaper.

I recorded this song with it:

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infinitenexus
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 2:35 am
Posts: 1939
PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:15 pm 
 

One of my albums I recorded about 90% of the guitars with a flying V that I built, and it was a flying V shape with a telecaster neck, telecaster bridge and single-coil sized humbucker. Some of it was recorded with the original single coil. Even with the single coil it was fine, the (fake) amp I used had enough gain, and with the heavy strings and low tuning (B standard) there was still plenty of low end (The humbucker was better though). So really just get one you like.
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gunnerdeath
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 100
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 4:06 pm 
 

I think you are right guys. I tried out the Charvel and loved it so that's why I thought "why the hell not?".
I'm gonna install a SD Black Winter on it, chuffed!
Thanks everyone for all the advices!

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Porman
Sweek Souvlaki Muncher

Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2005 5:00 pm
Posts: 1547
Location: Sweden
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 5:13 pm 
 

Good. Glad you found a guitar that you are comfortable with.
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Auspicium
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2008 4:33 pm
Posts: 229
PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 6:03 am 
 

I actually really loved my old Jay Turser strat knockoff that I recorded everything with up until last year. However, that single-coil sound is very distinctive and finicky to get to have a decent metal tone, especially for the more extreme styles of metal. I have an Epi LP studio now, I like the sound and balance of it, but I find myself wishing it had a faster neck.

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gunnerdeath
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:55 am
Posts: 100
PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 7:59 am 
 

I'm happy with my Charvel, I know it'll deliver.
Anyone knows where can you get the new Seymour Duncan Black Winter? Can't find them in any of the German shops or in any other shop.

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xpsychoblissx
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:18 am
Posts: 294
Location: Phoenix, AZ
PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:35 am 
 

gunnerdeath wrote:
I'm happy with my Charvel, I know it'll deliver.
Anyone knows where can you get the new Seymour Duncan Black Winter? Can't find them in any of the German shops or in any other shop.


Cool, glad you came to a decision!

I live in America, so I'm not sure if they're available in any stores here, but I know I can order them online...

http://www.zzounds.com/item--SEMBWPICK
http://www.gearhounds.com/seymour-duncan-black-winter-tb-pickups-bridge.aspx?gclid=CIbJ4-GXgrkCFa9cQgodWngAXQ
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/BkWinterTBB?utm_source=Google&utm_medium=PPC&utm_campaign=none&device=c&network=g&matchtype=&gclid=CJmUo-2XgrkCFS6CQgodwC8Aog
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Zodijackyl
Lazy Wizard

Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:39 pm
Posts: 5010
Location: United States
PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 11:37 pm 
 

xpsychoblissx wrote:
To be honest, the suggestion of Agile guitars is a great one. They make good quality stuff for the money...They have Agile Septors with active pickups for about $400, and they play as good as a guitar that costs twice as much.

OR, you can do what I did, and go to GuitarCenter.com, and find a nice used guitar. I found an ESP LTD MH-400NT on there for $330. When they were new they cost anywhere between $700-900. Probably one of the best guitars I've ever bought. Not only that, but if the guitar you buy isn't satisfactory there's a 30 day warranty even on used equipment.


I completely agree on this. Agile guitars are a great value, and I'd likely go for one if I was buying a guitar with a lower budget - anything less than an LTD 400 series. They're certainly better than any other starter guitars when prices are compared (as they're the same thing at a lower price, from the same type of factories) and they work with some very good factories even on the higher end stuff. I know some of their stuff, especially higher end, is made by Unsung, and the Epiphone Les Paul I have that was built by Unsung in 1998 is better than the lower-end American-made Gibson from 2006 that I recently parted with.

My main guitar for years has been an ESP LTD MH-401QMNT - presumably the same as yours but with a quilted maple top? I paid $499 or 549 for it as an unopened restock many years ago and it is amazing in every way. I know they are changing up their branding system, but everything made through at least 2011 is the best at this level, by far. The only advice I need to give is to only use lemon oil to clean the neck - Ernie Ball fretboard wipes take the dye out of the wood, and that type of thing doesn't work as well either.

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Nightwisher1990
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2009 6:26 pm
Posts: 479
PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 12:14 pm 
 

You might consider it really cheap, I have this one and I totally recommend it it comes with active EMG's great for the budget.
http://www.cortguitars.com/en/product/vx-2x
It has a Tune O Matic bridge, great for any kind of metal.
here's a test demo I've recorded with it using laptop's sound card (without using my mixer and main sound card).
http://www.speedyshare.com/nKGaB/Demo-Death-Metal.mp3

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CF_Mono
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2010 5:21 pm
Posts: 1535
PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:26 pm 
 

I came very close to buying a Carvin. They are very precise and can be used for technical metal. You're basically eliminating risk buying from them I've heard. I ended up getting a great steal of a deal on this used Dean ML and have been blown away with it. Yes, the dimebag models are gimmicky, but I don't think all of their models have taken a hit in quality. Mine has great intonation and action, shreds like a beast, and sounds great. Definitely meant more for thrash and speed metal though, not really tech death or anything like that. I would not go with a Schecter though. I used to like them when I didn't know any better. I guess for the price they're ok, but mine has a twisted neck, glitchy electronics, and the stock pickups are muddy as hell, no matter how far I raise/lower them.

Probably the nest suggestion in this thread so far would be Agile. Wish I looked into them more last time around.
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infinitenexus
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 2:35 am
Posts: 1939
PostPosted: Mon Aug 19, 2013 9:15 pm 
 

If you have the extra bucks to get a Carvin, you really can't go wrong with them. I played an older one once and it felt perfect in my hands, other than the strat-esque shape (which I'm not used to). Their quality is absolutely top notch.

I've also heard a lot of good things about Agile, a lot of people say they're about the best you can get for the price. I've come close to ordering one before, I just don't like to buy made in China stuff. I try to support 'Merica.
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KFD
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 08, 2006 8:19 pm
Posts: 1064
Location: France
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 3:51 pm 
 

I don't know if the OP has actually bought his new guitar, but here's my point of view:

If you buy a used guitar, be aware that the internal electronics might be fucked up or fragile and need some fixing.

I think it's better to buy a very good and very expensive versatile guitar than to buy 3 or 4 different guitars, because in the end you will mostly play on one guitar and leave the others on their rack. If you can afford an ESP Horizon, I tried it and found it quite great, I even wanted to buy one at some point.

Most important: don't buy any guitar without trying it beforehand with a configuration similar to your home gear. Buying a guitar online without ever touching it for real is a bad option.

Getting a new guitar doesn't really upgrade your tone quality, at least not in proportion to the price spent, even with modified pick-ups. In fact the tone and sound are quite secondary as long as you have - as another user said - humbuckers in the bridge position.

Here are the most important criteria to my eyes:
- the guitar's weight
- versatility between different pick-up positions
- playing comfort (play sitting or standing, guitar shape, neck).
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ShaolinLambKiller
King Asshole

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:10 pm
Posts: 12156
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 4:31 pm 
 

Totally and completely disagree about buying one single guitar. If you are happy with that, that's fine and you are among a rarity of guitarists that only have one. I know none, be it through their career, personally, in passing, or whatever. I only know a single person that had 2 guitars at a minimum.

disagree about buying a guitar online without ever touching it. If you already know enough about a certain guitar, and sometimes you get a surprise and find something you just can't live without. My very first Jackson, which was a V I bought off ebay and it was insanely great... Had never played on a Jackson before in my life before that. Now I own 4 of them.
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