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Inkshooter
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 6:55 pm
Posts: 361
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 1:06 pm 
 

It's a genre that has produced many of my favorite bands, but a lot of it is pretty bad, too. People hear Korpiklaani and write the entire genre off as fruity, alcoholic dude-bro drivel, but there's really a lot more to the genre than that. The best folk metal deals with history, traditions, ancient cultures, and folklore, not drinking. I guess you have to be in the right mindset to listen to it.

THE GOOD:
Arkona
Butterfly Temple
Drudkh
Moonsorrow
EARLY Eluveitie (Slania, Spirit)
Agalloch
Negura Bunget
Kerecsensólyom
Cruachan

THE BAD:
Korpiklaani (with the exception of a handful of songs)
Elvenking
All other Eluveitie stuff
Alestorm
Turisas
Waylander

I wish more non-European folk metal bands were out there. It'd be great to hear more metal with traditional Chinese instruments and musical elements, for example, the only example of which I can think of being Chthonic.
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Smoking_Gnu
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Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2008 11:22 pm
Posts: 1983
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:30 pm 
 

SleepingStar wrote:
Korpiklaani - again, can't fault the first three albums which tended to have some variety, now it's a case of releasing identikit albums every year


Have you heard their newest, Manala? A great throwback to the thrashy, riffy goodness of Tales Along This Road. Bastardhead's recent review on the Archives here hit the nail on the head. But I'll agree they had a bad stretch after Tervaskanto; Korven Kuningas and Karkelo in particular were painfully bland.

Of course, go too far in the other direction and you get Spirit of the Forest. "Shut up or I make of you another firewood." :lol:

I'm also going to throw out my love for Elvenking's first album Heathenreel. It's the most ridiculous, over-the-top mess of clean and harsh vocals, random tempo changes changes and sudden folk interludes...but it works. Definitely not for everyone, but I find it has this goofy, frenetic charm and I love breaking it out it at the start of every summer. A shame the band is now basically pop-punk.
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talvikki77
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 3:20 pm
Posts: 183
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 3:29 pm 
 

Empyreal wrote:
It's true that people probably do see Finntroll and Korpiklaani as the forerunners of the genre, probably because they are the most popular examples. But instead of throwing out strawmen like "you just want it to sound like 80s heavy metal" or "you don't like it because you're trying to be underground," maybe people should either a) just accept that others don't like Finntroll and Korpiklaani and b) show people other, different sounding bands that they might like. ;)

I can accept that people don't like Korpiklaani and Finntroll - there are plenty of bands that I don't like too. I wasn't trying to throw out any strawmen either - just generalizing the impression I'd gotten of why a lot of metalheads here don't like folk metal, and pointing out that since so many people seem to hold that opinion, it's useful to discuss why. I can't shed too much light on that question myself, seeing that I like most folk metal, so I was just giving examples of some reasons that it seemed like other people were using. I was vague so that people could elaborate how they felt fit, I didn't say anything specific like "it doesn't sound like 80s heavy metal," just that it's different - some might say too much reliance on folk instruments, not enough complexity in the guitars, or whatever. I'm trying (in my own head as well as in this discussion) to get past this perceived divide between metalheads who like more of the folk metal bands (usually to include Korpiklaani, Finntroll, etc) and those who like less (usually excluding Korpiklaani etc. and focusing on the black metal type). :P

Smoking_Gnu wrote:
SleepingStar wrote:
Korpiklaani - again, can't fault the first three albums which tended to have some variety, now it's a case of releasing identikit albums every year


Have you heard their newest, Manala? A great throwback to the thrashy, riffy goodness of Tales Along This Road. Bastardhead's recent review on the Archives here hit the nail on the head. But I'll agree they had a bad stretch after Tervaskanto; Korven Kuningas and Karkelo in particular were painfully bland.

Of course, go too far in the other direction and you get Spirit of the Forest. "Shut up or I make of you another firewood." :lol:

Not sure why I haven't gotten around to listening to Manala - put it down to lack of funds, and a distracting and stressful real life that makes me bury my head in the sand for months at a time. I do remember last time I saw Korpiklaani live, that the new songs they played sounded much more serious and more deeply folklore influenced than their other recent stuff. Will need to check it out.

And I like Spirit of the Forest! But like I said, I really dig actual folk music, so mainly I just love the way the fiddle sounds on that album. The vocals and lyrics are a bit..rough..but to me, that's part of the folksy appeal.

I do have to agree that Ensiferum has declined ever since From Afar :( Their latest album was ok, but nothing like the awesomeness of the first few albums. The guitar riffs don't even have that Ensiferum sound to them anymore :(
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Against Such Things
Metalhead

Joined: Thu May 17, 2012 8:16 pm
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Location: Southern Maryland
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 4:19 pm 
 

Ensiferum has released a grand total of one album since From Afar. Since when is this automatically "not being the same" and just not a mistake?
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vengefulgoat
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Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2011 9:15 am
Posts: 970
Location: Poland
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 4:40 pm 
 

Inkshooter wrote:
THE GOOD:

Cruachan

THE BAD:

Waylander


Really? Honour Amongst Chaos for me is better than anything by Cruachan. Anyway, from celtic themed metal the best for me are Morrigan's Headcult and Belenos' Errances Oniriques (rerecorded version), although they're not much folky.

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drobowik
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2011 4:33 pm
Posts: 218
Location: Estonia
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2013 5:19 pm 
 

While folk metal is sometimes quite primitive and repetitive, it is still enjoyable.
I like it from Skyclad til Korpiklaani and other "big names".
And best Korpiklaani's albums were definitely made under name Shaman.

Also that's a pity, that Martin Walkyier is so quiet after leaving Skyclad.
Demo from The Clan Destined was nice start, it was much better than Skyclad with Ridley.
Walkyier promised follow-up in interview to Blabbermouth in 2009, so I still waiting...

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Paganbasque
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Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:28 am
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Location: Basque Country
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 4:02 am 
 

vengefulgoat wrote:
Inkshooter wrote:
THE GOOD:

Cruachan

THE BAD:

Waylander


Really? Honour Amongst Chaos for me is better than anything by Cruachan. Anyway, from celtic themed metal the best for me are Morrigan's Headcult and Belenos' Errances Oniriques (rerecorded version), although they're not much folky.


100% agree, Honour Amongst the Chaos is one of my favourite folk metal albums, a truly masterpiece, perhaps a little bit long but awesome. Sadly, the new one is not so good.

Cruachan is the typical classic band dont I dont achieve to fully appreciat it, something in its music doesnt work for me.

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talvikki77
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 3:20 pm
Posts: 183
Location: United States
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 11:15 am 
 

Against Such Things wrote:
Ensiferum has released a grand total of one album since From Afar. Since when is this automatically "not being the same" and just not a mistake?

Well, it could be a mistake, we could be that lucky, but more likely I think that without Jari Mäenpää, they won't get back to that amazing sound they had on Ensiferum and Iron (not as familiar with Victory Songs but as far as I can recall it's pretty good). From Afar was a good album but didn't really have as strong of an "Ensiferum" vibe to it. I don't really know how to describe it in words - the sort of amazing riffs like in "Into Battle," "Treacherous Gods" and "Lai Lai Hei" that just don't sound like any other metal band (well maybe Wintersun a little, but for obvious reason, anyway..). And then Unsung Heroes didn't have any of that sound, it was a decent generic folk metal album, but nothing like the old Ensiferum. But like you say it could be just a fluke..we'll see in a year or two I guess..

Edit: Here is an example. I could cite the whole song...but especially the intro, the first verse and the short bridge after that, and also the bridge at 3:58 are examples of the kind of Ensiferum riffs I mean.

drobowik wrote:
And best Korpiklaani's albums were definitely made under name Shaman.

Yesss, so glad someone else has heard of this proto-Korpiklaani. It would be cool if they would re-incorporate Sami joik into their music, or if some other band would start doing that.
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Against Such Things
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Joined: Thu May 17, 2012 8:16 pm
Posts: 450
Location: Southern Maryland
PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 8:49 pm 
 

I have Iron, Victory Songs, and From Afar in my collection; can't say I'm familiar with any of the others. Honestly, the only thing I really think they lost was his clean vocal ability. For the record, though, Into Battle was a joint effort between Mäenpää and Toivonen, and Treacherous Gods was written solely by Toivonen (barring lyrics). I honestly do prefer From Afar, and especially Victory Songs to Iron, in pretty much every aspect. Whatever vocal ability they lost with Mäenpää they more than made up with the utilization of multiple vocals.
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Yayattasa
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 7:49 am
Posts: 371
Location: Brazil
PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2013 2:33 pm 
 

Inkshooter wrote:
I wish more non-European folk metal bands were out there. It'd be great to hear more metal with traditional Chinese instruments and musical elements, for example, the only example of which I can think of being Chthonic.


There's a brazilian band with heavy folk elements (they even sing in tupi, a native indigenous language). I forgot the name of the act, but it wasn't that impressive. Well, it's a start, isn't?
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Metantoine
The XVI, dominar to over 242333 subjects

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:00 pm
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Location: Québec
PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2013 2:40 pm 
 

Against Such Things wrote:
I have Iron, Victory Songs, and From Afar in my collection; can't say I'm familiar with any of the others. Honestly, the only thing I really think they lost was his clean vocal ability. For the record, though, Into Battle was a joint effort between Mäenpää and Toivonen, and Treacherous Gods was written solely by Toivonen (barring lyrics). I honestly do prefer From Afar, and especially Victory Songs to Iron, in pretty much every aspect. Whatever vocal ability they lost with Mäenpää they more than made up with the utilization of multiple vocals.

Their best is by far the debut and you consider yourself a fan of them! I'm against such things!
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Paganbasque
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Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:28 am
Posts: 1221
Location: Basque Country
PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2013 4:07 am 
 

Metantoine wrote:
Against Such Things wrote:
I have Iron, Victory Songs, and From Afar in my collection; can't say I'm familiar with any of the others. Honestly, the only thing I really think they lost was his clean vocal ability. For the record, though, Into Battle was a joint effort between Mäenpää and Toivonen, and Treacherous Gods was written solely by Toivonen (barring lyrics). I honestly do prefer From Afar, and especially Victory Songs to Iron, in pretty much every aspect. Whatever vocal ability they lost with Mäenpää they more than made up with the utilization of multiple vocals.

Their best is by far the debut and you consider yourself a fan of them! I'm against such things!


My favourite one is Victory songs but I agree with you that the debut is the iconic album of this band.

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ObservationSlave
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2010 6:27 pm
Posts: 269
Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2013 1:33 pm 
 

I don't really see how the self-titled album is any better than Iron. I thought that the guitar and drums were much better on Iron. I think Into Battle, Slayer of Light, and Iron are better than anything on the first album.

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talvikki77
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 3:20 pm
Posts: 183
Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2013 4:16 pm 
 

Against Such Things wrote:
I have Iron, Victory Songs, and From Afar in my collection; can't say I'm familiar with any of the others. Honestly, the only thing I really think they lost was his clean vocal ability. For the record, though, Into Battle was a joint effort between Mäenpää and Toivonen, and Treacherous Gods was written solely by Toivonen (barring lyrics). I honestly do prefer From Afar, and especially Victory Songs to Iron, in pretty much every aspect. Whatever vocal ability they lost with Mäenpää they more than made up with the utilization of multiple vocals.


I still think the "original" Ensiferum guitar sound has something to do with Jari, because the debut Wintersun album has a very similar sound. Time I not so much, he seems to have moved away from that sound, just as Ensiferum seems to. But yeah, his vocals were pretty killer too.

Edit: Example - Wintersun song that could almost be an Ensiferum song. Maybe it had something to do with the collaboration between Jari and Markus Toivonen, a style they both developed together or something, but it's a guitar sound that I associate pretty strongly with Jari.
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ChaosGoatKills
Metal newbie

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2011 11:38 pm
Posts: 84
Location: Los Osos, California
PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 2:34 pm 
 

I really like folk metal. Some of my favorites are Isengard, Alkonost, Ensiferum and Eluveitie hell even Turisas and Finntroll are great when they fit the listening context. That being said, my favorite folk metal band and one of my favorite black metal bands is Windir! I'm always looking for more similar bands.

That being said, this genre, like all metal, produces bands I don't like. I can't stand Korpiklaani at all as well as pretty much any folk/power metal band that doesn't have a distinct black metal or melodic death metal influence. Its just too superficially happy for me. I want at least a little bit of melancholy and talk of death in my folk metal.

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Paganbasque
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Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:28 am
Posts: 1221
Location: Basque Country
PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2013 3:52 am 
 

ChaosGoatKills wrote:
I really like folk metal. Some of my favorites are Isengard, Alkonost, Ensiferum and Eluveitie hell even Turisas and Finntroll are great when they fit the listening context. That being said, my favorite folk metal band and one of my favorite black metal bands is Windir! I'm always looking for more similar bands.

That being said, this genre, like all metal, produces bands I don't like. I can't stand Korpiklaani at all as well as pretty much any folk/power metal band that doesn't have a distinct black metal or melodic death metal influence. Its just too superficially happy for me. I want at least a little bit of melancholy and talk of death in my folk metal.


Its curious but it happens the same to me, I used to like power metal and I still respect the style but I don’t usually like bands which play power folk metal, but there are some exceptions like Dalriada, which is a great band, perhaps I like them because the main voice is a female and she has a very distinctive folkie style when she sings.

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Crystal_Logic
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Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 10:10 am
Posts: 222
Location: Ireland
PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2013 5:05 am 
 

deplo wrote:
A huge fan of Slavic folk metal here, only Slavic, as they have a very distinctive and highly enjoyable sound (unlike the clichéd Finnish one, and celtic is not my thing), my favorite bands would be: Alkonost, Arkona, Grai, Ruyan, Kalevala, Serdtse-Kamen, Natural Spirit, etc... all of these being from Russia, except for the last one from Ukraine.

I prefer my folk metal sound to be dark, often a mix of folk music (whether created by ethnic instruments or just by the guitar riffs and atmosphere) and black/doom metal... I don't mind however listening to happy polka-sounding folk metal from time to time.

Also folk metal (again, Slavic) IS the right place for female vocals.



Can you reccomend some Slavic black/doom influenced folk? Preferrably not with female vocals.

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deplo
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Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2010 5:36 pm
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2013 7:10 am 
 

Crystal_Logic wrote:
deplo wrote:
A huge fan of Slavic folk metal here, only Slavic, as they have a very distinctive and highly enjoyable sound (unlike the clichéd Finnish one, and celtic is not my thing), my favorite bands would be: Alkonost, Arkona, Grai, Ruyan, Kalevala, Serdtse-Kamen, Natural Spirit, etc... all of these being from Russia, except for the last one from Ukraine.

I prefer my folk metal sound to be dark, often a mix of folk music (whether created by ethnic instruments or just by the guitar riffs and atmosphere) and black/doom metal... I don't mind however listening to happy polka-sounding folk metal from time to time.

Also folk metal (again, Slavic) IS the right place for female vocals.



Can you reccomend some Slavic black/doom influenced folk? Preferrably not with female vocals.


Gods Tower: They mainly play folk-inspired doom metal with clean male vocals.
http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/Gods_Tower/10281

Butterfly Temple: Also some nice pagan/doom metal with both clean and harsh male vocals! (Not familiar with the entire disco so don't have an idea if they have female vocals, but I think that Ksenia (Kalevala's frontwoman and vocalist) was a member in the early period)
http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/But ... emple/5736

Svarga: less doom-y, more folk-y, epic and clean male vocals.
http://www.metal-archives.com/bands/%D0 ... 0%B0/51656

+ 1 Alkonost black/doom album with 95% of it being with male vocals. (Not really black, it is actually a cleaner but slower re-recording of their debut black-inspired folk metal record)
http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Al ... %B0/146338

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OneSizeFitzpatrick
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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2013 7:55 pm 
 

I feel like the majority of folk metal acts have a seriously limited shelf-life, some of them becoming perishable more quickly than others.
Suidakra is rapidly becoming my favorite in the genre (two parts melodeath and then there's some bag piping and other assorted celtic stuff in between)... they're kind of like a lesser appreciated Ensiferum but instead of only 2 great albums, they have at least 5 that I can think of off the top of my head.
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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 10:41 am 
 

Yeah Suidakra kills when they're "on." Emprise of Avalon and Signs for the Fallen are my favorite albums by them, but most of their stuff that I've heard at least has the kick ass riffing and singular sense of folky melody. Way better band then Ensiferum in my opinion...more original, heavier, just plain better.
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Meconium
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Joined: Fri May 24, 2013 1:09 pm
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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 11:15 am 
 

Cry_In_The_Night wrote:
It's just far too cheesy for it's own good

Personally, that's why I love it. I think the camp factor is hilarious and sometimes it's so ridiculous I can't help but laugh because how am I supposed to take any of this seriously, really. You're a band of trolls who kills Christians to keyboard soundtracks that sound like they're straight from a Disney movie? Yes, please, tell me more. :lol:

A lot of responses here are negging on Korpiklaani. I enjoy Korpiklaani's earlier stuff (I did not care for the direction they went with Tervaskanto), but I think of it more as folk rock than folk metal.

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OneSizeFitzpatrick
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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 12:10 pm 
 

Empyreal wrote:
Yeah Suidakra kills when they're "on." Emprise of Avalon and Signs for the Fallen are my favorite albums by them, but most of their stuff that I've heard at least has the kick ass riffing and singular sense of folky melody. Way better band then Ensiferum in my opinion...more original, heavier, just plain better.

The Arcanum is another one of their spot-on albums, Crogacht was pretty damn close too. I think the only two I really have a problem with were Caledonia and the one after it (I can't even remember the name) but they kinda experimented with some metalcore stuff, sorta like an eluveitie clone for a while, then they snapped back out of it, and are kinda reverting back to their older, more epic stuff.. their brand new album Eternal defiance is really growing on me, I like it more than the last one to say the least.
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vgmaster9
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Joined: Sun May 26, 2013 1:26 am
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PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 10:25 pm 
 

It isn't too bad, though I don't listen to it as much as other genres.

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Paganbasque
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Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:28 am
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Location: Basque Country
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 4:55 am 
 

OneSizeFitzpatrick wrote:
Empyreal wrote:
Yeah Suidakra kills when they're "on." Emprise of Avalon and Signs for the Fallen are my favorite albums by them, but most of their stuff that I've heard at least has the kick ass riffing and singular sense of folky melody. Way better band then Ensiferum in my opinion...more original, heavier, just plain better.

The Arcanum is another one of their spot-on albums, Crogacht was pretty damn close too. I think the only two I really have a problem with were Caledonia and the one after it (I can't even remember the name) but they kinda experimented with some metalcore stuff, sorta like an eluveitie clone for a while, then they snapped back out of it, and are kinda reverting back to their older, more epic stuff.. their brand new album Eternal defiance is really growing on me, I like it more than the last one to say the least.



Thats great I have to listen to Eternal defiance, last album was good but it was far from the mighty Crogacth when they finally added more Celtic folk, it was the perfect combination between this sort of folk and their traditional awesome guitar riffs, what a masterpiece.

Caledonia was great too, about the most experimental albums I think you wanted to mention Command to Charge, which effectively sounded too modern and artificial.

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Empyreal
The Final Frontier

Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 6:58 pm
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Location: Where the dead rule the night
PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 8:20 am 
 

Eternal Defiance isn't as good as Crogacht, but it's a very well done and mature sounding album for a band that's basically been around 20 years. Got some cool songs on it.

And yeah Command to Charge sucks.
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