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Bubonic Metal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:01 am
Posts: 11
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 1:38 pm 
 

I had some concerns about the accuracy and reliability of reviews done by fellow users on all the glorious bands that exist in the archives. I understand that everyone is entitled to an opinion, which is also exactly why I'm typing this, so bear with me. Usually the reason anyone would feel the need to write a review for a band is because they have some feedback that is worth sharing. I would assume that they enjoyed it enough to submit a review in the first place if their willing to give time consuming, long, and specific paragraphs. When I'm interested in a band or hear about a band, I like to check the reviews to see if anything truly helpful or positive can be found. See if there's any similarities in what I listen to. I like to read what the listener/reviewer feels from the bands songs by actually sitting down and giving it a good listen instead of a brush over or some crap story.

I don't like reading about what a band should be or what they are doing wrong or how they could be better. Personally if I don't like a band, I won't take the time to write a negative review about it. If you want people to steer clear from a shitty band badly enough that your determined to write a review about them I don't see the point. If its so terribly shitty, why the hell are you worried about people listening to it? I'm sure they'll stop quickly on their own. I very much like the system being used to suggest similar bands by liking or disliking the suggestions, which disappear or appear depending on the votes. I think the same liking/disliking system should be used on reviews, with a little catch. Instead of making the review disappear like the similar suggestions do, have both the likes and dislikes displayed on the review so people can determine themselves how true the review was depending on the dominating vote. Don't assume I'm saying there shouldn't be any bad reviews.

On a side note, I wouldn't want the positive reviews necessarily at the top of the list but in the same order as they are now. This will help the 'majority' of people who know and listen to the band vote for what they believe is an inaccurate or accurate review. Then someone like me who comes to a review for positive insight about a band has all the bands highlights jam packed into a decent fan-made or enthusiast-made review. That's just my suggestion, what do you guys think? Please don't bash me, I'm simply asking for like/dislike labels.. or in the simplest sense, organization.


Last edited by Bubonic Metal on Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:21 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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BastardHead
Magic Mike

Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2005 7:53 pm
Posts: 5095
Location: Oswego, Illinois
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 1:55 pm 
 

Every review is truthful by virtue of the fact that it's an opinion. The idea for a rating or likes/dislikes system for reviews has been brought up several times and the bottom line is that it just will not happen. The politics and flame wars and buttwhining would be absolutely immense, and it's not worth the trouble in the first place.

As for the rest of the post, all I can say is suck it up and deal with the fact that some people don't like albums. Negative reviews will always happen and I'm glad they do. "Nice reviews only" can die in a fire.
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Metantoine
The XVI, dominar to over 258714 subjects

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
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Location: Québec
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 1:59 pm 
 

We really don't want to turn MA into a social community like facebook or Imgur with "likes" and "dislikes", we want the reviews to be read and not glimpsed at for 5 seconds and an "upvote or downvote" system would do the opposite. At least the owners don't want to, I'm a bit interested by allowing feedback on reviews, but that's not my decision to make.

I must tell you all the reviewers disagree with you concerning the negative reviews. Reviewing is offering an opinion, negative or positive. I'm sure you're fine about negative reviews for movies, well it's the same for music. If it's shit and the reviewer wants his opinion to be known, well so be it and that's totally fine with us.

Please next time, can you separate your idea into paragraphs? A wall of text is hard to read.

Edit: What BH said.
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Bubonic Metal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:01 am
Posts: 11
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:02 pm 
 

BastardHead wrote:
Every review is truthful by virtue of the fact that it's an opinion. The idea for a rating or likes/dislikes system for reviews has been brought up several times and the bottom line is that it just will not happen. The politics and flame wars and buttwhining would be absolutely immense, and it's not worth the trouble in the first place.

As for the rest of the post, all I can say is suck it up and deal with the fact that some people don't like albums. Negative reviews will always happen and I'm glad they do. "Nice reviews only" can die in a fire.



Yeah, it could be a fact if someone truly believes their own review. I see the truth in that. There's always going to be politics and flame wars as you put it, so I don't see how that would change. Instead of having to read every review would you not agree it would make it easier to see what the votes are? And yes, I know people don't like albums and I'm fine with reading a few bad reviews. Your distasteful attitude towards nice reviews is a pity. I'm sure you've got good things to say about your favorite bands, no?

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Bubonic Metal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:01 am
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:04 pm 
 

Metantoine wrote:
We really don't want to turn MA into a social community like facebook or Imgur with "likes" and "dislikes", we want the reviews to be read and not glimpsed at for 5 seconds and an "upvote or downvote" system would do the opposite. At least the owners don't want to, I'm a bit interested by allowing feedback on reviews, but that's my decision to make.

I must tell you all the reviewers disagree with you concerning the negative reviews. Reviewing is offering an opinion, negative or positive. I'm sure you're fine about negative reviews for movies, well it's the same for music. If it's shit and the reviewer wants his opinion to be known, well so be it and that's totally fine with us.

Please next time, can you separate your idea into paragraphs? A wall of text is hard to read.

Edit: What BH said.


If a forum isn't a social community then I'm missing the point of this site. I didn't say 'No negative reviews, ever'. Oh and sorry about the text wall and thanks for taking the time to read it anyway.

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Azmodes
Ultranaut

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:44 am
Posts: 5612
Location: Gradec, Austria
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:12 pm 
 

Agreed with BH and Tony.

Bubonic Metal wrote:
If a forum isn't a social community then I'm missing the point of this site.

Reviews are a site feature. The forum is obviously connected, but ultimately separate.

Bubonic Metal wrote:
Your distasteful attitude towards nice reviews is a pity. I'm sure you've got good things to say about your favorite bands, no?

He didn't say he doesn't like nice (i.e. positive) reviews on principle. He dislikes "Nice reviews only", meaning the assumption that negative reviews aren't worth reading and/or should be avoided. Which is a pretty reasonable stance to have when it comes to critiquing works of art, if you ask me.
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Bubonic Metal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:01 am
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:18 pm 
 

Azmodes wrote:
Agreed with BH and Tony.

Bubonic Metal wrote:
If a forum isn't a social community then I'm missing the point of this site.

Reviews are a site feature. The forum is obviously connected, but ultimately separate.

Bubonic Metal wrote:
Your distasteful attitude towards nice reviews is a pity. I'm sure you've got good things to say about your favorite bands, no?

He didn't say he doesn't like nice (i.e. positive) reviews on principle. He dislikes "Nice reviews only", meaning the assumption that negative reviews aren't worth reading and/or should be avoided.


Fair enough. I'm just saying I think that would further compliment the site, because I very much like the similar band voting system. It would be harmony if both were implemented, and the forums would still be here for the debaters to go at it on their own accord if they wish to further a review(s) discussion. It also wouldnt just be nice reviews. I never said that. Negative reviews wouldn't be threatened in any way, especially if you listed the likes dislikes inside of the actual review instead of in the list of them.

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Azmodes
Ultranaut

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:44 am
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:30 pm 
 

I admit that it could be potentially useful and interesting to see in action. I'm just unsure about how effective it would be in the end and how often it would just be used as a tool for flaming and downvoting perfectly alright negative reviews for people's favourite bands. People would probably be more inclined to grade the opinion of the reviewer and not the actual quality of the content. Votes can paint a misleading picture of reviews just as much -if not more so- as review scores can of bands. We don't want to emphasise votes at the expense of the actual review and that would be somewhat difficult to avoid, I think, even if we only included them with the actual, single review.

In any case, I know that the owners have said no to this in the past, it will almost definitely never happen.
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Bubonic Metal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:01 am
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:36 pm 
 

Azmodes wrote:
I admit that it could be potentially useful and interesting to see in action. I'm just unsure about how effective it would be in the end and how often it would just be used as a tool for flaming and downvoting perfectly alright negative reviews for people's favourite bands. Votes can paint a misleading picture of reviews just as much -if not more so- as review scores can of bands. We don't want to emphasise votes at the expense of the actual review and that would be somewhat difficult to avoid, I think, even if we only included them with the actual, single review.

In any case, I know that the owners have said no to this in the past, it will almost definitely never happen.


I think I see your point. You value every review whether its bad, good, unbiased, biased, etc. You guys don't want to set them apart from each other so they can all be read fairly, correct? Its so wounding to see some of the reviews people submit and I feel unsatisfied after reading them. I'm always on the constant search to add new songs to my flash drive for the car ride. It would help me find the information I seek on certain bands so much faster but I guess it would have already been done if it really needed it. If only there were some way to make a compromise.

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Metantoine
The XVI, dominar to over 258714 subjects

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 3:21 pm 
 

You in another thread: "My favorite bands to date that I've been listening to recently go as follows; Sylosis, Lamb Of God, Mastodon, Chimaira, DevilDriver, Attila, Parkway Drive, Static X, and Dethklok for fun."

Oh I know why you dislike negative reviews now! :oh shit:
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Bubonic Metal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:01 am
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 3:24 pm 
 

Metantoine wrote:
You in another thread: "My favorite bands to date that I've been listening to recently go as follows; Sylosis, Lamb Of God, Mastodon, Chimaira, DevilDriver, Attila, Parkway Drive, Static X, and Dethklok for fun."

Oh I know why you dislike negative reviews now! :oh shit:


Yeah, I bet you loved having the chance to tell me that. I didn't know variety was a crime.

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Metantoine
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 3:36 pm 
 

It was a joke, I even used an emoticon, calm down. The fact is that most of these bands are not well liked by the community and are receiving bad reviews. This combined with your proposal underlines some kind of bias or at least some bitterness. Maybe it's not the case, but it's my perception. This part in particular appeared to be a frustrated answer.

"Personally if I don't like a band, I won't take the time to write a negative review about it. If you want people to steer clear from a shitty band badly enough that your determined to write a review about them I don't see the point. If its so terribly shitty, why the hell are you worried about people listening to it? I'm sure they'll stop quickly on their own."
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
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Location: Where the dead rule the night
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 3:54 pm 
 

So basically you're saying you want to be able to "vote up" reviews, so that you can read more of the positive reviews and know what you're going to like easier? Seems lazy as hell, dude. If you don't have enough time or patience to go read reviews yourself, why should the site cater to your inability to just take time in honing your musical tastes?

This combined with your immediate defensive martyr stance about liking all of those bands Metantoine just listed, makes me agree with him: you're just whining because people bashed bands you like. It sounds like you personally just don't like reading some negative reviews and now want to revise the site's system due to this...the idea I guess isn't the worst ever, but your intentions here just make you sound really lazy and immature.

To that end, I don't really like this idea anyway. The voting up and down for similar bands works because it's not about personal opinion and quality, just about objective sound similarities. Reviews are more subjective. Any art released is subjected to criticism and praise from anyone. Negative reviews are necessary to appreciation and analysis of art. That's just how it is.
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Bubonic Metal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:01 am
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 4:17 pm 
 

Empyreal wrote:
So basically you're saying you want to be able to "vote up" reviews, so that you can read more of the positive reviews and know what you're going to like easier? Seems lazy as hell, dude. If you don't have enough time or patience to go read reviews yourself, why should the site cater to your inability to just take time in honing your musical tastes?

This combined with your immediate defensive martyr stance about liking all of those bands Metantoine just listed, makes me agree with him: you're just whining because people bashed bands you like. It sounds like you personally just don't like reading some negative reviews and now want to revise the site's system due to this...the idea I guess isn't the worst ever, but your intentions here just make you sound really lazy and immature.

To that end, I don't really like this idea anyway. The voting up and down for similar bands works because it's not about personal opinion and quality, just about objective sound similarities. Reviews are more subjective. Any art released is subjected to criticism and praise from anyone. Negative reviews are necessary to appreciation and analysis of art. That's just how it is.


Seems like all of you on here have the same objective attitude. Thats fine. You can play favorites man. I came here purely for music, your feeding me shit instead. This post was a suggestion for organization. Sitting on the computer wasting time IS BEING LAZY. Funny how you called me lazy because I won't sit at the computer. So the voting system for similar bands is lazy and immature too huh? Fuck off I don't need a trolls opinion.

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GuntherTheUndying
Crimson King, Eater of Worlds

Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:36 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 4:20 pm 
 

I love it when people come here and act like they should be treated like kings or queens because they are who they are. You opened this can of worms by making this thread, and now you're getting pissed? Get over yourself.

Got a problem with the reviews? Don't read them. That was easy.
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Bubonic Metal
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 2:01 am
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 4:24 pm 
 

GuntherTheUndying wrote:
I love it when people come here and act like they should be treated like kings or queens because they are who they are. You opened this can of worms by making this thread, and now you're getting pissed? Get over yourself.

Got a problem with the reviews? Don't read them. That was easy.


How am I pissed? I'm using the same exact way of typing you guys are. I don't assume your automatically pissed off just by reading your text. When have I asked for kingly treatment? Its a fucking suggestion dude, its almost like your trying to talk for me.

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Metantoine
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Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 4:32 pm 
 

You told Empy to fuck off and you called him a troll...While his post was perfectly fine.

Time to lock this thread since you got your answer and this becoming sad.
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Morrigan
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 5:25 pm 
 

Quote:
you're just whining because people bashed bands you like.

lol, saw that coming in the very first post. "I don't like reading negative reviews" always, always comes from someone who's had his precious favourite bands bashed.
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Cursarion
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 6:56 am
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 3:51 am 
 

Erm, isn't the solution to his actual problem trivial anyway? He should only read reviews with 90+ (or something) scores and ignore the rest.
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Napero
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 4:50 am 
 

No, his problem is the very existence of those negative reviews. They need to be buried in vaults built of dislikes, so that no one can see them.
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