PRISTINA (Reuters) - Europe's major powers and the United States said on Monday they recognized Kosovo's new independence, as Serbs reacted with anger and some states warned that its secession from Serbia set a dangerous precedent.

What I found rather ironic is the people of Kosovo celebrate their independance waving american and albanian flags..??..

Well, the U.S. obviously supported their independence.

The smaller the states become the better for me.

The US has done many good things for Kosovo in the past, they love America over there.

You should be more specific, the Albanians love America over there. You could follow the reaction of Kosovo Serbians all over the news.

Yeah you're right, my mistake.

Shows their real goal: one great Albania, or aka a Mafia-rogue state in the middle of Europe.
Something in the interest of the US: they can have a military base there, and the Albanians continue to destabilize Europe with their drugs/arms/people-trafficking and the development of a extremist Muslim-state inside Europe.

Hence the US flags...

I am wondering if the Western world would also applaud an independent Hawaii, Scotland, Kurdistan or Basque Country, to only name a few??

I would.

Very much so.

Not sure about globalist politicians, though.

Not to speak about the fact, that the Serbians in Northern Kosovo will never recognize the Albanian central government. You have other potential Palestina there.

It would be interesting to watch, if all the Mexicans living in California would crete and uprising to show their true heritage and to demand renewed sepearation from the U.S.A. and union with Mexico for historical reasons.

Come on, do you really think the two can be compared? Please name more than two parallels.

A separationist movement can arise everywhere in the world.
1. fact - California belonged to Mexico originally
2. fact - the number of Mexican population is growing there
3. a minority often tries to demand some sort of autonomy, the history teaches us that, especially when it grows strong on certain area.
I am not saying, that it could happen tomorrow, but the Americans should look at it from that aspect.

The difference is, that Kosovo belonged always either to Serbia, or was under the Ottoman empire rule. It was never a state as such and even if the Albanians always lived in that region, their massive population has developed first in the last few centuries.

The difference really is that European colonies can hardly be compared to Europe itself, because they had considerable less time to grow into what they are today. It just seems very far-fetched to me.

Anyone else find it ironic that the West fought Milosevic against his implementation of an ethnically divided Yugoslavia, yet with the Dayton accord and this recognition, they've done precisely that.

I can understand Witcher's point. People who lived in Belgium during the independence weren't actual Belgians at all. They were and still are a mixture of people who gatered there from most likly German regions during hundreds of years. Another example is the U.S. they got their independence while the country was infested with the ruling Europeans and African slaves.

I would also applaud an independent Flanders, an independent Northern Epirus and an independent Texas. Smaller states are always good for me. Smaller states mean less power. Less power means less authority. And that's always good

Less authority - like Vatican??
States created by such nationalist movements are usually very far from anarchist utopias.
Smaller states do not always mean less authority. There are still tribes in the world, where the chief has a divine absolute authority, which he can exercise on a rather small ground.

I don't particulary care about Kosovo being independent now, but I certainly think the countries that are accepting it shouldn't have done that so fast ... mainly because nationalists around the globe will be inspired by that and think they can get away with declaring an independent state.




Why do people keep talking about this? It will not happen, nobody even wants to be independent, we just want more power given to the disctricts (in stead of everything handled by the Belgian government) ... now ofcourse there's a couple of idiots who really do want to get Flanders independent but nobody really supports them.

Since when Vatican means less authority???

By less authority I mean both state and church authority.

Of course, I was being sarcastic.
I have named Vatican as an example of miniature state with super authority.

However it is much easier for states like Vatican to be turned into small autonomous communities than for states like Russia and USA.

Smaller states also mean easier manipulation from more powerful countries.
Now take a guess for Kosovo, which examble they will fillow.?.?.

The most probable scenario is that Kosovo will be manipulated by the US and then will be merged with Albania. And I really hope that this won't happen.

This is the biggest load of shit I have ever heard of, Kosovo in no way deserves independence from Serbia. Important events in Serbian history are based right there in Kosovo, and the Albanians did not become a majority there until Tito and his government allowed them to mass immigrate during the 1960's so I don't see why they should have any right in saying how to run the government let alone splitting away from Serbia. This situation was very similar to the Krajina situation 13 years ago when Serbians made up the majority in certain parts of Croatia and they had no right to split away because that part was always Croatian and in fact Croatia's history starts right in Krajina. It wasn't right then and its not right now all its going to do is make a Greater Albania.

"If war ever again comes to Europe, it will be because of some damned silly thing in the Balkans"

- German Statesman Otto Von Bismarck, 1898

This definitely opens a can of worms.

What can I say we may be small but we are a pivotal part of world history. Also this quote is more relevant to World War I.

I wouldn't.

It would just be illogical, if every province or area is independent it would be chaos. you would have thousands of "country's" and it would slow down or stop international trade, support for third world country's and so on.

Support for third world countries??? Tell me you're kidding. If not point me one goverment of a financially strong state that sends money or any kind of help. Only one.

For now maybe, but it could easily come to apply to this situation also, especially if the Kosovar Serbs secede and/or Serbia decides to invade- after all they have Russia's backing.

If the United States committed war crimes and ethnic cleansing of those Mexicans, and say the United States was a weak and unpopular power, than it's more than likely that the major powers in the world would be more willing to allow a separation. The reality with that example is that the United States is a strong sovereign power, and if there would be war crimes they would be hidden, masked to save face, or condemned with little power to do anything about it. The American people may lose faith in their government, but the state wouldn't fail.

In many way, it's a number of conditions which separate Kosovo's separation from those of other secessionist movements. Firstly, Yugoslavia had been an unpopular and weak state, compared to the rest of the world. Secessionist movements had already occurred. Throughout Yugoslavia there had been violence, and - despite a decent army - the government chose policies that were not well received by the rest of the world.

Secondly, because of how close Yugoslavia is to the rest of Europe, and of historical precedent in previous wars, any violence in Yugoslavia is a concern to the rest of Europe - especially given the situation after the fall of the Soviet Union. NATO would've been called in regardless. If this had been Africa, few governments would do anything about it. If this had been in the heart of Western Europe, North America or South America, the secessionist movement would've been squashed or universally condemned. More than likely, any violence would be considered terrorism, and the movements would be more inclined to be peaceful. The Balkans, being on the borderline of Europe, did not have that option. There were concerns that violence would spread outwards towards its neighboring weak states and into the rest of Europe.

Lastly, and most importantly, Yugoslavia used violence, war crimes and to a degree ethnic cleansing to try to solve the problem. Serbia now must contend with the blemish of such acts. Given the prior conditions, it's not tolerated. It's this which outweighs all historical or religious importance that Kosovo may have for Serbia. It's also what tends to separate most other secessionist movements (although, in strong states with high popularity there are cases of this, but they're usually downplayed for the sake of stability). It's for this reason, regardless if Russia pouts and other states are concerned, that an independent Kosovo is a reality. The West could not tolerate allowing Kosovo back into Serbia, especially given the majority (92%) do not want that. Nor would it necessarily be desired to have Kosovo and Albania 'formally' combine. Doing so would suggest the West wants to (publicly?) direct the sovereignty of other states.

As for the 4% of leftover Serbs. Despite many of them being poor and old, what will more likely happen is that North Kosovo will gain some autonomy within the state of Kosovo. The other majority enclave of Serbs, Štrpce, would more than likely be overrun by Albanians in little time.

Well, we still have the UN, and we all know that the UN is "all talk and no walk" but with more and more independent countries, which will all want in on the UN, even less will happen.

After the tsunami on christmas, a lot of countries helpen those in need.....

Nah. Philanthropical organizations helped the victims of tsunami (and even that is not for sure). Goverments didn't do anything. However, I see your point.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/12/29/bush.quake/index.html

EUSKADI LIBREEEEE!!!!

Yeah right

Bush, the biggest philanthroper, would surely be the first to help.

EDIT: Bietan jarrai, Avestriel!

It is a fact that our government contributed to aid, as well as others. That alone invalidates your claim.

I cannot prove that it is true or not. I was not there when the help was given to the victims and I am sure none of us were. Only Mieszko Talarczyk but he cannot confirm anything.

You're daft. It's been documented.

"The president interrupted his vacation at his Texas ranch to speak with reporters for the first time since Sunday's earthquake-triggered waves killed tens of thousands of people."
I rest my case...

You had no case. Why don't you read the entire article?


*edit* Here, Uncle Wiki can teach you many things, too:

link