Encyclopaedia Metallum: The Metal Archives

Message board

* FAQ    * Search   * Register   * Login 



This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  
Author Message Previous topic | Next topic
Acrobat
Eric Olthwaite

Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:53 am
Posts: 6547
Location: Fortress Northallerton, North Yorkshire
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:05 pm 
 

No I do not. There was fuck all good about this style twelve years ago, so I don't have any nostalgia for it. Also, fuck System of a Down - they seemed to have survived the nu metal cull but they're probably one of the most annoying bands from that scene. At least Korn et al seemed like genuinely angst-ridded thirty-something-year-old-teens. :P
_________________
'Heavy metal top of the class, stuff the media up your arse!' - Den Dennis.

Let's Trade in the Darkness of Hell! - updated for 2014!

Top
 Profile  
Against Such Things
Metalhead

Joined: Thu May 17, 2012 8:16 pm
Posts: 450
Location: Southern Maryland
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:12 pm 
 

The nu metal comparisons are identified largely with their s/t debut, which is just hardcore. The next three albums are a mixture of groove metal and hardcore with some alternative rock showing up. The last two efforts have been pretty much standard melodic metalcore, albeit heavier. I kind of figured that hip hop influence was necessary for something to be nu metal, and that certainly isn't there anywhere.

But that's the thing. Nu metal seems to have a fairly broad range of sounds that it describes, because it doesn't seem to be a particular sound so much as a mixture of a bunch of sounds. So, there's a heavy degree of variance based off of how much of the ratio of the ingredients. It's why Slipknot's debut sounds nothing like Limp Bizkit, who in turn is a fair bit different from System of A Down.
_________________
Wilytank wrote:
I once knew a guy that stole another guy's virginity and sold it on the black market for some FUCKIN' WEED.

Top
 Profile  
WaywardSon
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:48 am
Posts: 903
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:18 pm 
 

Turner wrote:
you know, for all his bandwagon-jumping, i have to respect robb flynn for being so damn versatile. he's covered 3-4 genres/sub-genres now and been at the top of the heap in all of them. and you can go straight to his arguably worst album, the burning red, to hear what i mean - whether you like the style or not, i find it hard to imagine someone not admitting that those choruses are fuuuucking catchy. and it's only better from there: burn my eyes deserves a grammy.


Pretty sure Supercharger almost ended the band.
_________________
FasterDisaster wrote:
Is her butthole hairy?

Top
 Profile  
TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 614
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 9:07 pm 
 

Against Such Things wrote:
The nu metal comparisons are identified largely with their s/t debut, which is just hardcore. The next three albums are a mixture of groove metal and hardcore with some alternative rock showing up. The last two efforts have been pretty much standard melodic metalcore, albeit heavier. I kind of figured that hip hop influence was necessary for something to be nu metal, and that certainly isn't there anywhere.

But that's the thing. Nu metal seems to have a fairly broad range of sounds that it describes, because it doesn't seem to be a particular sound so much as a mixture of a bunch of sounds. So, there's a heavy degree of variance based off of how much of the ratio of the ingredients. It's why Slipknot's debut sounds nothing like Limp Bizkit, who in turn is a fair bit different from System of A Down.

Metalcore? o_O Probably the last thing I'd think about when talking about them. Overall I'd describe SOAD in a similar way as Deftones, both started with uber-angry nu-metal (with SOAD having a punkier feel while I'd say Deftones' "Around The Fur" does have some actual groove/thrash influences in it) and then took a more alternative rock route with the more aggressive parts showing through in some songs. Both bands are really, really hard to put under any one genre tag.

But yeah, nu-metal is generally a bit of a mess - it's hard to define what it sounds like, hence the whole problem. Still, I guess most people using the term are aware of that I think (and it's still a better name than the retarded "mallcore").
_________________
Poisonfume wrote:
I marvel at the clusterfuck of confusion we have constructed.

Top
 Profile  
Against Such Things
Metalhead

Joined: Thu May 17, 2012 8:16 pm
Posts: 450
Location: Southern Maryland
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 9:21 pm 
 

TheLiberation wrote:
Metalcore? o_O Probably the last thing I'd think about when talking about them. Overall I'd describe SOAD in a similar way as Deftones, both started with uber-angry nu-metal (with SOAD having a punkier feel while I'd say Deftones' "Around The Fur" does have some actual groove/thrash influences in it) and then took a more alternative rock route with the more aggressive parts showing through in some songs. Both bands are really, really hard to put under any one genre tag.

But yeah, nu-metal is generally a bit of a mess - it's hard to define what it sounds like, hence the whole problem. Still, I guess most people using the term are aware of that I think (and it's still a better name than the retarded "mallcore").

Sorry, my post up there was meant to be a continuation of the Demon Hunter sub-conversation, not SOAD.
_________________
Wilytank wrote:
I once knew a guy that stole another guy's virginity and sold it on the black market for some FUCKIN' WEED.

Top
 Profile  
TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 614
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 9:31 pm 
 

Oh. :lol: Sorry, got confused a bit.
_________________
Poisonfume wrote:
I marvel at the clusterfuck of confusion we have constructed.

Top
 Profile  
Turner
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 2:04 am
Posts: 1134
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 3:08 am 
 

Desperta_Ferro wrote:
oh, and the Fear Factory cover Epica made, "Replica" - But I don't like the original version, the vocals are a dealbreaker for me (and that's the big reason why I don't like nu-metal)


wwwwooooaaaaaahhh there buddy!! demanufacture is a LONG way from nu-metal. i even invented my own genre for it!!! metal noir. think about it: their first two albums are industrial death metal ala pitchshifter/godflesh but with actual musical ability, combined with the aesthetics of movies like terminator and blade runner. it's heavy, it's mechanical, it's dark shades of blue and grey!

in all seriousness though, FF cop a bit of flack for later ties to it, but you should in no way associate their first two albums with nu-metal.


Last edited by Turner on Tue Sep 03, 2013 3:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
Turner
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 2:04 am
Posts: 1134
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 3:09 am 
 

WaywardSon wrote:
Turner wrote:
you know, for all his bandwagon-jumping, i have to respect robb flynn for being so damn versatile. he's covered 3-4 genres/sub-genres now and been at the top of the heap in all of them. and you can go straight to his arguably worst album, the burning red, to hear what i mean - whether you like the style or not, i find it hard to imagine someone not admitting that those choruses are fuuuucking catchy. and it's only better from there: burn my eyes deserves a grammy.


Pretty sure Supercharger almost ended the band.


oh, yeah. forgot about that album. well, with that one lump of shit as exception, what i said is still fairly true though.

Top
 Profile  
InnesI
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:19 pm
Posts: 220
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:53 am 
 

WaywardSon wrote:
Turner wrote:
you know, for all his bandwagon-jumping, i have to respect robb flynn for being so damn versatile. he's covered 3-4 genres/sub-genres now and been at the top of the heap in all of them. and you can go straight to his arguably worst album, the burning red, to hear what i mean - whether you like the style or not, i find it hard to imagine someone not admitting that those choruses are fuuuucking catchy. and it's only better from there: burn my eyes deserves a grammy.


Pretty sure Supercharger almost ended the band.


For me Supercharger is way worse than The Burning Red. It's a huge pile of shit really while, as I said before, I can find redeeming qualities in The Burning Red.

Top
 Profile  
Desperta_Ferro
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 6:45 am
Posts: 602
Location: Argentina
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 6:51 pm 
 

Turner wrote:
Desperta_Ferro wrote:
oh, and the Fear Factory cover Epica made, "Replica" - But I don't like the original version, the vocals are a dealbreaker for me (and that's the big reason why I don't like nu-metal)


wwwwooooaaaaaahhh there buddy!! demanufacture is a LONG way from nu-metal. i even invented my own genre for it!!! metal noir. think about it: their first two albums are industrial death metal ala pitchshifter/godflesh but with actual musical ability, combined with the aesthetics of movies like terminator and blade runner. it's heavy, it's mechanical, it's dark shades of blue and grey!

in all seriousness though, FF cop a bit of flack for later ties to it, but you should in no way associate their first two albums with nu-metal.


hahaha sorry about that
the thing is I'm ignorant about the genre, I listen to anything modern and I think "nu metal", that and the fact it was released in the 95
but now that I have given a few listens to it, yeah, it sounds industrial-ish rather than korn-ish

Top
 Profile  
Exigence
Age: 28 (Wait, what?!)

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:42 pm
Posts: 793
Location: New Orleans
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 7:37 pm 
 

All the choruses from Finger Eleven's "The Greyest of Blue Skies" are still stuck in my head to this day. I think that came out in 2001.

Top
 Profile  
schizoid
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2004 8:35 am
Posts: 530
Location: New Zealand
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:39 am 
 

Oxenkiller wrote:


Mastodon is okay too, but I'm not sure if you would consider them "nu" metal or not- some people do, I'm kinda on the fence about lumping them in with that other "music."


I've never heard anyone call Mastodon Nu metal, until now. Nice one, dick.

Top
 Profile  
Manic Maniac
Grammaritically Challengated

Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 1:58 pm
Posts: 180
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 12:06 pm 
 

Gee, I didn't think their would be so many people here who don't even know what Nu Metal is. Mastodon? Really? Mastodon was Progressive Sludge Metal earlier & are Progressive Doom Metal now. So what is Nu Meta then, you my ask? Nu Metal is a combonation of Groove Metal, Industrial Rock, Rap Rock, & Grunge. Korn is usually considered the first Nu Metal band. Some bands may make more promenant elements of Rap or Industrial than others would. Some bands additionally may add elements of Death Metal, Thrash Metal, Funk, Reggae, Proggressive Rock, Post-Grunge or any form of Punk/Hardcore.
_________________
I'm almost as much as a sucker for Heavy Metal with anime as much as I'm a sucker for speeding Kenworths set on fire.

Top
 Profile  
Metantoine
The XVI, dominar to over 258714 subjects

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
Posts: 8648
Location: Québec
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 12:15 pm 
 

Mastodon aren't prog doom either though :-P It's the first time I see someone use this (inaccurate) tag to describe them so there's a first for everything!
_________________
Metantoine's Magickal Realm - Wings of Metal 2014 review, Horrendous - Ecdysis
Last.fm
Halberd (doom/death)

Top
 Profile  
doomster999
Keeper of the Dreary Realm

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:58 am
Posts: 650
Location: India
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 12:44 pm 
 

Mastodon were sludge with prog metal leanings and since "Crack the Skye" they're prog metal with stoner rock leanings. As simple as that. As far as nu-metal is concerned I dig Deftones to this day. But personally I never considered them to be a part of the nu-metal movement. I think they are wrongfully labelled as nu-metal by the media.
_________________
gomorro wrote:
Infact I use to have a relly hot friend from there but unfurtunetly the last party we have I was really wasted and grab her ass and it cause a huge problem. Her dad (that is a marine) wants to ripp my nuts... thinks are not the same...

Last.fm

Top
 Profile  
DarkWolfXV
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:08 pm
Posts: 200
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 3:25 pm 
 

I enjoy System of a Down, early Korn, and first two Slipknot albums. The last one has lots of death metal-ish moments and are overall heavy and catchy as fuck, and that is what matters for me. I still dont know what exactly the kinda pointless two percussionists, DJ and keyboardist do in the music aside from the obvious few barrel strikes, turntable scratches, various samples and whatnot here and there (could be done just by samples), but it's fun to listen to (If someone could tell me some less-obvious examples of what actually do they do in the music I would be grateful.)
_________________
https://lichmistress.bandcamp.com/

Top
 Profile  
Marag
Veteran

Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 8:55 pm
Posts: 2660
Location: down there where chaos prevails
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 4:05 pm 
 

My arse Mastodon are sludge, they are more groove than anything, hence why they suck so much.

Top
 Profile  
Subrick
Metal freak

Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2010 7:27 pm
Posts: 5800
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 4:53 pm 
 

Groove =/= automatically terrible. I don't know where that idea popped up, but it's just plain wrong.
_________________
YouTube
Facebook
Sorrowseed Melodic Extreme Metal
Blacksoul Seraphim Doomgaze
Thy Ancient Crypt Blackened Death Metal

Top
 Profile  
InnesI
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:19 pm
Posts: 220
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:42 pm 
 

Marag wrote:
My arse Mastodon are sludge, they are more groove than anything, hence why they suck so much.


I think there has been a fair share of sludge in the sound of Mastodon throughout the early years. With that being said I would never have classified them as a sludge band.

Me too doesn't understand the "groove = bad" analogy. To dismiss something because it is groove on that very premise is just dumb.

Top
 Profile  
lord_ghengis
Metal freak

Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2006 8:31 pm
Posts: 5372
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:46 pm 
 

Well if you dislike the groove genre it makes sense, if you dislike a genre in general, its probably safe to assume you wouldn't like a band in the genre.
_________________
Naamath wrote:
No comments, no words need it, no BM, no compromise, only grains in her face.

Top
 Profile  
ModusOperandi
Metalhead

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 12:52 am
Posts: 609
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 6:26 pm 
 

Mastodon has fuck all to do with nu-metal or post-grunge or whatever catch-all umbrella term someone wants to use to group mainstream radio rock bands together. It really is just that simple sometimes. Someone doesn't like them? Right on. Good for them. To lump them in with every other shithouse modern rock band, however, fully aware there's little to no commonalities between them just because is fallacious and intellectually dishonest.
_________________
blackcandle wrote:
GOOD MORNING.

AT FIRST, I'M NOT AN IDIOT, MORE RESPECT.

Top
 Profile  
Marag
Veteran

Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 8:55 pm
Posts: 2660
Location: down there where chaos prevails
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 6:33 pm 
 

I always considered Mastodon to be "beardo metal", which would be those progressive pseudo sludge/groove stoner rock american bands that likely have their cover art done by John Baizley

Top
 Profile  
MutantClannfear
Metalhead

Joined: Thu May 27, 2010 12:12 am
Posts: 2225
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 6:41 pm 
 

InnesI wrote:
Me too doesn't understand the "groove = bad" analogy. To dismiss something because it is groove on that very premise is just dumb.

It's because there are way too many slow groove metal bands and they all sound the exact same. Bands that just play "Walk" ripoffs and chuggy breakdowns with bendy notes tend to suck, and horribly. There need to be more fast and momentous groove metal bands, e.g. DevilDriver and Wrath-era Lamb of God - when those bands bring speed into the mix they can actually sound pretty downright menacing as opposed to just horribly banal.

Top
 Profile  
CF_Mono
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2010 5:21 pm
Posts: 1404
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 8:42 pm 
 

Groove metal is just another term for people who wanted to start a thrash band but couldn't write/play any good riffs. That's why the songs sound totally groovy all the time and not technical. I also think that's why there are a lot of legitimately metal bands that play groove metal, because they are often inspired by real metal bands, they just play very primitive riffs. I wouldn't call Mastodon Groove Metal, or radio rock, or Nu-Metal, I just think people don't like them because they don't really fit in either of those "technical" or "simple" labels, they have a lot of material from both. Some people just feel like they're meandering on a lot because they're not totally riff-based but not totally structure-based either.
_________________
Doom or be doomed...
My current band. Wretched doom trio from NY.

Top
 Profile  
Turner
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 2:04 am
Posts: 1134
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 11:11 pm 
 

CF_Mono wrote:
Groove metal is just another term for people who wanted to start a thrash band but couldn't write/play any good riffs. That's why the songs sound totally groovy all the time and not technical. I also think that's why there are a lot of legitimately metal bands that play groove metal, because they are often inspired by real metal bands, they just play very primitive riffs.


brilliant. all this time, here i was thinking groove metal was its own legitimate genre with hallmark conventions, tropes and the like... when in reality it's just failed thrash!! of course!!! never mind that it began appearing just as thrash died out. never mind that most of the biggest groove metal albums came from thrash bands looking to distance themselves from their previous sound. never mind that there are some seriously well-written albums in the genre. never mind any of that; it's all failed thrash and that makes it worthless by definition, because everyone on the fucking planet evaluates music by your own personal true metal standard.

Top
 Profile  
TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 614
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 11:15 pm 
 

I'm not as passionate about the matter, but Turner's post is pretty much the thoughts I've been having for a longer while.
_________________
Poisonfume wrote:
I marvel at the clusterfuck of confusion we have constructed.

Top
 Profile  
Turner
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 2:04 am
Posts: 1134
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 11:24 pm 
 

haha well yeah, i guess that post is a little worked up. but groove metal gets a seriously bad rap and soooo much of it either comes from the association with nu-metal, or the above idea that it's just failed thrash (or both). and neither of those is a legitimate standpoint from which to be criticising the genre.

Top
 Profile  
iamntbatman
Chaos Breed

Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 5:55 am
Posts: 7504
Location: Innsmouth
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 11:39 pm 
 

To me, groove metal sucks because it's just a really shitty misnomer. I love groove in metal; some of my favorite bands are those that excel at having a really good sense of groove, whether it be bands like Sleep, Melechesh, Bolt Thrower or Inquisition. Apart from a couple of other facets I find distasteful, my beef with groove metal is that it, well, isn't groovy. Just listen to "Walk"; the guitar there sounds so mechanical and processed and so decidedly UNgroovy that it just plain bugs me.
_________________
Lippyass Major wrote:
Getting a band inked into your skin permanently is always a sign of dedication and intelligence, and I have a lot of respect for the people who do it.


COMA VOID | GLOAMING | FAUSTIAN ORBS

Top
 Profile  
Marag
Veteran

Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 8:55 pm
Posts: 2660
Location: down there where chaos prevails
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 11:47 pm 
 

Agreed. I love me some grooves, but for a genre that supposedly focus on that, groove metal really gets on my nerves.

Top
 Profile  
Manic Maniac
Grammaritically Challengated

Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 1:58 pm
Posts: 180
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 12:18 am 
 

This thread is starting to get of topic, but I might as well go with the flow. So Groove Metal is bad because it's a slow & easy genre anyone can do? Isn't Doom Metal even slower & easier? If so, than why don't I ever hear anyone complaining about that genre? I'm hearing Solitude Aeturnus "Blessed Be The Dead" right now, & it sounds like a cakewalk compared to anything that came from Lamb Of God. I'm not saying you should redirect your loathing of Groove Metal to Doom Metal, I'm just saying if you hate this one genre for these reasons have nothing against the other, then it just sounds like (Insert vulgar word here) & I find it a biased opinion. But maybe I'm getting ahead of myself, I don't know your opinion of Doom Metal, & for all I know, you may very well despise the genre even more than you hate Groove Metal.
I forgot who it was I intended this paragraph to be targeted at.
_________________
I'm almost as much as a sucker for Heavy Metal with anime as much as I'm a sucker for speeding Kenworths set on fire.

Top
 Profile  
Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
Posts: 18847
Location: Where the dead rule the night
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 12:36 am 
 

Nu metal sucks.

I love some groove in my metal, whether it be Sabbath or recent Symphony X, and it doesn't always mean simplified and less intelligent - as the aforementioned bands prove. But then again thinking anything technical is good is pretty much 14-year old thinking.

Quote:
Isn't Doom Metal even slower & easier? If so, than why don't I ever hear anyone complaining about that genre? I'm hearing Solitude Aeturnus "Blessed Be The Dead" right now, & it sounds like a cakewalk compared to anything that came from Lamb Of God.


What about tension and build in the songwriting? A good atmosphere? This kind of thinking is just so simple about it all.
_________________
Cinema Freaks latest reviews: From Dusk Till Dawn 2: Texas Blood Money

Top
 Profile  
Dudemanguy
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 7:19 pm
Posts: 723
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 12:55 am 
 

Nu metal is terrible for the most part. The only two "nu metal" bands I like would be Maximum the Hormone and Dir en Grey and neither really count as fully nu metal to begin with. There's just bits and pieces of the sound in it.

Top
 Profile  
Manic Maniac
Grammaritically Challengated

Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 1:58 pm
Posts: 180
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:34 am 
 

It doesn't take much to give something atmosphere. Take a black & white photo it would look "moody." It wouldn't take much to improvise a doom riff that sounded forboding than it would to improvise a Groove riff that didn't have any atmosphere whatsoever. I can't even think of a doom riff that doesn't have that haunting "impeding doom" sensation outside of Stoner Doom. That's why it's called Doom Metal. & I've heard plenty of well known Groove Metal songs that have clever builds & atmosphere.
_________________
I'm almost as much as a sucker for Heavy Metal with anime as much as I'm a sucker for speeding Kenworths set on fire.

Top
 Profile  
doomster999
Keeper of the Dreary Realm

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:58 am
Posts: 650
Location: India
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:17 am 
 

Marag wrote:
My arse Mastodon are sludge, they are more groove than anything, hence why they suck so much.


Sludge, doom, grunge whatever you call it the foundation lies on groove based Sabbathian riffs. Groove is more like an umbrella term.
_________________
gomorro wrote:
Infact I use to have a relly hot friend from there but unfurtunetly the last party we have I was really wasted and grab her ass and it cause a huge problem. Her dad (that is a marine) wants to ripp my nuts... thinks are not the same...

Last.fm

Top
 Profile  
Necessitarian
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:20 am
Posts: 147
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:39 am 
 

I don't hate it. I definitely enjoyed a few Slipknot tunes when I was first getting into metal(ish music). Just rechecked a couple of songs of theirs from YT the other day that I remember liking, and it doesn't come as a surprise to me that someone could enjoy this stuff. If you want just straightforward anger and aggression, this stuff works better than pretty much any proper metal, I'd say. I don't find it interesting, but neither does it make my blood boil like it seems to do to some people (in a bad way). I wouldn't want to be one of those people who are capable of getting so worked up about it that they somehow actively hate it, and think it's some kind of a crime against the universe that it even exists, though I'm not sure such people even actually exist, might just all be another case of hyperbole on the internet, and even the hyperbole seems to have died down recently.

Top
 Profile  
Gatherum
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 12:14 am
Posts: 339
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 5:32 am 
 

Fairly recently, I rejected the idea that Dir En Grey's latest album is nu metal. I claimed instead that it was a strange combination of experimental/progressive death/doom--and I still believe that it has all of those elements to a certain degree. But, after reading all of the responses I had in that discussion, and listening to it again, I came to remember what nu metal was like when I used to listen to it, and perhaps begrudgingly, I had to admit that Dum Spiro Spero does fit the bill. But god dammit, there's something about it that makes it far superior to anything else that could be considered nu metal in recent years, and perhaps ever. Maybe it's the general macabre feel it has to it. Maybe it's because, like the band or not, Kyo is definitely one of the most versatile vocalists in music, period. Maybe it's because of the aforementioned progressive/experimental death/doom influences/atmosphere that somehow allows for the retention of that J-rock sensibility (which I, as an otaku, find to be rather appealing when done right).

Truthfully, Dum Spiro Spero is the only album of theirs I ever truly got in to, and it was something I decided to give a chance to only this year. No otaku gets into the whole anime fandom without hearing them or hearing about them at least once. Thing is, the albums from their mid period always sounded like respectably strange, but awkward metalcore renditions. I hear they started shifting from that a bit with Uroboros. I gave that a listen at work, but I was too distracted to really pay much attention. I might have to look again.

Apart from that, I am something of an In this Moment fan, and do I have Blood in my library, but it is definitely my least favourite by them, partly because of the nu metal elements, and partly because Maria Brink really started to embrace that "bad girl" aesthetic bullshit. She's at the top of her form when she is accompanying her screams with singing, not angsty shouting. The band tends to jump around between styles every album, so I'm really hoping that this will not become a consistent thing for them.

I have long forgotten who my actual gateway into metal was, but I do remember that I did like Disturbed, Korn, Limp Bizkit, Linkin Park, Mudvayne, Slipknot, and System of a Down, to name a few nu metal bands, or bands who were considered nu metal at some point. It wasn't until quite a bit later when a friend introduced me to the Deftones, but you could say that I was solely fixated on their famous atmospheric number, "Change (In the House of Flies)", which is really not a nu metal song. It wasn't until last year that I finally paid enough attention to listen to a whole album by them, that being Koi No Yokan, and by that time, their nu metal influence was all but gone (in fact, it was argued that it had been gone by White Pony, the album that "Change" appears on). Ironically, they are the only act out of those eight that I have in my library, as of now, mostly because they're one of the few mainstream alternative rock/metal acts that are doing something interesting with their genre. I find the roomy qualities of their recent material to be comparable to a less sombre Night Is the New Day-era Katatonia--while certainly inferior to Katatonia's mastery over intelligent emotional manipulation, I don't consider it to be a disrespectful comparison by any means.

I appreciated Limp Bizkit during a time when I appreciated hip hop a bit more, but I grew out of it, and thus did I grow out of Limp Bizkit--though the pretentiousness of that band also had a lot to do with why I never looked back. Fred Durst is just...ugh. I'm honestly not even sure Korn could be counted as a band that I liked because the only song I ever enjoyed by them was "Twisted Transistor", which is rather catchy. I was entirely disinterested in everything else.

Linkin Park and Slipknot lasted a bit longer. You could say that, while their material is no longer interesting enough to me musically, I hold some respect for the former because, in spite of all the emo shit that plagued their lyrical content in their earlier years, they did, at least, seem to meld their various influences together without coming across as... I dunno... like they were doing it just to be edgy or something. It's hard to explain. It didn't feel as angsty and unnecessarily angry as the output of their contemporaries. To this day, I appreciate A Thousand Suns for having some pronounced industrial rock influence, and for being politically themed and less bleed-your-heart-out emotional. Living Things, though... yeah, not doing it for me. They went electronic rock, and it feels very watered down and restrained, and not in a good way.

Slipknot was good to me because they were the angriest act in the whole scene that I knew of. I was a growing teenager once, and like an angry growing teenager, I was sometimes drawn to angry growing teenager music. Slipknot's not terrible, though. They at least feel a little bit like a metal act, and Taylor's "rapping" never really bothered me because it never felt like rapping--just rapid screaming and yelling. It suited the music well enough. But yeah, I lost interest after they released All Hope Is Gone and "Psychosocial" was being hailed as the "best song evar" by their fans. At the time, I didn't think it was bad, just not nearly as remarkable as it was cracked up to be. By that time, though, Agalloch had already been my favourite for almost two years, and I was well into black, death, doom, &c. in general; maybe that's what happened. The same could probably be said of Mudvayne.

System of a Down... I guess I just grew out of them. They never really felt like much of a nu metal act to me, and it's not like I find much in particular to fault about their music, save maybe the vocals, which were always strange. Disturbed is a similar story, though I paid attention to them far less than SOAD.

I don't see nu metal as the poison that most would make it out to be, much less groove metal (I do rather like the more experimental djent acts), but I've definitely moved on quite a bit. Somewhat, I feel that it just doesn't stand on its own anymore (if it ever did in the first place). It needs to borrow moods and influences from "better" genres to be interesting, hence Dir En Grey.
_________________
ThePoop wrote:
(snip)

I believe it was Confucius who said "Life is merely a series of intervals in which one waits for the next Agalloch album."


Last edited by Gatherum on Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Top
 Profile  
somefella
Veteran

Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:57 pm
Posts: 2530
Location: Singapore
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:07 am 
 

Turner wrote:
you know, for all his bandwagon-jumping, i have to respect robb flynn for being so damn versatile. he's covered 3-4 genres/sub-genres now and been at the top of the heap in all of them. and you can go straight to his arguably worst album, the burning red, to hear what i mean - whether you like the style or not, i find it hard to imagine someone not admitting that those choruses are fuuuucking catchy. and it's only better from there: burn my eyes deserves a grammy.

also, i met him when i was 16 or so. they were in australia with slayer in 2000, and he was doing a TV interview. i called out to him, he stopped mid-interview, came over and had a short chat (really, genuinely enthusiastic), then went back to the interview. kinda sold me on the guy



Agreed. Both Burn My Eyes and Locust are fucking fantastic albums. The former is a straight up classic for me and yes I prefer to to Vio-lence.

I think thrash fans tend to bash anything that grooves, to their own detriment. Some of the best death metal grooves without end.
_________________
http://hpgd.bandcamp.com/album/the-grea ... of-nothing
OSHIEGO (SGP), death/thrash.

Top
 Profile  
Space_alligator
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 3:43 am
Posts: 49
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:24 am 
 

I still enjoy some Korn, even the Follow the leader album. Even Slipknot are good for some listening every now and then, particularly all hope is gone...

Top
 Profile  
Abominatrix
Harbinger of Metal

Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 12:15 pm
Posts: 10179
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 11:30 am 
 

iamntbatman wrote:
To me, groove metal sucks because it's just a really shitty misnomer. I love groove in metal; some of my favorite bands are those that excel at having a really good sense of groove, whether it be bands like Sleep, Melechesh, Bolt Thrower or Inquisition. Apart from a couple of other facets I find distasteful, my beef with groove metal is that it, well, isn't groovy. Just listen to "Walk"; the guitar there sounds so mechanical and processed and so decidedly UNgroovy that it just plain bugs me.



Yeah, exactly. Nothing at all wrong with groove. Groove happens when you play beats "in between the beats", if that makes sense. You should know it when you hear it, anyway, if you can't explain it, and Pantera really has little groove when compared to a band like, oh, let's say, Budgie.

About nu metal I have nothing good to say. I did buy the first Korn album in 1995 or so. Not much of interest happening there. I do think the talent of the individual bandmembers may be somewhat underrepresented, yet as a whole the music is shallow and screams "TEEN ANGST!" far too loudly. Those are also some of the worst lyrics I've ever come across from a "pro" group of musicians.
_________________
Hush! and hark
To the sorrowful cry
Of the wind in the dark.
Hush and hark, without murmur or sigh,
To shoon that tread the lost aeons:
To the sound that bids you to die.

Top
 Profile  
Desperta_Ferro
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 6:45 am
Posts: 602
Location: Argentina
PostPosted: Thu Sep 05, 2013 12:06 pm 
 

I remember Deicide's Legion, and my favourite thing about it is that grooves, and hard. It's mindless chugging a la Walk that people tend to dislike. Groove isn't bad.

Twisted Transistors is a great song. The video is hilarious.

Top
 Profile  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies. Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: MutantClannfear and 10 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

Back to the Encyclopaedia Metallum


Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group