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savagevelocithrash
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:48 pm
Posts: 84
Location: Chile
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:24 pm 
 

Listening to the In Solitude's cover of "Mother Of Mercy" (Samhain) i throught if older Heavy Metal bands were influenced by more dark sounding bands such as Samhain, Joy Division, Bauhaus, The Cure, Christian Death, etc.

I know that Celtic Frost took a lot of that in their immortal "To Mega Therion" (just listen to the female vocals and the dark atmosphere, my favorite Frost release btw). Also a lot of influence on some Doom/Death Metal and the so-called "Gothic Metal" (i don't feel any real conection with old Goth Rock to this kind of bands).

So, do you know any older Heavy Metal or Speed Metal with post-punk/goth influence?.

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Morrigan
Crone of War

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 7:27 am
Posts: 9375
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:54 pm 
 

Moving this to Rec central.

Type O Negative, Paradise Lost, Tiamat and Moonspell are probably the most famous examples. But less well known are In the Colonnades (s/t album), and Stillborn (Necrospirituals).

This stuff is the true goth metal. Not Within Temptation, geez. Fuck off nowadays' goth metal. :nods:
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Markeri, in 2013 wrote:
you can debate the actual date that metal began, but a fairly agreed upon date is 1969. Metal is almost 25 years old
Extreme_violence wrote:
Why Iron maiden is there? It's very far to be metal than a lot of some metal band.

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Morrigan
Crone of War

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 7:27 am
Posts: 9375
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:59 pm 
 

Obligatory:






:)
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Markeri, in 2013 wrote:
you can debate the actual date that metal began, but a fairly agreed upon date is 1969. Metal is almost 25 years old
Extreme_violence wrote:
Why Iron maiden is there? It's very far to be metal than a lot of some metal band.

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Germaniac
Metal newbie

Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2008 4:16 pm
Posts: 249
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:03 pm 
 

savagevelocithrash wrote:
I know that Celtic Frost took a lot of that in their immortal "To Mega Therion" (just listen to the female vocals and the dark atmosphere, my favorite Frost release btw).


Into The Pandemonium is even more obvious example, the vocals especially are certainly inspired by Christian Death.
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savagevelocithrash
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:48 pm
Posts: 84
Location: Chile
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:07 pm 
 

I know all the 90's stuff... my question was more about 80's Heavy Metal and their derivates.

Type O Negative is sick stuff. Also i like a lot Paradise Lost "Gothic".


Last edited by savagevelocithrash on Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Morrigan
Crone of War

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 7:27 am
Posts: 9375
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:08 pm 
 

Speaking of which, if anyone has more recommendations in the style of early Moonspell, Stillborn (Necrospirituals) and In the Colonnades's s/t, I'd be interested too. Not a lot of bands mix goth and metal the way they do, they usually go for the Paradise Lost style... (or worse, the "look we have a female vocalist we're goth metal" nonsense).
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Markeri, in 2013 wrote:
you can debate the actual date that metal began, but a fairly agreed upon date is 1969. Metal is almost 25 years old
Extreme_violence wrote:
Why Iron maiden is there? It's very far to be metal than a lot of some metal band.

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Morrigan
Crone of War

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 7:27 am
Posts: 9375
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:09 pm 
 

savagevelocithrash wrote:
I know all the 90's stuff... my question was more about 80's Heavy Metal and their derivated.
Try Necrospirituals (1989) and In the Colonnades s/t (1987), then.
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Markeri, in 2013 wrote:
you can debate the actual date that metal began, but a fairly agreed upon date is 1969. Metal is almost 25 years old
Extreme_violence wrote:
Why Iron maiden is there? It's very far to be metal than a lot of some metal band.

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savagevelocithrash
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:48 pm
Posts: 84
Location: Chile
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:10 pm 
 

Morrigan wrote:
savagevelocithrash wrote:
I know all the 90's stuff... my question was more about 80's Heavy Metal and their derivated.
Try Necrospirituals (1989) and In the Colonnades s/t (1987), then.



Thanks...look like very interesting stuff.

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metaldiscussor666
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:09 pm
Posts: 560
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:12 pm 
 

The few bands I know that fit this description are cultus sanguine; a gothic influenced band (according to MA), and skagos--a post rock influenced band (probably one of my most favorite bands of all time). There are a few other notable post rock influenced bands, and I'm sure there's more that I'm not familiar with. I'm not all too familiar with agalloch, except I didn't care for "the rack". They're post rock influenced though. The genre of post rock influenced has never really been something I actually focused on, so this is the best information I can give you. Last fm some similar artists if you feel so inclined. I'm also not quite sure what the origins of gothic are. It's a word I see tossed around here and there. Maybe worth getting into, except I was never a fan of type O negative.
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Last edited by metaldiscussor666 on Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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savagevelocithrash
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:48 pm
Posts: 84
Location: Chile
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:15 pm 
 

I know a swiss band called Ghost Kommando that is bassically Joy Division + Raw Black Metal. some of the songs that i hear are really good.

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colin040
Metal freak

Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2007 6:00 pm
Posts: 4501
Location: Netherlands
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:55 pm 
 

Paradise Lost is the one that I thought of right away when I saw this thread.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCq5Ldy5zEc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfMHS7W9GvY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQYiJQZPJPs

And what about Sentenced's Down album? It's been years since I've heard it but I remember it rocking out rather well.

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androdion
Metal freak

Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:34 am
Posts: 4558
Location: Portugal
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 4:53 pm 
 

Morrigan wrote:
Speaking of which, if anyone has more recommendations in the style of early Moonspell, Stillborn (Necrospirituals) and In the Colonnades's s/t, I'd be interested too. Not a lot of bands mix goth and metal the way they do, they usually go for the Paradise Lost style... (or worse, the "look we have a female vocalist we're goth metal" nonsense).

Have you heard Heavenwood? Diva is one massive album but the rest of the discography is hit and miss really.
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Metantoine
The XVI, dominar to over 258714 subjects

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
Posts: 8459
Location: Qu├ębec
PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 5:01 pm 
 

metaldiscussor666 wrote:
The few bands I know that fit this description are cultus sanguine; a gothic influenced band (according to MA), and skagos--a post rock influenced band (probably one of my most favorite bands of all time). There are a few other notable post rock influenced bands, and I'm sure there's more that I'm not familiar with. I'm not all too familiar with agalloch, except I didn't care for "the rack". They're post rock influenced though. The genre of post rock influenced has never really been something I actually focused on, so this is the best information I can give you. Last fm some similar artists if you feel so inclined. I'm also not quite sure what the origins of gothic are. It's a word I see tossed around here and there. Maybe worth getting into, except I was never a fan of type O negative.

He asked for heavy or speed metal with goth or post punk influences, not post rock/black metal like Skagos or Agalloch. Read the OP before posting, please. Not familiar with Cultus Sanguine, but they don't really fit what he's asking based on their MA genre.
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Morrigan
Crone of War

Joined: Sat Aug 10, 2002 7:27 am
Posts: 9375
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 12:58 am 
 

Yeah, post-rock and post-punk are nothing alike (beyond having the word "post" in them :rolleyes:).

Gonna check out Heavenwood, thanks andro.
_________________
Markeri, in 2013 wrote:
you can debate the actual date that metal began, but a fairly agreed upon date is 1969. Metal is almost 25 years old
Extreme_violence wrote:
Why Iron maiden is there? It's very far to be metal than a lot of some metal band.

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vengefulgoat
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2011 9:15 am
Posts: 977
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:21 am 
 

Equinox ov the Gods

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Einzige
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:04 am
Posts: 54
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:24 pm 
 

I've always felt that Flowing Tears, at least their older material recorded with Stephanie Duchenne, had a much stronger claim to the 'goth(ic) metal' label than a lot of other female-fronted operatic bands. Check this out:



It has 'jangly' guitars like a lot of older 80s goth acts did, and the focus in the vocals is on huskiness rather than falsettos. It almost comes across as a blend of the Banshees and My Bloody Valentine.

As far as heavier post-punk inspired metal goes (or maybe it's metal-inspired post-punk), you want Swans:



Big Black is another post-punk band that I feel most metalheads would appreciate if they listened to them. Don't let the fact that Steve Albini produced In Utero bother you.


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Doomsday
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2003 12:30 pm
Posts: 715
Location: Sweden
PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:50 am 
 

Austrian band Jack Frost should interest fans of Stillborn, Type O Negative and stuff like that. Been a while since I listened to their entire discography but I remember the earliest albums being weaker overall. The 3rd or 4th full-length might be a better place to start.
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suleiman
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:51 am
Posts: 422
Location: Pakistan
PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:07 am 
 

Definitely try out Fields of the Nephilim. They were always borderline metal even back in the 80's. The guitars parts on the early records make Sister of Mercy etc sound like kids.

The Nefilim side project (Album : Zoon) is full on metal with a very gothic feel.

And the two later albums are definitely a gothic/metal hybrid. They have a mutitude of related projects (Rubicon, NFD, Saints of Eden etc) some of which may or may not be to your liking.

Also for dark post-punk with metal overtones, you should check out the different eras of Killing Joke. The post 90's albums have definitte metal influences. But the early 80's stuff has a strange tribal primal energy that is eesential.

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Twin_guitar_attack
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 4:27 am
Posts: 1382
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 7:15 am 
 

Morrigan wrote:
Moving this to Rec central.

Type O Negative, Paradise Lost, Tiamat and Moonspell are probably the most famous examples. But less well known are In the Colonnades (s/t album), and Stillborn (Necrospirituals).

This stuff is the true goth metal. Not Within Temptation, geez. Fuck off nowadays' goth metal. :nods:


Within Temptation themselves don't claim to be gothic metal, the people who call them that are just idiots (though the first album possibly)
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Turner
Metalhead

Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2002 2:04 am
Posts: 1053
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:54 pm 
 

The Sisters of Mercy Vision Thing album probably counts, at least the title track does.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0NV_0aLmiA

Sentenced's post-North From Here stuff is also worth a listen, although opinions on it are always divisive:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j55oEnYKhVM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgErYLDKLVE
(they switched singers after their 1st & 3rd albums; the first song is with the second singer, the second song is with the last.)

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