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Illuminati322
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:55 pm
Posts: 301
Location: Grand Chute, WI, USA
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 3:50 am 
 

It occurred to me that the bashing of mall-core kids and musical poseurs so endemic to the metal subculture is a waste of time. The existence of commercial offshoots, be they nu metal, groove metal, or metal-core, does not harm the genre in any way. Here's why:

1) They don't divert commercial attention and success from true metal, which does not desire and will never accomplish those goals in the first place. Part of the character of metal is that it's an insular, underground community isolated from the social mainstream.

2) No on is forcing metal fans to patronize it. If ones dislikes the latest Hot Topic promoted flavor of the week, he need not listen to it, wear its t-shirts, or attend its shows. His favorite bands in the underground will still exist, and thrive in their respective cultural grotto.

3) So mall-core kids embrace the "metal" label while living in total ignorance of the genre and its history.... who cares? They're kids, and as such this is just another passing trend for them. If they mature and get into metal legit, fine. If they don't it's no great loss. Either way it has no effect on metal proper.

What are other user's thoughts? I think this could be an interesting discussion.

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gabber
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 11:57 pm
Posts: 330
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 3:56 am 
 

You know what I say?

Let everyone like what they want.
As long as no one is being hurt or affected, who really gives a fuck? If people learnt not to interfere in one another's lives and opinions, we would be rid of crime and war.
It would be a better world.
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Exigence
Age: 29 (Wait, what?!)

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 2:42 pm
Posts: 951
Location: New Orleans
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 4:05 am 
 

The problem is...for every kid that grows out of that stupid metal attitude posturing, there's another 15 yr old right behind him discovering it for the first time.

Everybody wants to have an 'enemy' so bad.

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Roxyben
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2011 7:04 am
Posts: 715
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 4:16 am 
 

I dont really think about it that much to be honest. What anybody else is listening to is of no concern to me. Why should it effect me? It doesn't. If other people are concerned about posers that's their problem.
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Illuminati322
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:55 pm
Posts: 301
Location: Grand Chute, WI, USA
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 4:19 am 
 

Exigence wrote:
The problem is...for every kid that grows out of that stupid metal attitude posturing, there's another 15 yr old right behind him discovering it for the first time.

Everybody wants to have an 'enemy' so bad.


I've noticed that. Human beings are inherently tribal, and each tribe has its own characteristics: a shared vocabulary, icons and symbols, reference points, etc. One thing that bonds individuals is, as you stated, a shared enemy, and that contributes heavily to this. You also have to remember that liking and disliking something is essentially the same emotion, distinguished only by the tone of one's voice.

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baron samedi
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 11:26 pm
Posts: 56
Location: Kyoto, Japan
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 4:19 am 
 

"poser" is a word I last used when in high school. I feel that the majority of people concerned with who is and isnt a poser are either high school students, or have a high school student mentality.

In the real world it doesn't matter what kind of music you like, and if you only surround yourself with people who have common interests you likely wont make as many friends or have as many experiences as you could. And frankly I'd probably rather hang out with a mallcore poser than some neckbeard power metal fan. I meet so few people that even like ANY type of music that could be construed as metal that I feel a sort of bond with even those who are fans of bands that I think are total shit.

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Illuminati322
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:55 pm
Posts: 301
Location: Grand Chute, WI, USA
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 4:38 am 
 

baron samedi wrote:
"poser" is a word I last used when in high school. I feel that the majority of people concerned with who is and isnt a poser are either high school students, or have a high school student mentality.

In the real world it doesn't matter what kind of music you like, and if you only surround yourself with people who have common interests you likely wont make as many friends or have as many experiences as you could. And frankly I'd probably rather hang out with a mallcore poser than some neckbeard power metal fan. I meet so few people that even like ANY type of music that could be construed as metal that I feel a sort of bond with even those who are fans of bands that I think are total shit.



Yes, I've noticed that as well. It seems that wearing a label as your personal identity and building your parameters around it (i.e. who's one of us, who's not) is largely an adolescent trait. I have, however, noticed it in a number of adults, and not just in this and other musical subcultures. Sports fans often tend to be mired in a similar psychology.

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Napero
GedankenPanzer

Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 4:16 pm
Posts: 8558
Location: Finland
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 4:43 am 
 

Illuminati322 wrote:
1) They don't divert commercial attention and success from true metal, which does not desire and will never accomplish those goals in the first place. Part of the character of metal is that it's an insular, underground community isolated from the social mainstream.

You're connecting your own imaginary ideas about some vague "true metal" with the real world, and making very far-reaching assumptions based on some fantasy. The above is an example of a dreamscape, and sooner or later leads to ideas such as "metal brotherhood" and comparing butt-ugly Manowar tattoos while drinking beer with metal bros and being metal in public, i.e. being annoying poser twats.

At least in my own life the real world and the metal part of my interests coexist and even overlap just nicely, thank you.

Metal is NOT underground, with a few niche subgenres as exceptions. It's a bit difficult to be out in the open if you play in an NSBM band, that is. Otherwise, I have news for you: reality called, and wants to have a chat with you.

gabber wrote:
If people learnt not to interfere in one another's lives and opinions, we would be rid of crime and war. It would be a better world.

We just reached the board's new record: from a delusional OP to all-embracing hippie ideology in a single post.
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Veracs
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:56 pm
Posts: 1893
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 4:45 am 
 

I think bashing is endemic to any clustered and highly subterranean subculture such as metal. If its not "posers", "mallcore kids", or "hipsters", metalheads well-rounded in knowledge of the music will routinely bash other metalheads with similar knowledge of the music for liking a controversial band. Its common here especially as on other forums from what I've seen, though it could be for different reasons elsewhere.
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gabber
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 11:57 pm
Posts: 330
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 4:49 am 
 

Quote:
We just reached the board's new record: from a delusional OP to all-embracing hippie ideology in a single post.


That is the most perfect description ever haha
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Illuminati322
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:55 pm
Posts: 301
Location: Grand Chute, WI, USA
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 5:15 am 
 

Napero wrote:
Illuminati322 wrote:
1) They don't divert commercial attention and success from true metal, which does not desire and will never accomplish those goals in the first place. Part of the character of metal is that it's an insular, underground community isolated from the social mainstream.

You're connecting your own imaginary ideas about some vague "true metal" with the real world, and making very far-reaching assumptions based on some fantasy. The above is an example of a dreamscape, and sooner or later leads to ideas such as "metal brotherhood" and comparing butt-ugly Manowar tattoos while drinking beer with metal bros and being metal in public, i.e. being annoying poser twats.

At least in my own life the real world and the metal part of my interests coexist and even overlap just nicely, thank you.

Au contraire, as the division of metal into "true" and "false", if that's what you're referring to, is not at all my own imaginary idea. Ever since my initial entry into this subculture, the majority of metal fans I've known have divided the genre into these categories, with "true" denoting death, black, thrash, power etc. and "false" referring to nu metal, metalcore, etc. Metal forums all around the internet house users who think, and post, in these terms. So I'm only going by the conceptual parameters I've observed in others. As for fanciful notions of "metal brotherhood", I've never subscribed to and in fact dismiss them as symptoms of adolescent identity striving. I see no merit in tattooing (Manowar or otherwise) or in public advertisements of one's musical tastes.

Metal is NOT underground, with a few niche subgenres as exceptions. It's a bit difficult to be out in the open if you play in an NSBM band, that is. Otherwise, I have news for you: reality called, and wants to have a chat with you.

"Mainstream" and "underground" are relative terms. Bands such as Morbid Angel, Obituary, Sodom, Darkthrone etc. are hardly obscurities, but compared to, for instance, Nickelback, Linkin Park, or Maroon 5 they may as well exist in another dimension. They never (anymore) get featured on MTV or VH-1 and only rarely in mainstream music magazines; even then it's only in small, incidental features. Thought experiment: Enter a mall, outdoor festival, or other public place with a large number of people, and conduct a survey asking if they've ever heard of Darkthrone; only about 1 out of 100 will respond in the positive. And a sizable part of the metal universe does exist underground.... where else could labels such as Hell's Headbangers, Norma Evangelium Diaboli, and Dark Descent be said to reside? As for your last comment, there's no need to condescend to a complete stranger on a web forum, much less make incorrect inferences about their conception of music.

gabber wrote:
If people learnt not to interfere in one another's lives and opinions, we would be rid of crime and war. It would be a better world.

We just reached the board's new record: from a delusional OP to all-embracing hippie ideology in a single post.

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ENKC
Veteran

Joined: Fri Feb 29, 2008 7:28 pm
Posts: 2731
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 5:22 am 
 

I think you're overthinking it. I'm a guy with Hoobastank next to Hellhammer in my collection, and I "unironically" like both. Love both, in fact. True metal does not suffer in the slightest for me enjoying other genres or (gasp) more mainstream bands.
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BasqueStorm
Metalhead

Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 2:21 pm
Posts: 2038
Location: Turks and Caicos Islands
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 6:01 am 
 

Illuminati322 wrote:
It occurred to me that the bashing of mall-core kids and musical poseurs so endemic to the metal subculture is a waste of time.

What if I call you a poser now? People grown, do you understand?
Who cares? Don't moralize people and just do what you feel it's right. That's, in my opinion, the best you can do for the scene.

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nasum
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:42 pm
Posts: 298
Location: Croatia
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 7:07 am 
 

Damn, I can't remember when I last time heard this words or see it written in the Internet.
This is quite highschool thinking, back then people used to group according to many little things.

Now, in big world people usually tend to group according to their social position, you'll notice some of your school friends might have become bums and no one wants to hang out with them. Some have achieved big things and risen in status to higher class and hang out with classy people. Basically, poor hang out with poor, middle class with middle class and rich ones with rich.

And for metalheads, lot of us here like bands which some would call poser or listen to most poppy music that there is, and usually no one gives a fuck.
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It's probably his idea of metal. That Black Sabbath and Trouble stuff doesn't have enough gangsta giving the finger.

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hippiedrow
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2008 7:15 pm
Posts: 1720
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 7:25 am 
 

Well, it is true that you have to kill all the posers to make nuclear nachos. That is what they say in some musical group or something like that. The truth is that most of us are posers. It is just another mask we put on, but you can get all the cards, and take the life with luck.

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joppek
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 7:36 am
Posts: 925
Location: Suomi Finland Perkele
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 8:06 am 
 

Illuminati322 wrote:
1) They don't divert commercial attention and success from true metal, which does not desire and will never accomplish those goals in the first place. Part of the character of metal is that it's an insular, underground community isolated from the social mainstream.


i guess you've never heard of metallica or iron maiden...

Illuminati322 wrote:
3) So mall-core kids embrace the "metal" label while living in total ignorance of the genre and its history.... who cares? They're kids, and as such this is just another passing trend for them.


a lot of grown ups do the same thing - you don't need to be a kid to be misinformed
you also don't need to be particularly informed to enjoy any kind of music
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TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 615
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 8:14 am 
 

I've never really had a problem with the so-called "nu-metal posers" as in fact I've never really met any annoying ones, IRL or on the internets. They seem to be an entirely separate bubble for me, they have their own bands and ways of talking about them, "real" metalheads have their own. I have seen tons of hate directed towards them by metalheads though, and little in the opposite direction.

Call me a hippie if you like, but I don't see why the two can't just exist next to each other. Even if it's a question of 14-year olds trying hard to be brutal, so what? I can guess you also weren't exactly doing only smart things as a teenager.
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LanceCriminal
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 6:25 am
Posts: 75
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 8:45 am 
 

I just want to bring up the fact that I don't fully grasp the butthurt surrounding Slipknot. Say what you want about em but honestly, I still listen to them in the gym all the time.

AND I had an assload of fun in their pits back in the day. If you guys hate "mallcore kids" and fratdouche types so bad you shoulda gone to a Slipknot show, you would have had the joy of seeing (and participating in!) those losers getting FUCKED UP. Like their moms would come to the colloseum picketing the band the next day fucked up. :lol:

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Acidgobblin
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2009 7:56 pm
Posts: 2235
Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 8:56 am 
 

hippiedrow wrote:
Well, it is true that you have to kill all the posers to make nuclear nachos. That is what they say in some musical group or something like that. The truth is that most of us are posers. It is just another mask we put on, but you can get all the cards, and take the life with luck.


Wtf?
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Panflute
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2009 11:11 am
Posts: 452
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 9:04 am 
 

I was really into this whole poser-bashing thing when I was like 14. I was the only guy in high school who listened to thrash and 'black metal' (of the Dimmu Borgir / Cradle of Filth kind, though...) while the rest was into nu metal, so I rather felt like a special little snowflake.

Most of us have gone through a similar phase, so it isn't a big deal. Nowadays, I stand too far away from the metal subculture to care. I haven't gone to a proper concert in about 5 years, 90% of my friends don't give a fuck about metal in general, and I don't have the appearance of a 'metalhead' save for the occasional bandshirt, so I don't really identify with the tag at all. Don't get me wrong, I still love metal (and I dare say my taste improved dramatically since my obnoxious teeny bopper years), but the whole subculture surrounding it does not attract me, so I do not care about being 'true' or not. That said, I still love bashing certain bands because I can. Whining about stuff is one of the better pleasures in life.
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Kveldulfr
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:01 pm
Posts: 2451
Location: Chile
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 9:38 am 
 

To bash uninformed people about metal is as idiotic as bashing people for watching the LOTR movies without reading the books.

About the entry-level metal bands: in the 80's the most well known metal bands had a higher quality than today IMO. Back in the day, there was no shame on getting into metal thru Priest, Metallica or even glam/hair metal; now the borderline metal bands are way more critizised for the influences they carry: modern metalcore/deathcore, nu metal and other alternative rock bands are very polarizing.

Also, many old metalheads say that getting into metal via Metallica today is bullshit compared to doing so in the 80's. From a certain perspective, I understand, as I was there, the sort of memorabilia that meant to attend gigs at the time, the tape trading (and the listening sessions when a new album came out), the zines, the 'rebel' feeling of wearing a metal shirt when Maiden and other bands were forbidden to many for their 'satanic' image, etc; those were good times indeed but there's nothing wrong about people getting into metal with the same bands and albums today IMO; the albums are the same so it's a bit exaggerated IMO to say that I understand 'better' what Kill 'Reign in Blood' means only for being there at the time of the release - as many older metalheads still claim.

Now, there are some circles where the elitism is still high and carried too seriously. I clearly remember from the early to mid 90's when black metal was underground (at least here), the 'chosen ones' who had access to the material felt truly different from the average metalhead fan. It was almost like a sect, where the 'knowledge' was only passed to very few people, cautiously selected. Today many of those guys keep the same posture about uninformed metalheads, certain metal substyles and such; there are mandatory albums and bands that you 'should/must' have and like and 'understand', as well as they still share certain bands and albums among them only.

In a way, elitism is necessary. There's need of people keeping the 'fundamentals' alive, as I think it's necessary that metal bands still plays the traditional substyles, no matter if for some they're clones or are heavily inspired by the fathers of their respective subgenres. There's place for tradition and experimentation and both should exist.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
Posts: 19344
Location: Where the dead rule the night
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 9:47 am 
 

gabber wrote:
You know what I say?

Let everyone like what they want.
As long as no one is being hurt or affected, who really gives a fuck? If people learnt not to interfere in one another's lives and opinions, we would be rid of crime and war.
It would be a better world.


People bashing other peoples' opinions isn't why we have crime and war, man...

Elitism is just part of deep-rooted fandom. Some people can be jackasses about it, but elitism is just something that's gonna happen in any dedicated fandom and stopping it is pretty much impossible - I think it's definitely better than just liking absolutely everything and not being critical towards anything. How is the genre supposed to evolve with that mindset, if nobody tells it what's wrong with it, what fans don't like, etc? The problem is partly that some people just get too asshole-ish about it and make it not fun anymore, but more that other people are babies and can't handle differing opinions, and label anyone who is even remotely serious about their hobby (metal in this case) an 'elitist' - and so the term becomes a boogeyman-word, a go-to term to try and prove someone wrong. People need to thicken their skins and just learn to debate well, and to just accept that some people have higher standards. And furthermore, accept that people with higher standards do not make anyone else's taste invalid at all. You CAN like whatever you want, it's true. Just stop pitching a fit when people bash "mainstream" anything.
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caspian
Wanderer of the Wastes

Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 11:29 pm
Posts: 6119
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 10:00 am 
 

I'm too busy getting manowar tattoos to bash posers.

But seriously, I'm all for elitism, and for telling people they have bad taste in music, as long as you keep it in perspective. You may not be a horrible person if like the OP you like Linkin Park (although you probably are) but fuck objectivity, if you like Linkin Park you have shitawful taste in music and if I know you I will tell you that (I get back to basic civility here.. I tell my wife she has awful taste in music. I wouldn't yell at a random stranger). If you have a nickelback tattoo, I will tell you that you have awful taste in music. I won't take a cricket bat to your head, but I will insult your taste in music.


A culture of criticism is vital if you want music to prosper. You don't criticise, you end up with something like CCM, or NSBM, both of which are ridiculously awful shit. So to conclude, OP, you have bad points and those whom agree with you should feel bad too.
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WaywardSon
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:48 am
Posts: 903
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 10:26 am 
 

caspian wrote:
.


You like drone. Any right you have to telling someone else they have bad taste is nullified by that fact.
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caspian
Wanderer of the Wastes

Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 11:29 pm
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Location: Australia
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 10:32 am 
 

And you've named yourself after a Kansas song, so what's your point?
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TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 615
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 11:19 am 
 

WaywardSon wrote:
caspian wrote:
.


You like drone. Any right you have to telling someone else they have bad taste is nullified by that fact.

:lol:

Also, I enjoy Linkin Park and I admit that with no shame. Come at me bro.
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HellishHound
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2013 9:37 am
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Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 11:32 am 
 

Quote:
CCM


What's CCM?
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caspian
Wanderer of the Wastes

Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 11:29 pm
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Location: Australia
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 11:44 am 
 

Contemporary christian music (ie bland mum rock). Replace it with nu metal or any particularly self-congratulatory genre of music and it remains a decent analogy :)
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Filosofuck
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Joined: Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:19 am
Posts: 75
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 12:44 pm 
 

I'm sorry, but I can't see this without becoming angry.

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TheLiberation
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:56 pm
Posts: 615
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 12:52 pm 
 

I actually die of laughter every time I watch/listen to this.
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Poisonfume
Metalhead

Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2011 7:26 pm
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Location: Greece
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 1:04 pm 
 

To everyone acting like only children would discuss how our subculture is affected by these 'false' metal offshoots: admit it, when you respond 'heavy metal' when asked what music you listen to and people say 'oh, like Lordi?' a kitten dies slowly somewhere within your hearts.
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BasqueStorm
Metalhead

Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 2:21 pm
Posts: 2038
Location: Turks and Caicos Islands
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 1:18 pm 
 

Filosofuck wrote:
I'm sorry, but I can't see this without becoming angry.
[youtube]

Holy fuck!
PRICELESS BRUTALITY!
LOL!

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absurder21
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2008 5:51 pm
Posts: 673
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 1:27 pm 
 

Illuminati322 wrote:
It occurred to me that the bashing of mall-core kids and musical poseurs so endemic to the metal subculture is a waste of time. The existence of commercial offshoots, be they nu metal, groove metal, or metal-core, does not harm the genre in any way. Here's why:

1) They don't divert commercial attention and success from true metal, which does not desire and will never accomplish those goals in the first place. Part of the character of metal is that it's an insular, underground community isolated from the social mainstream.

2) No on is forcing metal fans to patronize it. If ones dislikes the latest Hot Topic promoted flavor of the week, he need not listen to it, wear its t-shirts, or attend its shows. His favorite bands in the underground will still exist, and thrive in their respective cultural grotto.

3) So mall-core kids embrace the "metal" label while living in total ignorance of the genre and its history.... who cares? They're kids, and as such this is just another passing trend for them. If they mature and get into metal legit, fine. If they don't it's no great loss. Either way it has no effect on metal proper.

What are other user's thoughts? I think this could be an interesting discussion.

Yeah man, liiikke, we should just stop killing and hating riiiiiiight. All I'm going to say is that there's a posers in every walk of life, and their just as annoying their as they are in metal. And seriously, who can justify NOT hating these kinds of people? So I don't think we need a specific Metal breed, per se, since most of them wander off and leave the metal tag anyway to be like a MMA kid or do blow off a dude's chode during a Skrillex concert or something (this is what I assume all the old Nu- dudes are jumping too now). Basically, you sound really butthurt and ignorant. You can still like true metal and all that "poser" shit too, I just know the difference. Did it help me get into metal? maybe, it definitely broke me in to heavy sounding stuff, but in all honesty the traits that I like of true metal I found more prominant in the band Sum 41 (tons of Maiden duel leads, thrash inspired pacing the odd metal-parody song), whose cover of For Whom the Bell Tolls ultimately woke me up to metal. So I mean, no, I'd argue true metal is a better attractint to truye metal, cos I knows tons of people who though metal was Papa Roach and Spineshank and then you show them something proper and their like "ohhhhhhhhh".

hippiedrow wrote:
Well, it is true that you have to kill all the posers to make nuclear nachos. That is what they say in some musical group or something like that. The truth is that most of us are posers. It is just another mask we put on, but you can get all the cards, and take the life with luck.

Can't say I agree with that. But nice way of outing yourself!!!

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Frank Booth
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2012 9:29 pm
Posts: 255
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 1:35 pm 
 

I only give them shit when they don't respect the classic bands, call anyone who disagrees with them an elitist, or have attitudes period. You're not a poser when you're just getting into the scene and only know the radio bands because that's all that's outwardly visible to a beginner. You're a poser when you never bother to dig deeper and still act like you know everything. Still, this "DTP \m/ for life" bullshit is fucking retarded and anyone who carries that mentality needs to grow the fuck up and stop acting like a snotnosed teenager who just discovered Exodus.

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Baldrs
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat May 04, 2013 9:30 am
Posts: 96
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 1:55 pm 
 

Illuminati322 wrote:
baron samedi wrote:
It seems that wearing a label as your personal identity and building your parameters around it (i.e. who's one of us, who's not) is largely an adolescent trait. I have, however, noticed it in a number of adults, and not just in this and other musical subcultures. Sports fans often tend to be mired in a similar psychology.


Read to here and quoted for absolute truth. Being a sportsfan myself, I personally detest this kind of attitude. Honestly I just find the whole game of ''if you're not with us you're against us'' and ''only vinyl is true'' poser bashing to be a way to seek favor within your chosen circle, and as pointed out earlier, it is common in adolescent metal fans. That being said, I think a lot of us, myself included, can admit to having adopted this attitude at an earlier stage, and then realized later how pointless it really is.

In hindsight I find it to be a pretty needless sort of thing, and it doesn't really help anyone now does it? I just shrug my shoulders really.. I figure if young metal fans don't grow out of it like others before them, then it is probably an attitude that can be found within their parents as well, particularly the father figure.

It's pretty early here, I hope that makes sense, but I do agree with the above quote and poster. It's just one of those things that are common with the internet today and with social media such as Facebook, and sites like Youtube where anyone can have an account, it's pretty rampant.

What can you do though? I know I'm going back to listening to Transylvanian Hunger and trying not to think any more of the topic.

Edit: I just realized that the vinyl quote I presented is relevant only to two circles that I personally know of. It's still a BS statement to make, especially when it is so hard to get a record player these days.

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Baldrs
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat May 04, 2013 9:30 am
Posts: 96
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 2:01 pm 
 

gabber wrote:
If people learnt not to interfere in one another's lives and opinions, we would be rid of crime and war.
It would be a better world.


Just wanted to add that this will never be possible, due to a thing called moral character. If I see someone doing something stupid or hurtful, especially to others, I am going to pull them up quicksmart. Tolerance can be a great thing, but when you start tolerating unecessary BS from others, that is when it stops for me. I think a lot of youth these days are being domesticated to take things lying down and not fight back, perhaps because it is behavior deemed inappropriate or scum-like.

I'd honestly rather the entire world be homogenous, with everyone possessing good idealistic qualities. Too many people in a country with too many different morals (or lack of) and ideas will eventually lead to chaos/death/destruction/discord.

Sorry to get off topic, but I wanted to share this.

Edit: What the hell is up with your sig gabber.. Lol.

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xThe__Wizard
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:59 pm
Posts: 845
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 2:14 pm 
 

Baldrs wrote:
Edit: I just realized that the vinyl quote I presented is relevant only to two circles that I personally know of. It's still a BS statement to make, especially when it is so hard to get a record player these days.


What? It's not hard to get a record player... Anywhere that sells records usually sells record players as well.

Besides everyone knows 8-tracks are the only true format.
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Baldrs
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat May 04, 2013 9:30 am
Posts: 96
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 2:22 pm 
 

Hahahaha, nice dude. I don't think I'll ever manage to be that true, but I can hope to find a working 8 track some day. Seriously though, they are bloody hard to get down here, and if you do find one they are for a BS price and probably don't even work properly :/

CD's are just convenient and safe for me, so I'm content with those for now. I would LOVE to find a good cassette player one day in a local dick smith though..

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HeySharpshooter
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2006 3:12 am
Posts: 402
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 2:38 pm 
 

The internet age has all but made the concept of a "poser" obsolete.

With instant access to thousands of bands, including the classics and the most obscure Metal imaginable, just about anyone can become informed about any particular genre or artist in a few hours and be able to "act" like they have known this shit for years.

Basically, it's impossible to even identify a "poser" anymore. And tbh, the term has been used incorrectly for far too long. "Poser" is someone who pretends to like something but doesn't actually like it, where-as many people use the term "poser" to describe someone who doesn't fit near perfectly into the Metalhead stereotype. "Untrve" would actually be a better description, though that is an even more comical term than "poser."

Elitism has its place, and the fact is many bands are comprised of elitists who have a very narrow musical spectrum. It helps keep many strong ideas alive, though it can also lead to stagnation. So called "hipsters," "posers," and "the untrve" also have their place to end the stagnation and breathe new ideas and concepts into the stagnant muck of elitism. It's a balancing act and one that I have no desire to change.

Elitists will always be assholes, just ignore them and remember in the great circle of Metal they serve a great purpose... just don't take recommendations from them, or everything you listen to will sound like early Bathory and Blasphemy :P

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Baldrs
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat May 04, 2013 9:30 am
Posts: 96
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 2:49 pm 
 

Just to touch upon what you are saying there Sharpshooter about hipsters, I have read online of fans of black metal calling the brothers from Wolves In The Throne room hipsters and condemning them for it. Well, I don't really know what all of this 'hipster' stuff is about, but if they are hipsters then they do what they do very fucking well.

And I agree on the last point regarding elitists. I've taken the path of listening only to that real early black metal before, and took up writing my own trve underground demos that I wanted pressed in cassette lots of 33. Needless to say, I'm never going to consider releasing those songs. Lol.

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