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Goatfangs
Wicker Mantis

Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:02 pm
Posts: 2217
Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 12:57 am 
 

Nightgaunt wrote:
He means prove that the release is viable--that is, that it meets minimum physical distribution thresholds. Not that the music is metal.


My point with the Rapidshare download is not to prove that they are metal, but to prove that the demo itself is a real physical release. Two of the tracks are not on their myspace, therefore the only way I can get them is if I get their demo, therefore the demo has to exist in order for me to have it (which I do). How do you fake recordings? Next time I see them I'll take a picture, but I don't always have a camera with and I don't remember having to go through this hassle for the other bands I have added, which had a demo and a Myspace.
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rexxz
Retired

Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 8:45 pm
Posts: 8769
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 12:59 am 
 

Downloads prove nothing, for the record.

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Nightgaunt
I'll Swallow Your Soul

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 9:50 pm
Posts: 6240
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 1:18 am 
 

rexxz wrote:
Downloads prove nothing, for the record.


Indeed. That you yourself have a physical copy of some description does not mean that the release meets minimum distribution threshold standards. Suspicions are duly heightened for bands that issue CD-rs with marker on them as proper releases. While it's quite feasible that some bands that do this actually do meet distribution thresholds, guidelines behoove us to check on these things, as people have, do, and will try to get bands accepted based on mickey-mouse CD-rs created solely to be privately distributed to a small number of the band's friends/families, or even just to get them onto this website.
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Goatfangs
Wicker Mantis

Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:02 pm
Posts: 2217
Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 11:36 am 
 

Nightgaunt wrote:
rexxz wrote:
Downloads prove nothing, for the record.


Indeed. That you yourself have a physical copy of some description does not mean that the release meets minimum distribution threshold standards. Suspicions are duly heightened for bands that issue CD-rs with marker on them as proper releases. While it's quite feasible that some bands that do this actually do meet distribution thresholds, guidelines behoove us to check on these things, as people have, do, and will try to get bands accepted based on mickey-mouse CD-rs created solely to be privately distributed to a small number of the band's friends/families, or even just to get them onto this website.


I understand that anyone can just write a marker on a CD-R and submit it as proof. I also understand anyone can just go buy a CD labeling program to stick labels onto a CD-R and submit it as proof, and heck... if someone has the funds they can get it professionally printed with only one song on it and submit it as a five song EP.

I submitted a 5 song demo. They have 3 songs on their Myspace. 5 song demo, 3 on their Myspace, the other two no where else on the internet. That's the point of the download, to show that those songs exist. Horse Master and CRV vs. Villager. They are from the 5 song demo. As my last question on the issue, why is this not sufficient?
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Goatfangs
Wicker Mantis

Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:02 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 11:42 am 
 

I can add that I am in no way in the band or related to the band. They are just a band I saw at a show, just like the others I have added. You have no way of proving my statement correct. You have no way of believing my words, and judging from recent events, you would rather increase the difficulty of adding bands to decrease the scourge of fake or unwarranted adds.

That's understandable, so I guess I'll start bringing a camera to shows and stuff to take pictures of merch booths. Hahaha, this'll be a hoot to talk about while at these shows.
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SupremeAbstract
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:51 pm
Posts: 242
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:10 pm 
 

Exactly. When we see CDs for sale (even if they are drawn on with a marker), and we have heard the music to be metal in nature, that is all the proof you will ever need.
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rexxz
Retired

Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 8:45 pm
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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:25 pm 
 

Goatfangs wrote:
I submitted a 5 song demo. They have 3 songs on their Myspace. 5 song demo, 3 on their Myspace, the other two no where else on the internet. That's the point of the download, to show that those songs exist. Horse Master and CRV vs. Villager. They are from the 5 song demo. As my last question on the issue, why is this not sufficient?


Having two songs that are on their demo but not on their myspace is not evidence or proof of anything. Seriously, for you to even think that is just baffling. How do we know you didn't get then from somewhere else?

Sure, we can assume that because you have these songs means that you have the demo (which is real and not just privately distributed), but we try to do the best we can to not operate on assumptions here. Some of them are unavoidable sure, but all the same it is protocol.

Submit better evidence.

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Goatfangs
Wicker Mantis

Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:02 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:08 pm 
 

rexxz wrote:
Goatfangs wrote:
I submitted a 5 song demo. They have 3 songs on their Myspace. 5 song demo, 3 on their Myspace, the other two no where else on the internet. That's the point of the download, to show that those songs exist. Horse Master and CRV vs. Villager. They are from the 5 song demo. As my last question on the issue, why is this not sufficient?


Having two songs that are on their demo but not on their myspace is not evidence or proof of anything. Seriously, for you to even think that is just baffling. How do we know you didn't get then from somewhere else?

Sure, we can assume that because you have these songs means that you have the demo (which is real and not just privately distributed), but we try to do the best we can to not operate on assumptions here. Some of them are unavoidable sure, but all the same it is protocol.

Submit better evidence.


Okay, since you guys have no way of proving for certain that I got those two remaining tracks from the physical demo instead of a download, or even by being one of the band members, I'll have to find better evidence to support the assertion that this is a physical release. Taking a picture of a merch booth is a good idea, I'll start there.

Sorry for being a bit of a hassle in this matter, just wanting to straighten out the reasoning behind their rejection. That has been accomplished.
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rexxz
Retired

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:15 pm 
 

Awesome! I didn't meant to seem like I was too persistent on hammering this idea in, but I just want everyone to know that we can't operate on assumptions, no matter how likely they seem to be.

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Malevolence666
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 1:36 pm
Posts: 3
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 6:01 pm 
 

...why aren't Last Days Of Humanity up here? Have you guys heard them? They're the epitome of gore grind, most violent music I've heard, it's not exactly noise grind, it's gore grind in its purest form.

If you haven't heard them, listen to them NOW!!! (especially to In Advanced Haemorrhaging Conditions [EP], my personal favourite release from them)

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oneyoudontknow
Cum insantientibus furere necesse est.

Joined: Sun May 21, 2006 6:25 pm
Posts: 5347
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 6:05 pm 
 

Malevolence666 wrote:
...why aren't Last Days Of Humanity up here? Have you guys heard them? They're the epitome of gore grind, most violent music I've heard, it's not exactly noise grind, it's gore grind in its purest form.

If you haven't heard them, listen to them NOW!!! (especially to In Advanced Haemorrhaging Conditions [EP], my personal favourite release from them)

have been discussed a thousand times and have been rejected at least a thousand times. Use the search function to find all postings on this issue.
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Goatfangs
Wicker Mantis

Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:02 pm
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:47 pm 
 

Malevolence666 wrote:
...why aren't Last Days Of Humanity up here? Have you guys heard them? They're the epitome of gore grind, most violent music I've heard, it's not exactly noise grind, it's gore grind in its purest form.

If you haven't heard them, listen to them NOW!!! (especially to In Advanced Haemorrhaging Conditions [EP], my personal favourite release from them)


Here's what gore grind is...

Think of Punk as some what of a sibling genre to metal - both came from rock... Hardcore is to Punk what Thrash metal is to Metal. Grindcore is to punk what Death metal is to Metal. Gore grind is grindcore with gory lyrics and fast tempos, sort of like what brutal death metal is to metal.

It's not metal. It's heavy, extreme punk rock.

All of the grindcore bands (or at least, all of the ones that belong here) are a combination of two genres: Grindcore, which derives from crust punk and hardcore and Death metal. Or, they started out as grindcore and moved to death metal - Napalm Death and Carcass for example. Name any grindcore or goregrind band on this site, I guarantee you that there is death metal in their music. There is no death metal in LDOH. It's extreme Anal Cunt worship with gurgling vocals - not bad stuff, never said that was so, but it's not metal and it does not belong.
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GraveWish
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2006 7:49 am
Posts: 950
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:48 am 
 

Hi the band Canobliss previously submitted by me sounds too much alternative and needs to be re-checked.
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Neantise
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue May 27, 2008 12:28 pm
Posts: 134
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:45 am 
 

"Encyclopaedia Metallum was forced to reject your submission for the band Amocoma (United States of America), for the following reason:

Some evidence needed. Links to reviews, samples, distros etc."

I can link to the three in one link : Aquarius Records (San Francisco based record store).
Search for Amocoma on the website to see that you can BUY the CD-r Go to Hell, and there is a review of it and also three samples.

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rexxz
Retired

Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 8:45 pm
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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 12:11 pm 
 

Resubmit with the information, then.

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Helvede
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 6:28 pm
Posts: 1428
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 12:22 pm 
 

Neantise wrote:
"Encyclopaedia Metallum was forced to reject your submission for the band Amocoma (United States of America), for the following reason:

Some evidence needed. Links to reviews, samples, distros etc."

I can link to the three in one link : Aquarius Records (San Francisco based record store).
Search for Amocoma on the website to see that you can BUY the CD-r Go to Hell, and there is a review of it and also three samples.


Why don't you put info like this in your band-submission in the first place???

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Neantise
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue May 27, 2008 12:28 pm
Posts: 134
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:40 pm 
 

helvede wrote:
Why don't you put info like this in your band-submission in the first place???

Where should i write this ? In the additional notes it says "no link", and when adding a link there is Official, Labels, Official Merchandise, Fan Site and Tablatures, and Aquarius Records is none of those. As for the Go to Hell CD-r, as I do not know the tracklist, I have not submitted it.
And the link to Aquarius Records is the first when you search Amocoma in google, I thought it was easy to find for the moderator who checked my band-submission.

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Helvede
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 6:28 pm
Posts: 1428
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 4:05 pm 
 

Neantise wrote:
helvede wrote:
Why don't you put info like this in your band-submission in the first place???

Where should i write this ? In the additional notes it says "no link", and when adding a link there is Official, Labels, Official Merchandise, Fan Site and Tablatures, and Aquarius Records is none of those. As for the Go to Hell CD-r, as I do not know the tracklist, I have not submitted it.
And the link to Aquarius Records is the first when you search Amocoma in google, I thought it was easy to find for the moderator who checked my band-submission.


It's still your job to include any evidence of your submission to back up your argument for getting the band in question accepted. You could put info on where to read about the band and the band's discography in a report. I'm definitely not going to google every shitty and lacking submission, when the user easily could include his source.

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Goatfangs
Wicker Mantis

Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:02 pm
Posts: 2217
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 4:12 pm 
 

Quick question:

If a band has a physical release out that can be found listed on a third party Distro, would I be able to add them even if I do not know the track listing? If so, what do I need to show in that sort of submission?
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rexxz
Retired

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Posts: 8769
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 4:13 pm 
 

Typically distro listings are sufficient proof of a release (as long as they aren't like the only item up there.. that makes it seem suspicious hehe).

Hm, I don't know if you can get away with adding a band's release without the track listing though. Best wait for another mod's opinion.

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Helvede
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 6:28 pm
Posts: 1428
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 4:16 pm 
 

Goatfangs wrote:
Quick question:

If a band has a physical release out that can be found listed on a third party Distro, would I be able to add them even if I do not know the track listing? If so, what do I need to show in that sort of submission?


I guess you're talking about either a link to a label or merchandise. If not, you can always include a link in your submission that directs us to where it is for sale, especially if there is a description of the release. Best way is to report additional info to your submission (preferable).

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MMisantropo
Magnificient Degluter of Yummy Ants

Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2002 10:52 pm
Posts: 2739
Location: Brazil
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 5:24 pm 
 

rexxz wrote:
Typically distro listings are sufficient proof of a release (as long as they aren't like the only item up there.. that makes it seem suspicious hehe).

Hm, I don't know if you can get away with adding a band's release without the track listing though. Best wait for another mod's opinion.


There's no problem with that.

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rexxz
Retired

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Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 5:25 pm 
 

Alright, I figured it might present some sort of problem with all that incomplete information. That would be like adding a band without lineup information, imo.

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SpeedF
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2008 10:00 pm
Posts: 96
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 8:40 pm 
 

Cancer Bats, an hardcore band from Canada, has previously not been acceptable on the archives. However, their new album has a big Southern/Sludge Metal influence. may i post link so mods can listen to album and give their opinion?

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Nightgaunt
I'll Swallow Your Soul

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 9:50 pm
Posts: 6240
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:07 pm 
 

You have to commit to the submission if you want to try. This thread isn't used for prelims.
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SpeedF
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Jun 05, 2008 10:00 pm
Posts: 96
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 12:25 am 
 

oh, I'm sorry, didnt know. I was not sure if they were on the rejected list or not. I submitted them

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BluntForce
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed May 28, 2008 5:32 pm
Posts: 73
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:17 pm 
 

I submitted a band called "my Bitter End"

they sound like acceptable progressive metal/deathcore to me

why have they been rejected?
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TheGrimWombat
Nelson Wannabe

Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2006 3:06 am
Posts: 1421
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:20 pm 
 

BluntForce wrote:
I submitted a band called "my Bitter End"

they sound like acceptable progressive metal/deathcore to me

why have they been rejected?


Did you get a rejection email?

If so, what did it say?

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BluntForce
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed May 28, 2008 5:32 pm
Posts: 73
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:27 pm 
 

dust666 wrote:
DaddyZeus67 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyT2uG6992Q

Now how is this one not metal?


That song is metallic in some way IMO, but the band has been discussed numerous times, and it is simply not a metal band. I dont really think they have a full metal album, maybe just a few metallic songs and that's it.


LDoH, one of my favourite goregrind bands GOREGRIND, as you probably know, grind evolved from punk, so it is not a metal genre. LDoh has the odd song with a fair bit of DM influence in it, but still dominated by grind.
i may like them but they arent acceptable, sorry to say
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BluntForce
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed May 28, 2008 5:32 pm
Posts: 73
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:33 pm 
 

TheGrimWombat wrote:
BluntForce wrote:
I submitted a band called "my Bitter End"

they sound like acceptable progressive metal/deathcore to me

why have they been rejected?


Did you get a rejection email?

If so, what did it say?


no, no email, but it seems they are on the rejected list.
the song ive heard do have a fair bit of core in them, but it sounds perfectly acceptable to me.

heres a link, dude

http://youtube.com/watch?v=qLHCGMLxEZs

id even go as far as to say progressive deathcore.
i quite like them.
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BluntForce
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed May 28, 2008 5:32 pm
Posts: 73
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:59 pm 
 

ANYBODY?

WHY IS MY BITTER END ON THE REJECTION LIST?

A LIttlE ATTENTION OVER HERE!
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MMisantropo
Magnificient Degluter of Yummy Ants

Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2002 10:52 pm
Posts: 2739
Location: Brazil
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:33 pm 
 

Can't you wait 42 minutes without going hysterical? You know, besides checking this forum, we all have families and friends, and still need to work, eat, sleep, take a dump...

My Bitter End is on the rejected list because it was considered to be not metal enough, that's pretty much the only reason why a band gets blacklisted.

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BluntForce
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed May 28, 2008 5:32 pm
Posts: 73
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:50 pm 
 

MMisantropo wrote:
Can't you wait 42 minutes without going hysterical? You know, besides checking this forum, we all have families and friends, and still need to work, eat, sleep, take a dump...

My Bitter End is on the rejected list because it was considered to be not metal enough, that's pretty much the only reason why a band gets blacklisted.


dude, i was just playing around.

have you listened to the new album the renovation? that should be plenty metal enough. i dont know how to put up tracks, but that whole album is progressiv death metal/ technical metalcore
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MMisantropo
Magnificient Degluter of Yummy Ants

Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2002 10:52 pm
Posts: 2739
Location: Brazil
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:35 pm 
 

That video you posted starts promising, soon opts for one-note modern hardcore riffs, before going completely emo. Their other songs on Myspace all follow the same formula, but keep the metal-inspired riffing slightly longer.

So while I won't personally oppose their removal from the rejected list, I don't see much of a chance for them, seeing that bands of that same style but considerably more metal oriented have been vetoed. Let's see what the others moderators have to say.

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Nightgaunt
I'll Swallow Your Soul

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 9:50 pm
Posts: 6240
PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:18 am 
 

Definitely not.
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AurvandiL
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:22 am
Posts: 1000
PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 10:21 am 
 

About the rejection of Roger Moore:
"Either there is a lack of information, or this band has no apparent discography. Please see rule #7. If this band has indeed released anything and you can show us proof, you can resubmit it again."


All these releases were indicated in the submission:
Split tape with Throat Massaker
Split CD with Honk for Mass
Split LP with Agathocles (of which detailed tracklist and info was provided in the submission)
Split CD with Mesrine (Can) / Freaknation (Spa) / Treppan'Dead (Fra)
Split CD with The Mad Thrasher / Fatal Nunchaku / Koko Boys

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 6077
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 10:33 am 
 

AurvandiL wrote:
About the rejection of Roger Moore:
"Either there is a lack of information, or this band has no apparent discography. Please see rule #7. If this band has indeed released anything and you can show us proof, you can resubmit it again."


All these releases were indicated in the submission:
Split tape with Throat Massaker
Split CD with Honk for Mass
Split LP with Agathocles (of which detailed tracklist and info was provided in the submission)
Split CD with Mesrine (Can) / Freaknation (Spa) / Treppan'Dead (Fra)
Split CD with The Mad Thrasher / Fatal Nunchaku / Koko Boys

Proof of metalness??

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AurvandiL
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:22 am
Posts: 1000
PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:06 am 
 

1- Not asked in the mail. I logically deduced it was not the problem.

2- Listen here anyway

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Witcher
Metal freak

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:27 am
Posts: 6077
Location: Czech Republic
PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:12 am 
 

AurvandiL wrote:
1- Not asked in the mail. I logically deduced it was not the problem.

2- Listen here anyway

Not metal at all, punkish noisy grind.
The powerviolence tag in their e-mail shows their direction.

Other than that, you should provide link to songsamples automatically, especially for grindcore bands and other suspicious genres listed in the rules.

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AurvandiL
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:22 am
Posts: 1000
PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:14 am 
 

Another "metalness" issue, hey?
You should listen to more than one sample to have a precise idea of the music they play.
I own a split LP, which is even more metal than the Agathocles part. They play Grindcore with huge crust and death metal influences. But again, I seem to be talking into the fucking void.

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