Encyclopaedia Metallum: The Metal Archives

Message board

* FAQ    * Search   * Register   * Login 



Reply to topic  
Author Message Previous topic | Next topic
DeathcoreDecimator
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:34 pm
Posts: 620
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 9:21 pm 
 

Not many people on this website do, but I for one love that thick tone that comes with eight string guitars in modern deathcore/djent/hardcore/Meshuggah rip-offs/whatever you want to call it. The tension that is built up on higher strings and then released with a single chug to the lowest string is absolutely mindblowing to me. I'm not here to discuss that though. What I want to know is what bands outside of the core genre utilize eight string guitars to their fullest extent? I want to know if there are any eight string thrash, death, or black metal bands. If there are, I'm guessing they sound nothing like Meshuggah and rarely ever harness a breakdown.

Top
 Profile  
OnwardToGolgotha
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 11:33 pm
Posts: 434
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 9:26 pm 
 

Yes, there are eight string bands in those genres. No, they sound nothing like Meshuggah and rarely harness breakdowns because those two qualities are not present in those genres. Pestilence and Fear Factory use them, but the former are shit and the latter could play most of their music on a two string guitar. Ihshan uses 8 strings in his solo project.
_________________
Muhammadabbadabba wrote:
, although I must niggle on one little detail. Sandniggers Bleed Sand, Not Blood. Wouldn't it make more sense if they bleed oil?

Top
 Profile  
DeathcoreDecimator
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:34 pm
Posts: 620
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 9:33 pm 
 

It's funny you mention Ihsahn, I'm a huge fan of his solo project and never knew he used them on those albums.

Top
 Profile  
Zodijackyl
Lazy Wizard

Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:39 pm
Posts: 4919
Location: United States
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 9:34 pm 
 

I'm sure you know that some prog guys have been using them - Ihsahn, Tony MacAlpine, Chris Letchford of Scale the Summit, and Rusty Cooley come to mind, and they're all over the place on them.

Portal use eight-strings but they're kind of lame - noisy/dirty death metal that sounds halfway between Immolation and a train wreck.
Necromantia are a black metal band that use eight-string basses, they've been around for a long time.
Dino Cazares uses an eight-string for Divine Heresy, I believe he still uses a seven for Fear Factory. Skip FF's last one anyway, but two albums ago was worth a listen.
Cory Smoot made an album with an eight-string, I forget if it ended up being solo or a GWAR album or if it was even released.

Top
 Profile  
Aeonblade
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 1:11 pm
Posts: 1448
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 9:35 pm 
 

As far as I know, Last Sacrament used some 8 string guitars on their release. No chuggy shit, though. Death metal with some pretty ridiculous soloing. Ron Sword is a great guitarist. I think this beast was on the album too. http://sphotos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/484637_10151120515327580_1142775339_n.jpg

Top
 Profile  
DeathcoreDecimator
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:34 pm
Posts: 620
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 9:57 pm 
 

This Last Sacrament shit is pretty damn cool, it reminds me of a more cohesive Demilich.

The vocalist for Divine Heresy is fucking hilarious though, reminds me of the dude from Disturbed.

Top
 Profile  
Bruitiste
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 11:18 am
Posts: 65
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:20 pm 
 

Aeonblade wrote:
As far as I know, Last Sacrament used some 8 string guitars on their release. No chuggy shit, though. Death metal with some pretty ridiculous soloing. Ron Sword is a great guitarist. I think this beast was on the album too. http://sphotos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/484637_10151120515327580_1142775339_n.jpg

NINE strings and a Novax fanned frets fingerboard? Ouch. It's the music that counts though...

Oh and, Portal rule...

Top
 Profile  
Aeonblade
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 1:11 pm
Posts: 1448
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:34 pm 
 

Bruitiste wrote:
Aeonblade wrote:
As far as I know, Last Sacrament used some 8 string guitars on their release. No chuggy shit, though. Death metal with some pretty ridiculous soloing. Ron Sword is a great guitarist. I think this beast was on the album too. http://sphotos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/484637_10151120515327580_1142775339_n.jpg

NINE strings and a Novax fanned frets fingerboard? Ouch. It's the music that counts though...

Oh and, Portal rule...


The guy is a monster guitarist; really into that microtonal stuff. I don't really hear too much of a difference though. He's playing too fast and my ear sucks.

Top
 Profile  
analog_winter
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:34 pm
Posts: 1160
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:22 pm 
 

Zodijackyl wrote:
Necromantia are a black metal band that use eight-string basses, they've been around for a long time.


Do they use the kind of 8 string bass that is the standard 4 strings with octaves of those 4, similar to a 12 string guitar? or just 8 individual strings like an 8 string guitar? If it is the former I would be greatly interested in hearing some of their stuff.
_________________
discogs
iAm wrote:
Oh god.

Please don't bring feels to Metal Archives. I'm content with nihilism.

Top
 Profile  
TheEvilSocky
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 12:34 pm
Posts: 590
Location: In your basement
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:06 am 
 

I use a seven string tuned a whole standard down, the B is tuned to A and E to D and so on from there.
But we see what that sounds like...
I still want a 9 string though.
_________________
The Book Of Wayne Another shitty bedroom project

Top
 Profile  
Oxenkiller
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:42 am
Posts: 1302
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:43 am 
 

never heard/seen an eight stringer; is that the low E and A doubled? I do know that Matt Pike (High on Fire) plays nine-string guitars, with the lowest three doubled. I dig that sound, for traditional heavy metal (or whatever you would classify High on Fire as) anyway. Not sure about these other genres, don't really listen to much of that stuff.

Top
 Profile  
triggerhappy
Veteran

Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:56 am
Posts: 2945
Location: Singapore
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 7:52 am 
 

I think one of the guys in Haken used an eight string on one/a few (?) song(s) on Aquarius. It was mostly just for low-end power chords though.

Aeonblade wrote:
As far as I know, Last Sacrament used some 8 string guitars on their release. No chuggy shit, though. Death metal with some pretty ridiculous soloing. Ron Sword is a great guitarist. I think this beast was on the album too. http://sphotos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/484637_10151120515327580_1142775339_n.jpg

Their music is microtonal too, isn't it?

EDIT: Just read a few posts down, and yeah I was right, haha. That just brings their music to a whole new level of cool.

Btw, do Warr guitars count? Only person I know who uses them in metal is Colin Marston in BTA.
_________________
Under_Starmere wrote:
Veracs wrote:
Thats a shitload of Gargoyle mp3's you have on that thing I'm sure.
That's all Crick's iPod accepts. GB = Gargobytes.

Top
 Profile  
TheEvilSocky
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 12:34 pm
Posts: 590
Location: In your basement
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 8:45 am 
 

Oxenkiller wrote:
never heard/seen an eight stringer; is that the low E and A doubled? I do know that Matt Pike (High on Fire) plays nine-string guitars, with the lowest three doubled. I dig that sound, for traditional heavy metal (or whatever you would classify High on Fire as) anyway. Not sure about these other genres, don't really listen to much of that stuff.


7's add a B string making the tuning B,E,A,D,G,B,E. 8 strings add one more on that making the highest string F#, although not effecting the rest.
http://www.rondomusic.com/interceptor93 ... flame.html
THIS is the nine string I want, I plan on tuning it like a normal 8 and adding a treble A on bottom ala Rusty Cooley (cept with 9 string instead of 8).
_________________
The Book Of Wayne Another shitty bedroom project

Top
 Profile  
HeWhoBreedsPestilence1
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:46 am
Posts: 4
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:43 am 
 

Speaking of Ihsahn, here is what he says about using eight string guitars:

Quote:
Q:I wanted to quickly talk about the guitars. You started using 8 strings on After and continued using them on this album. I was wondering why you chose 8-strings in the first place?

A:Basically because I’ve been playing guitar for about 25 years now. In a way… Do you play the guitar?

Q:Yeah, I do.

A:Then you know, when you’ve been playing a lot, writing a lot of music, you end up with your fingers doing almost those same things with muscle memory, so when you try and create something new just by looking at your fingers it feels like they’re doing the same thing over and over again. So for me, even on my second record, I did some songs with different tunings to break the patterns of my chord voicings and finger movements. I was skipping the technical parts and just looking at my fingers and feeling that I was repeating myself but just going into different territories with different tunings and skipping the analytical part, going straight to listening.

It’s the same thing since I’ve been using seven strings. With eight strings you have to re-think things even further because you can’t do things like you can with seven strings, such as power chords. With a seven string in regular tuning you can still get away with the same type of chords with fifths in a low range. With eight strings that’s just not possible. You have to treat that textured low range as a bass part, really. Then you tune it to an F#. You have to use voicings that will open it, chords with open strings that get a whole different way of relating to it. Again, it’s a similar thing to using a new tuning. You kind of skip the analytical part and just start listening. You’re forced to do things in a different way, and with the 8 string you can even make it function as the bass part and let the bass do more higher lead lines. It’s variety. On a lot of the songs on this new album, I went back to the 7 string because Ibanez gave me some of their new hybrid baritone. They have a new series called RGD, which has a longer scale. I’ve been using a lot of seven strings with Drop A tuning.

Q:A 27” scale, right? 8-strings are normally thought of as belonging to only a few specific metal subgenres right now…

A:Oh yeah. I had an interview the other day where they asked me about djent. Is that how you say it? I just read about that in Guitar World, and I think I’ve heard some bands that are categorized by it. I believe Meshuggah are kind of the Godfathers of this? I can’t say I really know much more about the genre then, but having heard Meshuggah, I think the philosophy of how they approach that type of music is different from mine. Even though I use 8 strings and down-tuned 7 strings, I don’t think it sounds very much like their music.

Q:You’re very unique, because a lot of the 8-string artists only play djent or variations of deathcore, and you don’t at all. I was wondering if you had ever run into any opposition or elitism for using the 8-strings outside of their typical subgenres.

A:No, not really. If so, I haven’t really paid attention, but people probably haven’t noticed that much because I don’t exaggerate using only that range of instruments. The only time I actually gave that some thought was when it I got my first 7 string in 1999. And that very much inspired my writing of the whole last Emperor album. I decided then that even if I had this extra range, I wouldn’t just use the bottom range as the only type of writing. I’ll just treat it as an extra. I can do my guitar parts like I did before but can implement that part too and not force everything to be the same but just an extra string lower. That’s been my approach all along.

I’ve never been very good at writing single classic guitar riffs that you can do on one guitar. I’ve always had the counterpoint thing, only because I grew up on Maiden and Priest, always hearing clean guitars. What I find interesting with writing on guitar is trying to create that variety and tension between the low range and a second, much higher guitar and also implementing more interesting chord voices in the upper register. And of course pushing the limits of it on type chords and 2nd notes. I have some sample songs from the new album in unison with two dozen trombones.

Top
 Profile  
Zodijackyl
Lazy Wizard

Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:39 pm
Posts: 4919
Location: United States
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:01 pm 
 

Oxenkiller wrote:
never heard/seen an eight stringer; is that the low E and A doubled? I do know that Matt Pike (High on Fire) plays nine-string guitars, with the lowest three doubled. I dig that sound, for traditional heavy metal (or whatever you would classify High on Fire as) anyway. Not sure about these other genres, don't really listen to much of that stuff.


Matt Pike's custom nine-string has the top three strings (G/B/E) doubled. BC Rich's Bich model was traditionally a ten-string with the top four doubled (DGBE). A lot of traditional rock and roll guys love their twelve strings for leads, sometimes using a double neck where they have 6+12, I highly recommend Legend's "From the Fjords", epic heavy metal from New Haven, CT (lots of bands have that name).

The majority of eight-string guitars have two extra strings on the bottom, B2 and F#1 or dropped to E1 (same as the lowest string on a standard tuned bass). Some add another high string - Chris Letchford (Scale the Summit) adds a low B and a high G, and as Ihsahn talked about in the interview posted below, needing to work with different intervals and shapes was something he liked, and having the top string tuned to minor third changes something about how you tend to play guitar.

TheEvilSocky wrote:
7's add a B string making the tuning B,E,A,D,G,B,E. 8 strings add one more on that making the highest string F#, although not effecting the rest.
http://www.rondomusic.com/interceptor93 ... flame.html
THIS is the nine string I want, I plan on tuning it like a normal 8 and adding a treble A on bottom ala Rusty Cooley (cept with 9 string instead of 8).


Extended range guitars like that are difficult to work with - you know why a lot of them have fanned frets? Adding range theoretically sounds like fun, but setup on a fixed scale length when you're adding over an octave over a standard guitar setup generally causes problems with either the high or low end (or both). Everyone lusts after something, but skateboards with strings are very difficult to play and there are always more possibilities with a six string. If you're thinking about something like that, get a cheap, downtune-friendly guitar like a BC Rich Warlock (you can probably find one used for $100-120) and put together a set of heavy strings for downtuning and alternate tunings - try AEADAC and CGDAEG, maybe something with an octave on the bottom and/or top - you'll be able to expand what you're doing as much as you'd think three extra strings would give you.

Top
 Profile  
Acrobat
Eric Olthwaite

Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:53 am
Posts: 6593
Location: Fortress Northallerton, North Yorkshire/ Varese, Padania
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:44 pm 
 

They could be great, sure, but nigh-on everyone who's using them seems to be a boring wanker who's trying to compensate for the fact that they can't write decent riffs (this means you, nowadays Ihsahn!). I did enjoy the Matt Pike video where he was playing the nine-string guitar - which is like half-normal, half-twelve-string.
_________________
'Heavy metal top of the class, stuff the media up your arse!' - Den Dennis.

Let's Trade in the Darkness of Hell! - updated for 2014!

Top
 Profile  
kingnuuuur
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:35 pm
Posts: 2128
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 2:08 pm 
 

Matt Pike's nine-stringer has absolutely nothing to do with the type of guitars that OP is talking about.

Top
 Profile  
CF_Mono
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2010 5:21 pm
Posts: 1452
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 3:34 pm 
 

kingnuuuur wrote:
Matt Pike's nine-stringer has absolutely nothing to do with the type of guitars that OP is talking about.

Yeah, that works the same way a traditional twelve string guitar works in that some of the strings have other strings moving completely parallel to them, supposedly to achieve at chorus effect.
_________________
Doom or be doomed...
My current band. Wretched doom trio from NY.

Top
 Profile  
TheEvilSocky
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 12:34 pm
Posts: 590
Location: In your basement
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 1:56 am 
 

Zodijackyl wrote:
Extended range guitars like that are difficult to work with - you know why a lot of them have fanned frets? Adding range theoretically sounds like fun, but setup on a fixed scale length when you're adding over an octave over a standard guitar setup generally causes problems with either the high or low end (or both).

I've been researching ERG's for the better part of four years and maintenance problems are, as far as I can tell, varied from player to player, while a multi-scale would be preferred, for me saving an hour or two to get "proper" intonation still doesn't merit the extra price they have.

Zodijackyl wrote:
Everyone lusts after something, but skateboards with strings are very difficult to play and there are always more possibilities with a six string.

I actually lust after a WARR-12, however they cost more than any vehicle I've ever owned so 9 string is an alternative my wallet will survive, as far as neck shape goes I'm far more comfortable with "skateboard with strings" than "badly modified GH2 controller" which is what standard neck shapes feel like to me.

Zodijackyl wrote:
If you're thinking about something like that, get a cheap, downtune-friendly guitar like a BC Rich Warlock (you can probably find one used for $100-120) and put together a set of heavy strings for downtuning and alternate tunings - try AEADAC and CGDAEG, maybe something with an octave on the bottom and/or top - you'll be able to expand what you're doing as much as you'd think three extra strings would give you.

I've got enough fifth hand guitars to open my own pawn shop if I wanted to, The plan is to (for once) get a guitar that isn't the instrument equivalent of a two dollar whore

Thanks for the advice anyway though and apology's if I come off dickish, I'm really tired.
_________________
The Book Of Wayne Another shitty bedroom project

Top
 Profile  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: captaincrunchy, Ois666, volutetheswarth and 14 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

Back to the Encyclopaedia Metallum


Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group