Encyclopaedia Metallum: The Metal Archives

Message board

* FAQ    * Search   * Register   * Login 



Reply to topic
Author Message Previous topic | Next topic
ExEcutionEr
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:53 pm
Posts: 11
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:33 pm 
 

This question goes out to the people behind and running the Metal Archives.

I'm honestly sick of all the latest "Single" entries here on MA.

Band XY puts up a new song on facebook. Shortly after the song is up on youtube and one week later it has been ripped in bad quality by hundreds of people, floating around on the internet, tagged as "Band XY - New Single". So I head over to Band XY's facebook just to find out the new track is only a pre-production for the new album.
A good example is the latest 8 Foot Sativa "Single" Sleepwalkers. It's nowhere to be found (the usual suspects: amazon, iTunes, mailorder) because it was released as video clip only.

So what's the definition of a "Single" and what kind of "Singles" are/should be allowed here on the Metal Archives ?
I personally classify a "Single" as something I am actually able to buy. No matter if it's a 1-track Single or 5-track Maxi CD - I should be able somehow to purchase the release.

My suggestion would be, "Single" entries have to be approved. People have to provide a link to a mailorder or online retailer just like I have to provide a source for reports.

*EDIT*
Forgot about "download only". The Last Alliance's Moskau free non-profit download single is a fine example. Of course those should be allowed and are valid entries.


Last edited by ExEcutionEr on Tue Feb 07, 2012 7:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
Morrigan
Crone of War

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 7:27 am
Posts: 9729
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 7:06 pm 
 

Pre-moderating singles would simply cause too much work for the moderators, I'm afraid. But you are right that a new promo track on Facebook/Myspace is not a valid single, unless the band actually offers it for sale on iTune/Amazon/etc. Not sure about video-only tracks though, surely such a track would be released in some form? Or is it just a promo video for an upcoming album? If that's the case then the "single" should be deleted.
_________________
Markeri, in 2013 wrote:
you can debate the actual date that metal began, but a fairly agreed upon date is 1969. Metal is almost 25 years old
Extreme_violence wrote:
Why Iron maiden is there? It's very far to be metal than a lot of some metal band.

Top
 Profile  
ExEcutionEr
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:53 pm
Posts: 11
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 8:32 pm 
 

The 8 Foot Sativa track came out in 2009. The band has been on hiatus ever since so that doesn't really make it a "promo video for an upcoming album". It was just a new song back then released as video clip.

But I'm not talking about specific singles now. I would like to have clarified the definition for "Single".

What exactly is a "Single" ?
What kind of "Singles" are/should be allowed on the Metal Archives ?

(Not less important because a lot of "Single" entries here on MA fall into this category, see 8 Foot Sativa for example)

What about video-only releases ?
What about songs free to download from facebook / Myspace only ?
What about songs available for streaming only ?

Top
 Profile  
ExEcutionEr
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:53 pm
Posts: 11
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 1:42 am 
 

To avoid any confusion. I'm not talking about the good old CD Singles. I'm not even talking about the 2008-2010 digital Singles, when online retailers became popular. I'm talking about the most recent 2011/2012 "Single" entries of songs that have not been officially released, neither physical nor digital.

I will not name them but I know a good bunch of tracks that have not been added to the site yet. I will not add them simply because I don't have a cover art (of course not - the songs have not been officially released).
My point is: A song that's free-to-download from a band's homepage shouldn't automatically be classified as a "Single" worth an entry on the Metal Archives. Obviously the same goes for video clip only/streaming only. Thoughts ?

Top
 Profile  
GraveWish
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2006 7:49 am
Posts: 950
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:05 pm 
 

Good question I was wondering about that too at some point. You've got your clear answer:

Quote:
But you are right that a new promo track on Facebook/Myspace is not a valid single, unless the band actually offers it for sale on iTune/Amazon/etc.


So if the track is not for sale, at least digitally, then it's not a valid single as simple as that.
_________________
Quote:
As their material is being released in quantities more than 20 home dubbed tapes, the band has been removed from the Metal-Archives.

Top
 Profile  
ExEcutionEr
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:53 pm
Posts: 11
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:23 pm 
 

Ok, anyhow I'd like to hear more opinion on this matter from Derigin maybe, HellBlazer, Evenfiel etc.

Eventually we could rename the topic and use this thread for gathering invalid Single entries.

Top
 Profile  
Metantoine
The XVI, dominar to over 258714 subjects

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
Posts: 8859
Location: Québec
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:29 pm 
 

Morrigan along with Hellblazer is the owner/admin of the site and her answer was clear, I doubt another intervention is necessary.
_________________
PhilosophicalFrog wrote:
JESUS CRUST, I didn't know this was the goddamn pizza inquisition.

Metantoine's Magickal Realm
Last.fm
Halberd (doom/death)

Top
 Profile  
GraveWish
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2006 7:49 am
Posts: 950
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:31 pm 
 

For instance, Morrigan is the owner of this site along with HellBlazer. Therefore her opinion is kind off like the bible, AMEN. This is dictatorship :oh shit: you have to live with that :-D
_________________
Quote:
As their material is being released in quantities more than 20 home dubbed tapes, the band has been removed from the Metal-Archives.

Top
 Profile  
ExEcutionEr
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:53 pm
Posts: 11
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:35 pm 
 

ahh fine, didn't know that.
So, is it cool to post here instead of creating more reports? Or do we need a new topic? And more importantly, how do you prevent people from adding the same invald Single over and over again?

Top
 Profile  
Evenfiel
Heavy Metal Hunter

Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 9:50 am
Posts: 6144
Location: Brazil
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 9:23 pm 
 

ExEcutionEr wrote:
And more importantly, how do you prevent people from adding the same invald Single over and over again?

We don't. People usually don't keep on doing that.

Top
 Profile  
ExEcutionEr
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:53 pm
Posts: 11
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 8:30 pm 
 

I didn't get an answer whether I should use this thread for invald Singles, create a new thread or submit a report. I decided to report and received a message that says:
Quote:
Just a notice. Downloads only do not need to be available for purchase to be valid, as long as they have been officially released by the band.

I thought I heard Morrigan saying the total opposite.
I'm confused. Do you admins/mods talk to each other?

And what the heck is that vacuous term "officially released" supposed to mean?
You can release something by facebook streaming, putting a video up on youtube or even having it up for free download on Myspace or official homepage.

Top
 Profile  
Evenfiel
Heavy Metal Hunter

Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 9:50 am
Posts: 6144
Location: Brazil
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 8:55 pm 
 

No, you should not use this thread. Just send a report.

Who sent you that message?

"Officially released" when MA started meant only albums that were released on a physical media by the band. Nowadays, if the band is already to MA, we also accept albums that are on sale by then band, as Morrigan stated. That's the rule of thumb.

Top
 Profile  
ExEcutionEr
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:53 pm
Posts: 11
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 9:03 pm 
 

I'm not going to tattle him if I don't have to.

What you say is logical but does not apply to the keynote of the thread. I did repeat multiple times, it's all about tracks that are not available for purchase.

Quote:
A new promo track on Facebook/Myspace is not a valid single, unless the band actually offers it for sale on iTunes/Amazon/etc.

Quote:
If the track is not for sale, at least digitally, then it's not a valid single.

Top
 Profile  
Evenfiel
Heavy Metal Hunter

Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 9:50 am
Posts: 6144
Location: Brazil
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:54 pm 
 

ExEcutionEr wrote:
I did repeat multiple times, it's all about tracks that are not available for purchase.

Morrigan already gave you an answer. What more do you want?

Top
 Profile  
ExEcutionEr
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2004 11:53 pm
Posts: 11
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 8:25 am 
 

I give up. Am I talking to a wall? Do you understand the purpose of this thread?

I want you to take this cause a little more serious. There is plenty of invalid entries on this site and it's becoming more and more because not even the admins/mods seem to agree about on how to handle those.

We just made clear that a song that is not available for purchase is not a vaild single entry on MA. I reported 14 of these and all got closed with a message that says the opposite from what Morrigan stated.

Set up a short news, add a note to the "Add new release" page or "Important reminders" that says: "Do not add Singles unless they are Promos or available for purchase", I don't know. You sort it out, then let me know.

Top
 Profile  
Evenfiel
Heavy Metal Hunter

Joined: Tue May 27, 2003 9:50 am
Posts: 6144
Location: Brazil
PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 8:43 am 
 

We've already gave you an answer. I've asked who wrote that to you in the report, but you refused to answer. There is nothing I can do if I cant' talk to the moderator who's doing things opposed to what Morrigan stated here.

Top
 Profile  
Azmodes
Ultranaut

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:44 am
Posts: 6041
Location: Gradec, Austria
PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 9:02 am 
 

Evenfiel wrote:
We've already gave you an answer. I've asked who wrote that to you in the report, but you refused to answer.

Porman sent that message.
_________________
Junge.

Last.fm | Collection

Top
 Profile  
sofeshue
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 2:38 am
Posts: 254
PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 7:33 am 
 

The "single" thing is really an annoying issue. What is equally annoying is the "demo", which has been abused for a long time. The definition of "demos" in MA is the same as Morrigan stated for "singles", that is, it should be released PHYSICALLY, or if the band is already on MA, the demo should be available for purchase. However, many sites (according to my experience, Russian, Chinese sites especially) would be use "demo" for newly-recorded tracks, myspace/facebook/youtube tracks, and countless "demos" of one or two tracks, with no cover art or any reliable info, appeared on MA.

The "Live album" is another headache. Before bands perform at local gigs, they often list the songs they will perform on their sites and some people would say, "Hey, we have a live album. Let's add it to MA". In fact, this "live album" never existed.

Top
 Profile  
sofeshue
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 2:38 am
Posts: 254
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2012 4:17 pm 
 

I just realized how big this single issue is. There are tones of "singles" with only one track, no cover art, and googling only gives the info for the song. These singles are obviously put online for promo use. Yet some sites, even the bands, call it a single, which has a different meaning from what we call "single" here. These singles should all be purged.

I agree with ExEcutionEr's previous post. We should Add a reminder to prevent people from adding non-valid singles.

Top
 Profile  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Exabot [Bot] and 8 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

 
Jump to:  

Back to the Encyclopaedia Metallum


Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group