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ThrashingTheRedemer
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 1:50 am
Posts: 170
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 8:30 am 
 

Joko Widodo aka Jokowi is leading in the early exit polls to claim victory in the Indonesian Presidential elections. He is considered a relatively political cleanskin, not being tainted by political corruption scandals or human rights abuse allegations that have surrounded other candidates. He is also a metalhead.

Would be interested to hear people's thoughts on this guy - especially forum members from Indonesia. Politics aside, it seems pretty awesome, at least to an outsider, that someone who gets metal would take the centre stage in such a way.

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iamntbatman
Chaos Breed

Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 5:55 am
Posts: 7302
Location: Innsmouth
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 8:57 am 
 

I'm not the biggest Napalm Death fan (they're not bad or anything, but just don't float my boat too vigorously, I guess) but there are far, far worse metal shirts the dude could be wearing, both from a musical but more importantly political perspective. Seems like a cool guy, from what you've said so far. Maybe he'll institute a crackdown on lame Indonesian brutal death metal bands!
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Morrigan
Crone of War

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 7:27 am
Posts: 9385
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 12:57 pm 
 

Maybe he'll institute a crackdown on the lame and shitty Indonesian Islamic laws.
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ShaolinLambKiller
King Asshole

Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:10 pm
Posts: 11660
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 1:21 pm 
 

I fully expected some regular 'big name' metal band on his shirt when I scrolled down. Napalm Death is great. I don't live in Indonesia so that's about the extent of my concern.
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Under_Starmere
Abhorrent Fish-Man

Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2007 5:00 pm
Posts: 4113
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 1:32 pm 
 

Morrigan wrote:
Maybe he'll institute a crackdown on the lame and shitty Indonesian Islamic laws.


Yeah I'm actually surprised that a candidate with even a passing connection with what most folks would consider "blasphemous" inclinations could get that far in the polls in a religious-minded nation like Indonesia. Maybe I have an exaggerated idea of the hold of religion on social dynamics there but I wouldn't have expected this. I'd say it bodes well?
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CF_Mono
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2010 5:21 pm
Posts: 1311
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 1:59 pm 
 

Must say I'm pretty surprised. Good for him. I wonder how the usual left wing thoughts and anti-corporate themes of Grind a la Napalm Death compare with his own.
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Marag
Veteran

Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 8:55 pm
Posts: 2659
Location: down there where chaos prevails
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:09 pm 
 

He looks too nice to be a president. I don't know anything about Indonesia so I refrain from making any comments about it, but ND is cool, and the fact the he is not involved in corruption puts him miles above the candidates we have here.

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Turner
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 2:04 am
Posts: 1058
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:27 pm 
 

indonesia's a strange place - one the one hand the culture is very much rooted in conservative islamic tradition and respect for your ancestors/elders/etc, but on the other, some of the most depraved shit ever lurks just beneath the surface and is unofficially 100% tolerated. you can drink yourself rotten, eat magic mushrooms until the cosmos comes to you, and fuck ladyboys to your heart's content very easily and quickly... and in the (unlikely) case of your arrest, there's no crime too big to bribe your way out of. malaysia's the same, and i haven't been there but i assume singapore as well. there are doubtless many subtleties to their society that i don't understand, but it's a pretty safe bet all the same that this guy's metalheadness can be overlooked if he abides by the "honour your parents" and such rules...

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OneSizeFitzpatrick
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2011 4:56 pm
Posts: 592
Location: A smoldering ruin with wi-fi, Chechnya
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 8:22 pm 
 

Turner wrote:
indonesia's a strange place - one the one hand the culture is very much rooted in conservative islamic tradition and respect for your ancestors/elders/etc, but on the other, some of the most depraved shit ever lurks just beneath the surface and is unofficially 100% tolerated. you can drink yourself rotten, eat magic mushrooms until the cosmos comes to you, and fuck ladyboys to your heart's content very easily and quickly... and in the (unlikely) case of your arrest, there's no crime too big to bribe your way out of. malaysia's the same, and i haven't been there but i assume singapore as well. there are doubtless many subtleties to their society that i don't understand, but it's a pretty safe bet all the same that this guy's metalheadness can be overlooked if he abides by the "honour your parents" and such rules...

Pretty much summed up what I was gonna say. They're the largest Muslim country in the world, yet they also have huge open air festivals of nothing but slamming, brutal garbage disposal death metal acts.
I remember reading something about this guy a while back in Vice I think, he seems like he has the potential to be a rising political star in the country http://www.vice.com/read/meet-jokowi-in ... -president (also note, same exact photo in this article).
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The Infamous Bastard
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2013 7:47 am
Posts: 244
Location: Lair of the Yaks and Yetis
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 3:34 am 
 

Cool thing. I was pretty surprised seeing someone in flannels to run for presidency. Good to know he's a metalhead too.

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BloodSacrificeShaman
Leopold Herman Stotch

Joined: Wed May 11, 2011 3:20 am
Posts: 1695
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 3:44 am 
 

Turner wrote:
indonesia's a strange place - one the one hand the culture is very much rooted in conservative islamic tradition and respect for your ancestors/elders/etc, but on the other, some of the most depraved shit ever lurks just beneath the surface and is unofficially 100% tolerated. you can drink yourself rotten, eat magic mushrooms until the cosmos comes to you, and fuck ladyboys to your heart's content very easily and quickly...


Wait a minute. Out of all the depraved shit that goes on in the world and from what I've heard of Indonesia - alcohol, drugs and transsexuals (the last of which isn't even a depravity, for fuck sake :roll: ) is what you mention? What? Just.. what?

Anyways, this is kind of cool, I guess. A president who listens to death metal in his spare time. It's a neat novelty. Hopefully if he gets through he is a good president and does much for Indonesia.
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Turner
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 2:04 am
Posts: 1058
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 4:56 am 
 

BloodSacrificeShaman wrote:
Turner wrote:
indonesia's a strange place - one the one hand the culture is very much rooted in conservative islamic tradition and respect for your ancestors/elders/etc, but on the other, some of the most depraved shit ever lurks just beneath the surface and is unofficially 100% tolerated. you can drink yourself rotten, eat magic mushrooms until the cosmos comes to you, and fuck ladyboys to your heart's content very easily and quickly...


Wait a minute. Out of all the depraved shit that goes on in the world and from what I've heard of Indonesia - alcohol, drugs and transsexuals (the last of which isn't even a depravity, for fuck sake :roll: ) is what you mention? What? Just.. what?


my point was fairly obvious - it's a country whose espoused national values are the complete opposite of what you'll find immediately available with no real repercussions on the street after sundown. there are definitely worse things going on there - crime, corruption, human rights violations - but as we're focusing on the fact that their probable next president has what many (especially in the islamic world) consider morally-questionable at best tastes, that's what i mentioned: alcohol, drugs, prostitution. my spidey sense tells me you wanna have a dig, but i dunno... i reckon my reasoning's pretty watertight here man.

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BloodSacrificeShaman
Leopold Herman Stotch

Joined: Wed May 11, 2011 3:20 am
Posts: 1695
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 5:07 am 
 

Turner wrote:
my point was fairly obvious - it's a country whose espoused national values are the complete opposite of what you'll find immediately available with no real repercussions on the street after sundown. there are definitely worse things going on there - crime, corruption, human rights violations - but as we're focusing on the fact that their probable next president has what many (especially in the islamic world) consider morally-questionable at best tastes, that's what i mentioned: alcohol, drugs, prostitution. my spidey sense tells me you wanna have a dig, but i dunno... i reckon my reasoning's pretty watertight here man.


Ahh, so you were simply talking about things Islamic culture in general finds unsavory? I thought you were speaking of them as if they were by your own reckoning. I get 'ya. I apologise for the misunderstanding.
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Turner
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 2:04 am
Posts: 1058
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 5:27 am 
 

*high five*
have to admit, having seen the ladyboys with my own eyes i probably wouldn't pay for one myself, but i make no moral judgements!

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Rasc
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 9:19 am
Posts: 176
Location: Brazil
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 7:52 pm 
 

He seems to be a pretty popular guy in Indonesia, I see he's the governor of Jakarta and there's even a movie on his life. Just... wow. Selamat, motherf├╝cker.

I thought metal was a legally pursued matter and a huge taboo in Indonesia though, despite its rich grindcore scene. Or is this Malaysia?

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Occultcannibal
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 7:09 pm
Posts: 45
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 11:16 pm 
 

^ I think it might be China you're thinking of man, although it is heavily persecuted in Bangladesh for the most part too from what i've heard.
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ThrashingTheRedemer
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2008 1:50 am
Posts: 170
PostPosted: Tue Jul 22, 2014 11:35 pm 
 

So Jokowi was officially declared the winner last night after a comprehensive vote tally and subsequent dummy-spit by the rival Probowo, which lead him to declare he was withdrawing from the electoral process mere moments before the result was announced. Any constitutional court challenges aside, chalk up a victory for Metal!

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Jackoroth
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2012 11:55 pm
Posts: 313
Location: Roxburgh Park
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 10:31 am 
 

Pretty cool that he's now the president but a question, is that a bootleg Napalm Death shirt?
I ask because I know there's so much shirt bootlegging in Indonesia, when I went there I saw plenty of it within metal shirts plus I've never seen that Napalm Death shirt he is wearing before alas perhaps it's a cheap bootleg?
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narsilianshard
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2009 12:22 pm
Posts: 461
Location: Seattle
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 4:38 pm 
 

Jackoroth wrote:
Pretty cool that he's now the president but a question, is that a bootleg Napalm Death shirt?
I ask because I know there's so much shirt bootlegging in Indonesia, when I went there I saw plenty of it within metal shirts plus I've never seen that Napalm Death shirt he is wearing before alas perhaps it's a cheap bootleg?


I'm pretty sure 99% of band shirts in Asia are bootleg.
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tomcat_ha
Veteran

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 8:05 am
Posts: 2619
Location: Netherlands
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 4:53 pm 
 

apparently someone in europe i vaguely know has it too

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Dudemanguy
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 7:19 pm
Posts: 599
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 8:04 pm 
 

Huh, that's pretty cool. I would guess he'd be a fan of Kekal.

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waiguoren
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:23 am
Posts: 2111
Location: Make a kiss to her
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 8:36 pm 
 

One thing I know about Indonesia is that if you marry an Indo you have to convert to their religion or it's a no-no. Knew two Aussie guys who ended up marrying Indonesian ladies, the one married a Christian or Catholic, no big deal there, the other one married a Muslim, so as part of his wedding vows/ceremony he had to slit a live goat's throat. I don't see the point really, why not keep your hands clean and just go to the local butcher? The butcher might even have a nice deal on steaks, possibly ribs too if you ask nicely, so it's a terrible loss all around.
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Machine_Dead
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 3:47 pm
Posts: 634
Location: Antwerp, Belgium
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 11:05 pm 
 

Weird, but cool I guess... Would be cool to compile like a list of political active figures for each country who are closet metalheads... For instance the closest that we ever got in Belgium for a metal politician is Vincent van Quickenborne (ex-minister of pensions, and currently mayor of Kortrijk, which is a fairly big city in the west of Belgium). He apparently is a fan of Killswitch Engage, Hatebreed and DevilDriver according to this video ;p http://www.stubru.be/media/ministerqdee ... topgraspop

hehe, anyone else got any other examples from other countries ? :p
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Machine_Dead
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 3:47 pm
Posts: 634
Location: Antwerp, Belgium
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 11:11 pm 
 

Rasc wrote:

I thought metal was a legally pursued matter and a huge taboo in Indonesia though, despite its rich grindcore scene. Or is this Malaysia?


There seems to be a rather large metal scene in Indonesia actually despite this. I remember a couple bands stating on facebook that they were surprised to have some many Indonesian followers on facebook. They didn't quite understand why that was....

F.e.; there's this facebook community page; over 20.000 likes... :)
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tomcat_ha
Veteran

Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 8:05 am
Posts: 2619
Location: Netherlands
PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:21 am 
 

there are a couple metal politicians over here like the leader of our socialist party and someone in the christian democrat party

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ScratchMyBack
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:04 am
Posts: 1067
Location: Malaysia
PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 12:49 pm 
 

Rasc wrote:
I thought metal was a legally pursued matter and a huge taboo in Indonesia though, despite its rich grindcore scene. Or is this Malaysia?


Yes and no.

In Indonesia, they have a rich grindcore/death metal scene but there are pockets of conservative communities in the country despite being very secular. Think America but with Muslims instead of Mormons/Christians so to a certain extend the politicians do have to pander them. So in urban areas, they're pretty much secular.

In Malaysia on the other hand, while on paper it is a secular federation, states are allowed to have religious enforcement for Muslims as granted by the constitution. The religious laws differ from one state to another, causing more Islamic states like Kelantan or Terengganu to have very, very religious laws. This however, applies only to Muslims. So the problem is that in more conservative parts, raids were pretty common but the worst part is that it is legal. However on the opposite you have more liberal states like in East Malaysia where raids never occur (If you're Gay/Transexual in Sabah/Sarawak, the Eastern states, authorities can't force you to go to gay therapy camps). In comparison to Indonesia, the scene is more focused on Melodic Death Metal, Black Metal and Thrash is pretty mainstream, considering the negative perception the certain parts of the community has.

Both scenes however, infected with bad Metalcore, At-The-Gates imitators bands. Worst of all, they are popular because they are rarely associated with blasphemous imagery. Due to pressure from Islamic communities however, there many bands sing Anti-Zionist lyrics or one or 2 bands singing Anti-Shiite themes instead (the common denomination here is Sunni and there are groups who even claimed that there should be a ban of Shiite teachings in the constitution). Maybe it is more "acceptable" in comparison than being totally anti-religion.

Example of an Anti-Shiite band:

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joncheetham88
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2008 10:41 pm
Posts: 459
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 3:55 pm 
 

Turner wrote:
...i haven't been there but i assume singapore as well

Haha, no, only in some ways.
narsilianshard wrote:
I'm pretty sure 99% of band shirts in Asia are bootleg.

And no.

Funnily enough Jokowi, with his Napalm Death tees and love of metal is far cleaner both politically and it seems in his personal life than a lot of the sanctimonious political leaders in Indonesia, who dress in white, acting super-religious, when behind the scenes they get a whole black income from filthy dealings, maintain several mistresses and a roster of prostitutes.

More significantly than his musical taste, as a close friend from Indonesia pointed out to me, Jokowi is the first Indonesian leader to end an address not only with a Muslim formality, but with Hindu and Buddhist equivalents as well.
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