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Son_Of_Perdition
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:48 am
Posts: 4
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:23 am 
 

I'm a little confused. Because METALLUM indicates that BAN speak in your lyrics about Mysticism, Philosophy, and Individualism. And I understand the two last. But Mysticism is A path that leads to union with God. And usually given in monotheistic religions, but I thinks that BAN, is more pagan (or at least that speaks his lyrics) that religions as zoroastrianism, judaism, christianity, islam, hinduism and buddhism that are religions that practice the Mysticism.

Anyone enlighten me

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ld50
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2011 2:22 am
Posts: 495
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:57 am 
 

Don't worry, I got you, bro!

Did you even try to look it up? I'll quote the first sentence on the first google result, which is Wikipedia. It sums up the most well known definitions of mysticism:
Quote:
Mysticism is the knowledge of, and especially the personal experience of, states of consciousness, or levels of being, or aspects of reality, beyond normal human perception, sometimes including experience of and even communion with a supreme being.


Even if the definition of Mysticism always included "experience of and even communion with a supreme being," a supreme being or the divine isn't always the more common monarchical figure head such as the one(s) found in the big three religions; it can represent a much more abstract idea or state of consciousness.

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BasqueStorm
Metalhead

Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 2:21 pm
Posts: 1943
Location: Turks and Caicos Islands
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:17 pm 
 

Son_Of_Perdition wrote:
I'm a little confused. Because METALLUM indicates that BAN speak in your lyrics about Mysticism, Philosophy, and Individualism. And I understand the two last. But Mysticism is A path that leads to union with God. And usually given in monotheistic religions, but I thinks that BAN, is more pagan (or at least that speaks his lyrics) that religions as zoroastrianism, judaism, christianity, islam, hinduism and buddhism that are religions that practice the Mysticism.
Anyone enlighten me

Have a look:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=93310

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Son_Of_Perdition
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:48 am
Posts: 4
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 2:59 pm 
 

I hope that you are right (ld50). I continue looking....

Thanks for your answers.

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Unmaker
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2010 1:27 am
Posts: 31
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 10:19 pm 
 

The sense in which I've become familiarised with the term is when one substitutes a concrete argument for a subversive and unreal position which cannot necessarily be unveiled by any audience. From an atheistic position this generally involves grandiose language and basically everything that BAN's music entails. It can also be a satirical jab at those hoping to glean 'hidden wisdom' from a text/ art work. I could also be wrong, but Vindsvals decision to largely eschew the english language puts me at a disadvantage for close interpretation.

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Son_Of_Perdition
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:48 am
Posts: 4
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:47 pm 
 

Yes, I agree with you. Is a little confused... for example:
In the artwork of 777 Sect(s) there is a cross, In 777 Sect(s) & Cosmosophy the "lyrics" talk about god ( not necessarily in the form of praise), but is very difficult try to translate French-English, and some words can be misinterpreted. And for last I find a interview with Vindsval where he says: "777 is the collapse of a world of references. 777 is about the annihilation of the obsolete concept of time; it’s about the modification of a human soul who becomes a particle of God..." (http://www.nataliezed.ca/2012/feature-i ... ification/)
And in other interview, he talk about your lyrics that haven't references to Paganism & Occultism, but he say that Blut aus Nord speak about Universe and cycles. (http://occultblackmetalzine.blogspot.mx/2011/03/1.html). In this point born my confusion, but I think that is part of essence of Blut aus Nord.

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Unmaker
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2010 1:27 am
Posts: 31
PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 7:28 am 
 

I think in terms of the music the change throughout the albums definitely mirrors a move from chaos to order, Cosmosophy is so triumphant sounding I can definitely understand the kind of awareness/ acceptance of reality which could be 'becoming a particle of god'. The fact that he writes a particle of God rather than a state of Godhood seems like he's not necessarily talking about monotheism, but merely the kind of exagerated humanity which typically exists in myths of gods in paganism. I think also that he's suggesting that just as no all powerful all knowing creator god can exist (or even be truly considered in a way where those terms don't lose meaning), no one can grasp the kind of totalising truths which some mystics claim to have revealed - these truths are merely an illusion. I think musically this is represented in the way that the kind of 'revelatory' melodies which emerge in the trilogy are basically always short lived, and soon enough replaced by more chaotic noise. An awareness of the impossibility of communion with God like many claim to have is also an acceptance of the wholeness of life without god, hence the relatively uplifting sound to which the trilogy progresses. Overall I must say I hadn't at all thought about the first two albums in this light until listening to Cosmosophy, and even if this is an interpretation which I'm just imposing on what is actually meaningless I think it fits, because pursuing a totalising understanding of life is ignoring the peace of mind possible from just accepting life as it appears.

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godlessScum
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2008 10:09 pm
Posts: 39
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2012 12:05 pm 
 

BAN posits a God that is very different from the orthodox Christian God of the Bible. If you are versed in chaos magick, which I read into a lot of BAN's post TWWTG work, belief in god is useful only in that it works for the magician. I haven't completely digested Cosmology, but it only strengthens my opinion that Vindsal is drawing heavily from occultism than paganism.

Here's a nice intro to chaos magick. http://www.barbelith.com/cgi-bin/articl ... 0004.shtml

Note that this is only what I subjectively get from BAN and is not meant to be an objective interpretation of their work.

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Son_Of_Perdition
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:48 am
Posts: 4
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:21 pm 
 

Perfect! specials thanks to "godlessScum" and "Unmaker" you guys really helped me to understand.

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