For the love of God, would everybody PLEASE stop bringing up Ektomorf and SOAD. These bands have 0% chance of getting into MA, and when a mod says "they've been discussed before", we don't mean "Yeah, we've had a look at 'em, but they didn't really sound all that metal". We mean "We've forced ourselves to listen to whatever material a fan might've considered metallic, combed their discography, and no, they don't deserve a place here".

This goes for bands like Tool, SOAD, Ektomorf, Dir en Grey, Between the Buried and Me, and virtually every other borderline band that keeps getting brought up. These bands might sound decidedly metal in some places (e.g., the song samples you guys keep recommending we listen to), but the bulk of their discography is mainly non-metallic songwriting, and remember the rule that a band needs at least one FULLY metallic (and physical, publicly available) release to qualify for admittance on the archives. Bands like those that've been blacklisted have albums that weren't deemed metallic enough in their entirety. On a similar note, non-metal bands who suddenly release an "iffy" borderline album (like Soulfly's "Omen", or Tomb's "Path of Totality") can still be rejected simply because the discography leading up to said release isn't metallic enough, either. So for a band to be unblacklisted, it takes a serious leap from their earlier sound to "redeem" them.

As Derigin said, Soulfly weren't accepted based on any of their releases except Enslaved, which was a *hell* of a big leap from, say, Omen. And unless SOAD or Ektomorf suddenly decide to release an album overblown with meaty, metallic riffs, they're staying the hell off this site. Case closed, PLEASE stop bringing it up.

Are you surprised, though...really?

That people are being idiots? No, not really.

Dear people, may I know why is Dir En Grey still in the blacklist in year 2012? From their 2 newest album, I could clearly hear that their music is clinging towards Avant Garde and Pogressive Metal. They even appear in Wacken Open Air for 2 years. If they are not metal, how can Wacken Open Air accept them? Please clarify this. Thanks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAr8466lSUA

Wacken does not set the criteria for acceptance to metal-archives. There are many bands in Wacken that aren't on the site anyway.

The song you posted sounded like nu-metal.

Perhaps I should have made myself clearer. My locking post was meant as an explanation as to why they are not here and won't be accepted, not a simple "post the same thing there again". Hence the threads I linked to. Dir En Grey have been brought up many times and the answer has always been the same. I know only a small number of their songs, so I can't give you my personal opinion on their discography as a whole, but what I've read from the other mods, none of their releases are considered metal enough. They may have some single songs here and there that could be called metal, but that doesn't make them predominantly metal.

Go away.

I have a cat named Milo, and three pet praying mantises named Aela, Astrid and Vex (after characters in Skyrim).

I'm not counting on someone else telling me whether or not old songs rerecorded to sound more metal counts or not, I think you're answer on the Metalmorphosis EP is sufficient and anyone using the search function from now on would see that the most recent Praying Mantis release was brought up and briefly discussed.



I only brought up Praying Mantis because the Metalmorphosis EP was not brought up before. Now searching "praying mantis metalmorphosis" will yield both this post and the prior one on Praying Mantis. Metantoine for the most part answered my question and I'm not pursuing the topic any further. Anyone who knows how to use the search function would see this brief discussion as well. I'm sorry if I caused any aggravation as I certainly didn't mean it.

Goatfangs, it's not about aggravation so much as it is about irritation. Let me explain why.

This is not about Praying Mantis, or Ektomorf, or any band specifically, per se. It's not even about re-evaluating bands in general, which is not bad at all or at all frowned upon. That's good - the reevaluation of new material is never a bad thing. After all, being on the blacklist is not an end, necessarily; bands will be rejudged when or if they ever produce an album that is - without a shadow of a doubt - metal. Alhadis said that best above. So, it's not the practice of reevaluation that might be construed as "irritating." That's worth getting out of the way first.

You've been with the site for at least four years. Your record of involvement, while not extensive, is what you would expect; a number of successful band submissions, some reviews, some reports, hundreds of edits, and at least 1000 posts (many of which made in this thread). Along with that, it's worth noting that this site has a specific view on metal; one not shared by any specific person (least of all any of us admins or moderators). That view developed on its own over time and through practice, really, and has gradually become 'cemented' in the psyche of the guidelines for this site, and the expectations we place upon the users who work on it and visit it. That view is also not hard to pick up on; our users and our mods are fully capable of understanding the limits placed for this site on the topic of metal, and even on the characteristics of what to expect for "metalness" as defined by the site. That does take time, certainly, and the will to do so (something which, sadly, a lot of people who visit this thread opt not to even try), but it's a process that can be understood and followed as a form of "common sense" unique to this site. It's not asking the world to accept that.

I mean this with respect, and not in any mean spirits, but you do not grasp that. The releases and samples you've used to explain potential metalness tend to be far from it, as would be expected for this site. The users who respond to you, mods or not, understand that. They see your examples from "Metalmorphosis" or from "Hangorf" and wonder why it's even a question as to the unacceptability of those releases as examples of metal enough. When it comes to examples like that, it should not even be a question that they're not metal enough; you should already be aware of that. It shouldn't be a question that someone would look up "Praying Mantis + Metalmorphosis" because the question of the acceptance of Praying Mantis based on that album is not a question to begin with. By all means, bringing up new material is worth it, when that new material could be construed as valid for the potential acceptance of a band... but the examples you've posted are most certainly far from that. You might respond with the "what if" possibility that it "is" metal... it isn't even close.

It becomes irritating not because you bring it up, or how you've brought it up, but because after four years of being a member here, it's expected you'd know more about what this site considers metal and have a "common sense" about that... knowing enough that you would look at that EP and immediately respond with "This isn't metal enough," and not with a "Yeah, this COULD be metal, let me post about it." That's what is irritating.

Orthrelm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlmfy9Qj ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEd-eecB ... re=related
undefinable, un-boxable, non-danceable, meditative and psychotic.
put on your hearing aids grandpa, this is metal.

You know, as interesting as this music is, I'm actually prepared to ignore your appeal simply on the basis of you being a total arsehole.

That, and I also don't see what's even remotely metal about those two songs.

... also that. Barring the fact that the band sounds like Krallice playing noisy space jazz instead of metal, the band also ranks high in the "Our Lawyer is a Dickhead" factor.

Either improve your tone, or we'll show you the door.

For what it's worth, Orthrelm used to be on the Archives, but was removed for not being metal. I am inclined to agree, and I enjoy the band immensely. It's Mick Barr playing noise rock (nice catch on the Krallice reference, Alhadis) in a more aggressive tone than in The Flying Luttenbachers.

This isn't just my opinion being voiced, this is what was decided when the band was removed. So, there you go.

have a sense of humour grandpa, you'll live longer.

I disagree, noise rock is loose and usually at least half improvised. Orthrelm is highly dense and creative "Modern Classical Metal" if anything.

Hah. I clicked on the first one, and I remembered I'd seen it before. I agree, not bad, but not metal. Don't really agree with the "noise rock" tag either though. Sort-of-heavy minimalist music, I'd say.

Orthelm sounds like a Metal Enterprises fake band on speed and LSD simultaneously. Experimenploitation.

Be funnier.

I didn't notice any humour. Just a wee bit of smug condescension.


Right. I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Alright, one more pointless try for the gipper..

In my mind, claiming that Orthrelm isn't metal is akin to saying Striborg isn't metal because it sounds (to the lamen) not unlike some lonely psychopath wallowing in pitiful agony in his parents basement, rather than the arena rock band slayer, which most people associate with the genre "metal". However, to the learned few Striborg is a legitimate black metal band. Elsewise, Orthrelm (to the learned few) is legitimate metal of some not-yet-categorized ilk.

p.s. I get it, they're not pure "metal".

Orthrelm sounds as metal as Naked City or Frank Zappa.

Submitted All Will Know (www.allwillknow.de) and they were rejected on account of not being a metal band. I'm not going to argue about this but was a little surprised as they sound exactly like Sapiency (and probably more bands) who are on the archives.
I believe either both bands should be accepted or removed.

This is Amarok from LEBENSWINTER.

You rejected our Band-Profile and asked for some proof of existence.

here's a link to our music: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVTc0lcq ... AAAAAAAEAA

we also offer a free download of our whole Demo-release: http://www.mediafire.com/?5kg8gg6olw57f24

we only sold Tapes, when there was a request for them, because we are still independent and do all work by our own.
Our main supporter is the German black metal label 'Sturmglanz.de', who will put our first song 'Nebel' on its next Sampler 'Waldesland III'. (You may send them an e-mail).

last.fm:
http://www.lastfm.de/music/Lebenswinter

We would appreciate your acceptance, otherwise just inform us and we'll abdicate our account here.

regards,
Amarok

My band Cyclopian was rejected. Without getting into the case of sub-genre descriptions, I would like to point out a list of bands who have profiles on here, who have a similar sound to us:

Isis, Cult of Luna, Pelican, Latitudes, Neurosis, Amenra, Mouth of the Architect, Blackwaves.

These are just a few examples that come straight to mind as I search for similar bands.

I understand that whether something is "metal enough" is a subjective process and therefore would like to ask for a second opinion. If somebody only listened to a small, instrumental, clean guitar part of a song they could quite easily think "this doesn't sound metal" but in the context of songs that are 7 minutes plus in length, this would not be a fair summation of the overall sound.

Please try to check out at least half a song and determine whether you think the band may be worth re-considering "metal enough". As those bands I listed, plus many more have been deemed worthy.

The full album can be streamed here http://cyclopian.bandcamp.com

So I recently tried to submit a band called Ohlm, but was rejected due to them not being metal enough.

However, I was just informed that this band is technically already on the archives, but under a different name. Ohlm used to be known as Synaptic Dissent, who were obviously metal enough to be accepted.

Why the discrepancy? The songs featured on the demo are even on the their full length, "The Synaptic Dissent", which I included in my submission.

Thanks.

Don't know why this was rejected, sounds ok to me. More clearly metal to these ears than many of the others post- bands that gets submitted. Let's hear some other opinions.

The band INHERITAGE is now in the black list.
I do not understand why.
I tried to add this band, but it was rejected since they didn't have any physical release.
Right now we got our EP released by RTM Prod.
Please reconsider

Is it out yet? Label page reads "coming soon".

Resubmit.

Yes it is out. We have received the copies.
I can send you pic's of the CD.
Will you reconsider?

That's okay, I've un-blacklisted the band. Please just make sure to include those pics in the submission notes.

You guys asked music sample about Moukka (http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Moukka/3540343362) so here you are: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3sak82Q9HA

I don't have myself a copy of their cd, but here is review http://www.imperiumi.net/index.php?act=demos&id=2057 and here you can buy their first ep: http://www.levykauppax.fi/artist/moukka/tuhottavaksi/ so if it is available for purchase then there is physical release.

The band Tombs have been blacklisted, I was wondering why this is as they to me are more metal than some bands that have been included. To me Tombs mix up sludge metal sounds in the vein of Neurosis with black metal overtones. They have a lot of characteristically metal traits. Galloping bass drums, heavy down-tuned guitars, BM style tremolo picking and also lyrically dark themes. The vocals are more shout than scream or grunt, but this is the Neurosis influence showing (along with the sludgy but melodic riffing). Is there anybody that can tell me why they are not metal?

I am about to submit the black metal band Yaocuicatl, from Fresnillo, Mexico. It turns out that it is blacklisted. I recently recieved proof of physical releases from the guitar player, being three pictures from three different releases. In previous communication with him, he told me he already had tried to submit the band, but was rejected; I think that's the reason for their inclusion in the blacklist.

Could this band please be removed from that list, so I can submit them, and add the pictures he sent me as proof on the submission notes, or do I have to show you the pictures before?

The blacklist note says "keeps resubmitting without any proof". Yeah, you need to post the pics first before we remove it from the blacklist, sorry about that but blame the previous submitter for being a derp. :\

Ok. I'm adding the links here.

First demo.
Two copies of a split album.
A close pic of the CD.
Back cover of the split album.

I hope this is enough.

Thanks man

If Last Days Of Humanity are blacklisted, why is Spineless (Poland) allowed? LDOH is far heavier and more metallic.

Eg:
Spineless,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydqqytkb ... re=related
LDOH,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urRYw3X5DV0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KCTsXy3 ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Skvsix5C ... ure=relmfu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTRESr6f ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tREebpQg ... ure=relmfu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&featu ... Tia1lIEioI

They are considered by many gore grind fans to be the apex of the genre.

Also, my band Yellowthief (which is currently pending) may as well be blacklisted. I added this project before I read the guidelines. Metal is but one of our many personalities.

LDoH are one of my favourite bands, and I consider myself an avid lover of goregrind. That being said, take heart that what you're hearing is from a fellow fan and not some snobby OSDM-fag.

There's variations in how metal some goregrind bands are compared with others. With bands like Pathologist, Regurgitate, and the Mexican Disgorge, the guitarwork is substantially metallic. Now, there's no hard and fast rule as to how we govern this, but one guideline is to study the guitars. If they sound repetitive, heavily down-tuned, and percussive, chances are it's not metallic enough for the site's standards.

That Spineless video you linked to had two songs; the first sounded unacceptable, the second sounded okay (in a raw, dirty old-school death metal kind of way). I'd have to listen to the entire demo though (couldn't find a download link for it) before deciding whether to kill it off, as the bulk of the music might be okay.

Don't worry, I share your pain at not having LDoH on MA. As a matter of fact, asking about their absence was the reason I first registered on this site... But since then, I've come to realise that just because music is loud, savage and intense, doesn't necessarily mean it's metal.