Is the American blacklisted band called V the one with a release from February 2015?

The blacklist for V says it's Mallcore and it was blacklisted in 2012, so maybe not.

Hardcore is punk, get the shot is a mix of thrash metal and hardcore aka CROSSOVER WHICH IS METAL

Also Terror is metal too, 90's metalcore and thrash metal/crossover, Lowest of the Low was metallic hardcore but otherwise they are metal.

If Get The Shot aren't metal then neither is every crossover band on this website.

Don't the blacklisted bands have ID-numbers? I tried to save it for my draft but it seems like the blacklisting for all bands with the same name from the same country must be removed from the blacklist for an acceptable to be accepted?

Please refer to the rules, specifically the section "long-ass, rambling, read-before-complaining-only version" of "heavy metal only."

Terror actually haven't been blacklisted, because in the 13 years this site has been around, not a single one of 270,000 members on the site thought the hardcore band fronted by Scott Vogel were a metal band. I've seen them live a couple times and have heard five or so albums by them, so don't think we're ignorant of them, they're simply not a metal band.



No, they are blacklisted by name and country. If a name is blacklisted, it only blocks that band name for that country.

Pessipath, this pains me because you obviously have some pretty solid taste in popular hardcore, you keep bringing up bands that I'm a fan of, but the fact stands that your definition of hardcore simply doesn't match the definition of the site, or of mine, or of apparently every hardcore fan in the universe. The sound has expanded since the Youth Crew days, much in the same way that Darkthrone, Rhapsody of Fire, and Cephalotripsy, bands that sound absolutely nothing like each other OR Black Sabbath or Judas Priest, are still undeniably metal bands.

Please, educate yourself on what hardcore means currently before bringing anything else up. You may not agree, but you're clearly in the vast minority on this. You don't have to think that Terror and Nasty are hardcore bands, but you do have understand why virtually everybody on the planet other than you says that they are, and then apply that to our guidelines. I really can't be any more clear about this.

That's what I said, minus the opinion of "only" Anyway, I'll guess I post a link whenever I can add it.

Go ahead and submit it. I've removed the blacklist note

Hey there,

I submitted SUMAC, a progressive Sludge band by Aaron Turner in the vein of old ISIS and Old Man Gloom. The submission got rejected for not being metal. Not sure if that's mistake or not. Maybe two, three more words might help me to understand the rejection. Their debut album can be found here: https://profoundlorerecords.bandcamp.com/album/the-deal

Thanks!

A side note, but what are you talking about? I really don't see how ID numbers would help. I mean, when a user creates a new draft, it gets a new ID...

I'm writing to say that recently, Cyril the Wolf released a new album and (to me) it's very power metal with a hint of blues rock. I'll link it to let you guys decide for yourselves
http://cyrilthewolf.com/album/thrown-to-the-wolves
Proof of it being metal "Feeling Lost" "Self Doubt" "A Gouge Inside" "Find the Light"

I checked the other seven songs and they aren't metal, so that certainly isn't predominantly metal.



A bit of discussion with other mods and we still seem to be leaning towards saying it isn't metal. I'll see if anyone other staffers care to weigh in on it.

HI,

This might sound dull to some of you, but Im a metal label owner who has licensed some titles from the bands Europe (Sweden) and Chickenfoot (USA). I wonder why those bands (together with Van Halen for example) appear as "blacklisted".

Aint them Metal?



Cheers, F

They're rock.

To put it more thoroughly, they haven't released an unquestionably metal album.

Hi Derigin,

Not that Im particularly a fan of them (maybe early Van Halen) but... do you people really think that Europe ("The final countdown", a melodic metal blockbuster from the 80s), or Mr. Eddie Van Halen and his band arent metal?????? The first Van Halen albums are notmetal enough??? What???

How, for example, Grunge bands like Soundgarden are MORE METAL than Europe or Van Halen????? And Im not talking about attitude, just the music...

Can I have any official reply from a moderator? Sorry but cannot believe it...

I'm pretty sure early Europe is borderline, as in almost acceptable. Our standards require that a band have at least one predominantly metal release to merit inclusion. This is a metal database, and an attempt at impartial accuracy (difficult concerning something subjective as music, I know...) dictates that we employ these guidelines. Eddie was and always will be a huge influence on metal guitarists, but his band lacks a predominantly metal release. Period.

Why does it bother people so much that band x, y and z aren't included here? It isn't a knock on these acts in any way, they just don't meet our standing requirements, which revolve around metal riffage. "Ain't Talkin' 'Bout Love" is in my top 5 favorite riffs of all time, but I don't cry myself to sleep over the fact that the band isn't included here.

Doesn't matter how influential a band is to metal musicians.
Doesn't matter how many metal fests they've played.
Doesn't matter how many connections they have to metal bands via personnel (save for very select exceptions)

Just the music, mate... oh and Derigin is a moderator.

You might have had me at Europe but once you tossed in Chickenfoot, the question became silly. Chickenfoot has nothing at all to do with metal. I love Chickenfoot and Sammy Hagar in general but jeez.

Europe on the other hand - that debut record is definitely close. I love that record and of course it's way different than Final Countown-era Europe but the mod consensus is that it's rock, so they won't be here.

Europe is a point of constant contention, but the often-cited metal period has been reviewed by multiple mods and it's not quite there, meaning none of the albums qualify as predominantly metal.

Not that I'm really too familiar with Van Halen on an album level, but the songs I know are definitely rock.

Chickenfoot? Come on...

blackstararg, now you've received replies from two administrators and two moderators.

To the moderators, regarding the rejection of the submission of th V8 Homenaje band:

You are right about the motifs for the rekenction. Nvertheless, I want to point out certain things important enough to have in mind:

-This band is more than a "covers" band, since it has 3 quartes of original recording members.
-They DO HAVE one original new studio song, released in this live album cd.
-All members are ex V8, none members are just is "filling up" and never have any input in the original V8.
-Its considered here in Argentina "the live album that V8 never had".
-The importance of this album is great in southamerican metal, sin ce its the last time that ex V8 members performed together, toured for two years and recorded a live album, a thing that V8 never had.
-My only aim to add "V8 Homenaje" as a band, is that in the V8 entry, "V8 Homenaje" as a album in quoted as unofficial and is forbidden to be added.
Such a piece of history of southamerican metal should be included in the archives in some way, since there was a physical release and now its being rereleased again.

Please contact me, thanks.

I posted de V8 thing before reading the Europe/Van halen answers sorry:

Thanks for all moderators and administrators answering. Thaks Azmodes for pointing that out.
To Diamhea, Im not crying over anything dont worry. I dont precisely LIKE that bands (except for Van Halen).

I agree with your "rules", but being art/metal not THAT clearly defined besides personal impressions, I think that you guys are just the ones that dont think those bands fit in the category.
Forget about Chickenfoot, I tossed it just because the relation to Van halen.
But dear moderators, if you dont believe that the first 2 Europe albums (as a side note, the LAST 3 Europe albums sound more metal that the firsts), and the first 3 Van Halen albums are Metal, and Soundgarden is (its in the archives).. well... its pretty weird.
Ask people that are more than 40 if they think that the first Van Halen albums are metal or not. Ask the Black Sabbath guys (Black Sabbath, my all time favourite band, doesnt even consider themselves Metal!)

We can discuss this eternally, but my point is that you DO include bands that, at least for me and many others, are definitely NOT metal at all...

Anyway, its your opinion, its your site, but I totally disagree.
And for the record, again: Im not a Europe or Chickenfoot fan. I just released a couple of their albums. I DO LIKED Van halen in the past yes, but far from being a fan.

Well, is that really much of a point at all? Indeed, people may disagree over both in- and exclusions. It's music, not mathematics. Judgement calls need to be made to keep this database in focus. The fringe areas of hard rock and metal are fuzzy and it's no surprise that opinions over these bands can go both ways. Please do keep in mind, as well, that it only takes one metal release to get a band approved. Honestly, I don't know Soundgarden all that well, but they were probably added based on a particular era/release the music on which was judged metal, whereas their gigantic reputation as a grunge band will make people scratch their heads over their inclusion. But the actual music is first and foremost for us.

I doubt that the reality is as "The-World-Versus-MA" as you seem to think. Mildly put, this site has somewhat of a reputation among its detractors, but we are not a bunch of basement-dwelling weirdo internet kids listening to their Burzum records 24/7 and stripping anything more traditional of its Official True Metal status. The staff making the decisions is comprised of all types of people, of all ages, with an immensely wide collective taste/experience in music, both in time and in style, yet united by a love and interest for metal. So yeah, we do have a number of older staffers and I'm sure they'd have spoken up by now if they felt that excluding a big band like Van Halen was such a grave injustice. Your implied "back in the day" card is not going to fly here.

As a relevant note, early Soundgarden is total Black Sabbath worship. So yeah, try giving it a spin. You'll immediately see how that band is Metal (and fucking awesome!).

I'm 47, and Van Halen is not metal. More like the definition of hard rock.

Azmodes, I agree in general with your statement. Mostly that "metal is not mathematics, its music".

Sorry Opus and Opsiuscato, but Soundgarden (a band that I DO LIKE) is no more metal than Van Halen, in a different way of course. At least in my PERSONAL OPINION.
"At least in my PERSONAL OPINION" its a line you forgot to put in your posts guys.

If by "PERSONAL OPINION" you mean the collective agreement of a multitude of staff and users from all walks of life - with over thirty years of metal backing us up - sure, though I have a suspicion that might be less "PERSONAL" than the "PERSONAL OPINION" of a single individual such as yourself. Just sayin'

In any case, let us move on.

Hi Derigin.

Yes we can move on. I have the same amount of years backing me up (journalist, producer, fan), if you want to display credentials ove rthe table.
And a lot of people think the same as me, regarding this particular case at least. But that is not important neither relevant.

Its the same with you, the only difference is that you regulate a site, a very good one indeed, so individual opinions are needed to matter in order to reach a consensus to rule in or out.
Nevertheless, are just opinions.

Everything is a matter of opinion regarding art, of course you regulate this site and what you guys decide to put online or not, should be accepted and respected.

Lets move on, enjoy Soundgarden as much as I enjoy Van Halen. Good bands will be good bands no matters in which genre drawer we want to put them.

Cheers.

To the moderators, regarding the rejection of the submission of th V8 Homenaje band:

You are right about the motifs for the rejection. Nevertheless, I want to point out certain things important enough to have in mind:

-This band is more than a "covers" band, since it has 3 quartes of original recording members.
-They DO HAVE one original new studio song, released in this live album cd.
-All members are ex V8, none members are just is "filling up" and never have any input in the original V8.
-Its considered here in Argentina "the live album that V8 never had".
-The importance of this album is great in southamerican metal, sin ce its the last time that ex V8 members performed together, toured for two years and recorded a live album, a thing that V8 never had.
-My only aim to add "V8 Homenaje" as a band, is that in the V8 entry, "V8 Homenaje" as a album in quoted as unofficial and is forbidden to be added.
Such a piece of history of southamerican metal should be included in the archives in some way, since there was a physical release and now its being rereleased again.

Please contact me, thanks.
FS / Blackstar CP

How is Sumac not metal? Seriously? It's very similar to old Isis as well as Old Man Gloom. Not metal? How can you even come to that conclusion? If they aren't metal then what are they? Djent? Country-folk mathcore? This literally makes no sense.

I'm waiting for an answer about the rejection of "Boycott Mankind".

If it is not Metal, tell me what genre is it?

Among other things by the statistics of bandcamp, the full-length was not heard.

V8 Homenage is still, well, a cover band. For a point of reference, we also don't include the Di'anno/Stratton "Live at Last" album, though that's a more complex situation. I'm not familiar with the situation regarding why it isn't an official V8 release.

Sumac's genre is pending Aaron Turner making up a more pretentious-sounding phrase than "thinking man's metal" and it happens to be similar to some of his other bands which are only marginally metal.

Boycott Mankind is mallcore mixed with groove metal. Not predominantly metal.

Thus changing the genre in Groove Metal I can re-submit the request?
If you hear songs like Boycott Mankind, Cursed Generation, This God of Yours... are Thrash / Heavy with low tuning sound.
Shit and Dropping have a Speed Metal central part, like Motorhead, but the low tuning gives a personal taste.
Let me know.

No, the band is not predominantly metal, that's why it was rejected. It doesn't qualify for inclusion in the encyclopedia.

Though the genre description is straight to the point I can't agree with the verdict that this is marginally metal. On the album in question all except the first and last song (pretentious Intro + prententious Outro) can be easily classified as metal to my ears. Not going to fight about it, I just fail to understand the rejection. There's nothing really borderline about their album.

I confess my ignorance and dislike to that sort of post-stuff, but it seemed largely devoid of metal riffing to me.

Yeah I also can't see how that stuff is "marginally" metal - I definitely sense a ton of bias here. It's sludge, but it's NOT closer to the hardcore end of sludge - it's definitely a lot more metal sounding than many bands submitted here in the archives. Also, while it's heavily based on abstract rhythm it's not like a djent band where all you hear is chugging - like I said, the riff structure of the vast majority of the grooves found are very akin to early Isis. In fact I'd go as far as to say that Sumac is probably more sounding than the vast majority of Isis' material.

Look if I can't convince you then fine; it's not like it's the end of the world if they aren't in. I'll respectfully disagree, but I still find the omission of Sumac ridiculous not only because there are bands that are way less metal sounding that are in the archives, but also because there are bands that sound almost identical that get the go-ahead.

but if you (or whoever you) have not heard the album but only a few part of this! (and this is demonstrated by the statistics of bandcamp, the only source for digital listening of the album.) obviously, here is predominant only one thing, the superficiality and the incompetence of the judgment. without considering that 50% of the material in this "enciclopedia" is not Metal, according to you. however, no problem, it will not be a great loss (for me). bye

Just got a rejected submission notice re NIIGHT, curious to hear the reasoning behind that.

It's noise.

Dear Zodijackyl,

In fact Homenaje V8 is not a "cover band". at least not for the local scene, were the band belongs. They are ALL ex V8 members, the only thing is that they decided not to call themselves V8 for the tours and live album. Thats all.
But this release deserves to appear in some way here, since its a MILESTONE for Argentina/Southamerican metal. Thats why I suggested the idea of the entry of a "new band" called V8 Homenaje, because for some weird way the release its banned to appear on the V8 discography.
It would perfectly fit into the "misc." part of V8 discography.

A lot of people here in Argentina believes that this album must be added in some way... as I mentioned before, its the "live album that V8 never had". Only One original V8 recording member is missing.

Thanks, F