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TheDefiniteArticle
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:50 am
Posts: 396
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 8:21 pm 
 

Hi,

Much as I'd love to take MA as a be all end all database of everything metal - after all, it's the closest thing we've got - a lot of the claims, particularly with reference to the existence of demos of which insufficient information is known for them to be added to the 'discography' tab, are completely unsourced (sometimes there's a helpful 'demo review' link in the 'Related Links' but not always). I'm not sure if submission notes from the past are retained, but if they are, it would be nice if some sources were made visible, and if not, it would be nice if the sources were added to additional notes in the future for all information which would normally require a reference. I appreciate this is making an already large task larger, but I feel it would make the Archives a much better place.

Cheers.

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iamntbatman
Chaos Breed

Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 5:55 am
Posts: 7536
Location: Innsmouth
PostPosted: Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:20 pm 
 

The problem here is two-fold:

1) Lots of the bands you're talking about are old, pre-internet bands and thus a lot of them were added to the site before there was such a thing as a submission notes field. Previously people just stuck links in the additional notes field with the understanding that they'd be removed when the band page was made public. I'm not sure if the submission notes are archived for all of the bands submitted on V2 of the site and later (I would guess they are, somewhere) but all of that old data is likely gone for good.

2) Much of the material in submission notes for old, pre-internet bands would consist of stuff like rips of CD's or tapes provided by the submitter as proof of metalness, since old obscure demo bands won't be on YouTube and obviously won't have Facebook or Bandcamp pages or anywhere else for us to listen to a band in order to judge metalness. Obviously, we don't want to be a source for people looking for download links.

More importantly, though, it's up to the submitting user to provide proof of valid release and proof of metalness. It's not really our responsibility to make this information available to the userbase. While it is possible that errors have been made and that bands made it onto the site in the past without following our guidelines, these cases are rare. If a band is here with only the information you mention listed, it's a safe bet that valid evidence was given before the band was accepted.
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aloof
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:18 pm
Posts: 318
Location: In the graveyard, doing handstands
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:46 am 
 

op, are you interested in actually knowing more about the bands in question, or just want to "validate" their existence on M-A?
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Azmodes
Ultranaut

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:44 am
Posts: 5820
Location: Gradec, Austria
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:51 am 
 

iamntbatman wrote:
I'm not sure if the submission notes are archived for all of the bands submitted on V2 of the site and later (I would guess they are, somewhere) but all of that old data is likely gone for good.

All submission notes beginning with v2 (April 2011) are still available on the edit page (only to mods, though). Before that, not sure, might be the Ubergods have access to the old data. Greenhorn staffer that I am, I'm not even sure since when the site actually has that field.
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TheDefiniteArticle
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:50 am
Posts: 396
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 7:35 am 
 

aloof wrote:
op, are you interested in actually knowing more about the bands in question, or just want to "validate" their existence on M-A?


Primarily the former (it's interesting to read reviews etc of stuff you'll never hear), but to a lesser extent the latter too (but I see it more as improving the integrity of MA).

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Azmodes
Ultranaut

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:44 am
Posts: 5820
Location: Gradec, Austria
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 7:58 am 
 

It's worth mentioning that for more obscure bands with little to no information here or anywhere else online, we do encourage the addition of links to bits and pieces of info on the web. Be it a review, a modest fan site, a scan of an old magazine article, etc... But often there's just no other option than directly contacting whoever added the band (or actual members, if contact data is found). I have tried to update myriads of barren pages here (many for Austrian bands) and more often than not I had to resort to this, sometimes also by approaching newer, still active bands of ex-members and asking them for assistance.
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One Too Many Camel was rejected on the basis that it was not metal.

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iamntbatman
Chaos Breed

Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 5:55 am
Posts: 7536
Location: Innsmouth
PostPosted: Thu Oct 24, 2013 3:17 pm 
 

Azmodes wrote:
All submission notes beginning with v2 (April 2011) are still available on the edit page (only to mods, though). Before that, not sure, might be the Ubergods have access to the old data. Greenhorn staffer that I am, I'm not even sure since when the site actually has that field.


Ah, right. I figured that information would exist somewhere. As far as I know the submission notes field appeared with V2; I submitted bands before V2 and had to include samples/proof of release simply in the additional notes field, which the mod who handled the submission would remove before publishing the band page. If it was manually deleted from the field by the mod who approved the band, I can't imagine that the data would still exist somewhere.
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Lippyass Major wrote:
Getting a band inked into your skin permanently is always a sign of dedication and intelligence, and I have a lot of respect for the people who do it.


COMA VOID | GLOAMING | FAUSTIAN ORBS

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