I'm partial to skullcrushers. That is probably my favorite single exercise.

I hate skullcrushers. I do them because they get the job done but definitely don't enjoy it; they're easily my most dreaded part of arms day.

@Nameless_Rites, your squat is better than your deadlift? That's pretty random, everyone I know who lifts has a much better deadlift than squat. There's almost a plate difference between mine. Speaking of them, I was finally able to do squats and deads yesterday after not being able to for a while due to fucking up my back. It's too bad, the injury happened right when I was shooting up past a plateau.

I've been stalling on skullcrushers for probably close to six months. No matter how often I deload and experiment with routines I keep plateauing at 120lbs. Not even certain if it's beneficial to go that heavy(I know people always preach low weight, high volume for arms), but it's the principle of the thing!

That's a ridiculous amount of weight...your poor elbows.

Okay I'll give it a rest.

Yeah it is weird. I have been a bicyclist almost my whole life and my legs were big even before I started lifting, maybe that's why. My deadlifting has also been kind of sporadic; I had a back injury a while back, so I'm less inclined to go hard on it even now.

Yeah that's pretty insane. Whenever I go too heavy on them it hurts my elbows. Usually just throw them in as part of a superset anyway.

Good lord, and I thought my doing 90lbs. for skullcrushers was something to be proud of. O_O

It is, if you are doing it with strict form and for reps and not using your forearms for half of it.

I haven't been able to lift for over three weeks due to tendinitis in my wrist! It's so annoying, and I don't know if it's getting much better. I might try Zercher squats soon to try working around the wrist... but I was making such wonderful gains before this happened, so I'm very anxious to get back to deadlifting, benching, back squatting, etc...

That sounds atrocious and frustrating, amongst other things. I hope that resolves of its own accord; ouch!

ugh... zercher squats

i'd rather drag my dick through molten lava than go through another 4 week cycle of those.

what part of the triceps do they work the best? I just stick to push-ups, dips, narrow bench press, etc., but it's only tiger push-ups where I really feel the long head is getting a solid workout.



is that not a similar amount of weight to tiger bends?
I'm sure this guy weighs at least 55kg (probably ~80kg, so subtracting his arms from the equation of weight being lifted I'd assume he's doing well over that.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95fApjT8J8c

I never got into skulls, but tricep pulldowns with your hands turned the opposite way (palms up) will hit the other side of the tris pretty hard. I wouldn't spend a ton of time trying to isolate though, just stick to the compounds - weighted dips, close grip bench and a little bit of pushdowns at the end to finish off.

Well you are comparing a largely isolation exercise to one that involves the entire body, but I suppose the stress on the triceps is kinda-sorta comparable, but then again it isn't hitting them from the same angle, and holy shit I don't think just anybody can do one of these

I try to maintain some physical fitness myself through running and plyometrics, when I find the time. I don't have an exact routine, but I know how my body works and what exercises I need to stay in shape.

Having said that, has anyone seen training footage of the North Korean armed forces? those guys are fit as all fuck. They are thin as paper but I bet they could rip some of these UFC Tapout wearing guys heads off. It makes me wonder how they can maintain such a huge amount of full time and reserve soldiers, and keep them all in awesome shape. I heard they were mostly starved and weak, but a recent documentary I saw proved otherwise.

They're fucking good at their Tae Kwon Do as well. I wonder how American/UK/Russian forces stack up in hand to hand training? (Russians are probably just as tough. Don't know about us westerners)

UFC guys are in pretty epic shape, especially in the lower weight classes.

got a link to the footage? I'm curious what capabilities gave you that impression.


that's about as useful as being good at river-dancing. a non-grappling art based on leg work is absurdly impractical.


Russia has combat Sambo, Israel has Krav Maga, the UFC did some UFC guys v US Special Forces training camp special where it looked like the one-on-one sport fighting skills didn't translate over too well, so I would assume they're pretty well grounded. UK I have no idea...one would assume they've done their homework, too.

^ Nah I don't have a link to it, it was a documentary on unpaid (regular) TV. There are other videos and recordings on youtube though if you really wanted to see something.

As for your point on TKD being useless, I've trained with a black belt in that before and no way would I want to get into a scrap with him, under any rule set. His kicks were that damn hard I wouldn't last 60 seconds with him, but he was a bit heavier than me as well. I don't doubt the validity of these TMA's, I've trained with a few before and there are some tough bastards out there. Having said that, there are many, many fakes and phonies that got their belt from a mcdojo.

And the Sambo looks interesting, I wouldn't mind having a go at that myself one day. I have heard there are a lot of phony Krav Maga schools over in America, but I've never seen it in person for myself. Apparently legitimate practitioners of that are pretty deadly though, I suppose they would do a lot of it in the military.

Edit: This is old, but inspiring footage http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aa_yTBtt244

And also, I'll leave this here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmmp0cjOsoo

This is making me want to take TKD up.

This…

Sure TKD can look fancy and artistical due to their leg work but in an actual fight it really blows.
TKD nowadays is a competition based martial art, no rather a martial sport, and as such based
on rules and as many other styles is focused a big deal on "if you strike exactly that way, than I
do this". In an actual fight you won't find an opponent waiting in the right distance for your
spinning kicks etc. An actual fight has no rules and if we're talking about armed forces it is
aimed to kill the enemy. Attacks to the soft parts/privates, throat, eyes etc. - that's where it
is and not a roundhouse kick. You won't find these kind of attacks in rule based, competitive
martial arts. Yes, sure - you possibly can adopt TKS moves to such things but a ruthless
street fighter will always beat the shit out of a "normal black belt" TKD/Karateka/Judoka.

^ but not if they know their kata...

And also, does anyone here doubt the validity of the NKPA's hand to hand skills? I reckon they would be deadly in a fist fight with any regular MMA competitor. The big time MMA guys would probably be a different story. But even then, those guys are trained to kill for a living, not compete in sport for a living.

I suspect just about any halfway competent soldier from any halfway respectable land army in the world would be able to kill most UFC fighters in any realistic hand-to-hand combat situation if they have kept up with their training, regardless of how physically fit UFC fighters are. UFC fighting is for sport and entertainment; military hand-to-hand fighting is for killing. Period, full-stop, end of discussion. Marines and Sayeret Matkal don't spend years getting a fancy black belt in any fancy UFC-recognized art for a reason. It wouldn't do them much good against an opponent willing to bite your testicles off after throwing sand in your eyes to survive. And any fighting form that focuses on pinning and choking is even less than ineffective against multiple opponents, it's outright harmful, because the last thing you want is to be pinning one guy on the ground while five of his buddies stomp your face.

I guarantee that footage is cherry picked guys who are fed extraordinarily well and who go through a ridiculous training regimen so that they look really good in training footage. I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of NK's gigantic armed forces are underfed and undertrained.

You're probably right, with all the sanctions on NK at the moment I'd be surprised if they could feed and cater for their whole defense force properly. Having said, this kind of stuff is amazing to watch. Couldn't imagine having to do that training with nothing in your stomach, you'd probably just collapse after a while of it.

People are quick to dismiss the potential danger of TMA's but these guys show how powerful that stuff can be. I'd like to see one of these guys actually compete in an MMA show and display their fitness and training, under the appropriate rules.

See, that's where it'd go tits up.

Well.. I'm sure they'd be tough enough to go at it with guys in their own weight class. I mean, for the country they live in and what they do for a living, they'd have guts in them. They've certainly got the physical fitness for it.

Finally think I'm 100% over my stupid back injury. After a month of not deadlifting or squating I went back and went light the first time. Next time hit my old PRs without a problem and even got a ten pound new PR for 325lbs on deadlift (which admittedly could be a lot better). I think more than anything I learned from this you really can't be lazy and skip the warmup sets. My form is not where it should be for deadlifts, so trying to work on that as well.

Pace yourself now; don't try to rush back to the same weight.

Getting sent to fucking Nowhere, Ohio for about 6 weeks or so for work... decided I'm gonna say "fuck off" to my diet and get my lifts back up to where they should be. Bulk mode engage!

...but Dystopia haha, come on, man. Warm-up sets are absolutely crucial whenever you're lifting anywhere near your 85-100% max. They're damn near necessary to get your nervous system firing properly and to prevent injury. Just don't be too conservative and burn yourself out for warmups, and it won't have any negative impact on your working sets.

Well yeah, I realize that now. Like a lot of people it took an injury to make me do it the right way. As for the diet thing, I tell myself I'm bulking as an excuse, but really I'm just back to my old fatass ways again. Luckily lifting 5 days a week and doing cardio 3 days is keeping me from gaining weight. Started doing sprint intervals this week, and now I feel like an idiot for going on hour long runs all the time; these seem so much more effective.

It's 90% nutrition, I'm telling you. Once that lightbulb flickers on everything before will feel like a total waste of time. The timing/frequency of your meals is nearly as important as WHAT you are actually eating. It isn't easy to quantize everything and commit to it, and that is why a lot of people don't even bother. Once you are used to it however, it is second nature.

finally got my first muscle-up today (hadn't heard of 'em a year ago).



I've never heard anyone sciencey support any notion about the timing of meals, except about exercising before breakfast for weight loss. d'you have any citations?

So is there any truth to the whole 'weightlifting makes your punches slow and stiff?' I'm one of the few guys at my gym that lifts and I often find I'm slower than some of the skinnier guys with less boxing experience than myself. I firmly believe it's just a matter of training, training, training and conditioning, but when I some of the other guys unleash insanely fast flurries of combos I can't help but wonder whether my lifting routine has been interfering. Can't tell because I've lifted as long as I've boxed...either way I don't intend to give up one for the other and I'm honestly not TOO bothered as the adrenaline of the ring often compensates for the slowness I notice on my bagwork. I was just wondering if any of you here that do sports with a lot of explosive / snapping motions can tell me if you feel lifting has impacted your performance in any noticeable way.

EDIT: Also, I know I'm late to the conversation but skullcrushers are my favorite tricep iso exercise by far.

I won't have time until Wednesday to draft up a proper, full response, but since most in here are looking toward fitness and putting on muscle, we can focus on protein here just for a second. So you have your two main protein supplements, whey and casein. Whey is actually bifurcated into three groupings: concentrate, isolate, and hydrolysate. Concentrate is the cheapest but is high in lactose, but the point of whey on the whole is that it is fast acting and peaks in about 60 minutes. Casein is far slower on the uptake, as it curdles in the body and elicits a slower burn effect. So which to take before bed? Obviously casein due to its anti-catabolic nature. Which before working out? Probably whey, but there are hybrids available to instill both advantages. Obviously the timing and frequency/infrequency of ingestion is paramount here. If you want too long in between meals your blood sugar drops and you get intense food cravings that make it very difficult to stay on diet. This is why more frequent, smaller meals are generally the way to go no matter what your goal. There are studies backing most of this, not broscience. I will try and draft something more detailed later but I just don't have the time or patience tonight.

So went to physiotherapy today for my lower back issues, and I'm really glad I did. I kept hurting my back on deadlifts and it turns out that the reason for this is tightness in my hamstrings (and to a lesser extent my hips). Since they were so tight they were not engaged properly and my lower back ended up overcompensating and taking on too heavy of a strain. He gave me some stretches to do everyday. I think after getting a personal trainer to help me with form and a belt for when I'm going heavy I'll be alright.

Plus it seems that you like to push it heavy just for heaviness' sake, so getting it checked out was a wise move. You have to mentally engage the correct muscles when doing demanding, core movements like the deadlift and squat, so overcompensating can happen in the stress of the moment.

How much weight difference are we talking, here? If you're 40 pounds heavier than your competitors, even if you're in tremendous shape, you'll likely be slower than them. LeBron James is insanely athletic, but compare him to Russell Westbrook, who is 5 inches shorter and 60 pounds lighter, and it's no contest. Westbrook wins.

If you aren't in tremendous shape, shed that extra weight before anything else. If you're still slow, you may have muscle imbalances. It's also possible that you just don't have the same density or structure of fast twitch fibers that the others do.

We're talking 15-30 pounds at most (with a couple of exceptions), and I'm in decent shape. Muscle imbalances definitely play a role in my punching power as I only recently started incorporating my lower body into my lifting routine for the first time in over a year (broken heel). As for speed, it may be a million things, but I do wonder if lifting is one of them. It sure is frustrating when my mind makes decisions quickly but my body lags behind. I'm sure it's just a matter of training, the competitiveness of the sport and my desire to get better is just making me search for something to blame.

So, used a belt for the first time at the gym today. Mostly doing it to protect my lower back as that's a problem area for me, but man, does it really help for what you can lift. So my squat PR was previously 235lbs, and right away I was able to do 250 for two reps. Also managed 225 for five reps, and the most reps I've ever done at that weight before was 1 (although I could feel my form really starting to suffer on the last two reps, so will have to improve on that before I increase).

Nice. Do you have a previous back injury or what? I mean... the belts help compensate, but you want your lower back and core muscles to grow stronger, that isn't really an area that you can get away with lagging behind - especially with compound lifts.

Yeah, that was the thing where I went to the physiotherapist and it ended up I was hurting my lower back during deadlifts because my hamstrings were too tight and not engaging and gave me stretches and whatnot for. I do train my back and usually tack on core stuff at the end of every second workout.

Unrelated, but where do you guys fit in shoulders in your work outs? Right now I'm doing a three day split (I'll do it three days on, one day off, repeat). First day is back/biceps, second day is chest/triceps and third is leg day. Really having trouble figuring out where to put shoulders because benching hits the shoulders to some degree so I want to separate it from that, but I can't put leg day and back next to each other because deadlifting and and squating have too much overlap in leg/back muscles hit.