Allright, I contacted him over ebay messages. Hopefully, he'll come around to cancel the deal.

Any have a copy of Paul Chain - Alkahest they can look at for me? I have no idea if Paul was ever bootlegged or not, but I figured I'd looks since I got this CD cheap and sealed.

My copy has OMS 991950128896 1544-B

I have the same Dark Millennium cd. Also, same matrix code. My copy is several years old and I can't imagine there was any interest in doing cd bootlegs when I got it. It's not even rare.
I also have their second cd and that one has a more normal looking matrix code.

I contacted him also and he already replied saying he canceled it.

go team, go team go

Well as I said before at the time of this post the seller isn't from Lithuania but Latvia, honest mistake. Anyway, both CDs arrived today. Ghoul and Sepsism debut albums for a really low price, around 5€ and 8€ respectively. A friend of mine has both original editions of them so that was enough to reassure me as I could do a comparison on arrival.

The Ghoul CD is an obvious boot as the matrix is "L385 8954 GHOUL DUPLICATION SPECIALISTS C320701-01 A". If the "duplication specialists" wasn't enough there are also a few errors on it like the inner ring on the printing side of the CD being transparent as opposed to having the print "WE ARE GHOUL". And then there's a noticeable difference in contrast to the original.

The Sepsism CD I'm not entirely sure because it's pretty much a near perfect copy. There's a slight difference in contrast on the print but one that is barely seen on the naked eye. However that difference extends to the booklet, tray insert and CD print. The only noticeable difference is the placement of the matrix, which is equal on both as are the IPFI codes, so I wanted to know if the placement of the matrix is always the same on CDs. When you have the CD in the right position (where the print matches the cover) and you turn around to see the surface, will the matrix placement be exactly the same on all copies of that CD? Because as I said the only noticeable difference is that the matrix is inverted by 180 degrees.

As I can't post pictures I'll say that when the print on the CD is matching the cover the DACD, IPFI and matrix are on the top and the bar codes on the bottom. On the other copy it's inverted, with the bar codes on the top and remaining identifiers on the bottom. This Sepsism CD is actually giving me a headache, can someone check his/her copy and see what's the correct placement? I fear I can no longer distinguish between the two and I'd like to hand my friend the right copy.

Yep, that's cool. Unfortunately the seller can still let it go to the secod highest bidder. Hopefully D1focus will give the seller negative feedback, so others will be warned.

Had the same doubt looking at a Deathcrush photo on ebay the other day where the CD print was rotated compared to mine. But your situation is funny Oh, while you're with both compare the TOC, peak levels and CRC (EAC dumps all that to the log file).


Yes, the only acceptable solution was for ebay to do something about the reports.

How exactly do I do this?

An addendum to my mini-drama. My Sepsism CD is identical to my friend's, my eyes were playing tricks on me. Sleep deprivation can do that, my apologies.

As for the Ghoul CD I actually contacted Bill Nocera from Razorback and he told me that this version is a repress they did later on, and that it's official. I've already updated the information on the Discogs page of the release with the repress matrix and lack of inner ring printing.

So all is well in the world and Latvian sellers are trustworthy so far.

this is the wicked piece of kit japc is referring to [for windows users...]
http://www.exactaudiocopy.de/

mac os and 'linux' etc probably have similar tools

Well, I use EAC in Linux, it runs just fine in wine (windows emulator).

I tried to look for some Linux alternative to it, a couple of years ago, and the only thing that existed was cdparanoia, pretty decent but not on par on error correction, accuraterip integration and tutorials to make bit exact copies to multiple FLACs + .cue (that's what I use it for: CDs -> FLAC -> store for backups in case of bitrot + encode to mp3 for portability).

I notice the guy who was selling the Sororicide CD has relisted it, with amended information (i.e - now stating it's not an original pressing, "this is a repress" etc). Obviously, we all know there is no-repress, but always bear in mind that the seller themselves might not be aware that what they're selling is a bootleg. Sellers can get caught out too, and with lack of information (or just general laziness) can seem like they're purposely trying to dupe people when in reality they genuinely believe they're selling an original (until told otherwise - like in this case).

Also, just to re-iterate due to an experience I have just had - if a specific pressing isn't on discogs or any other site, it doesn't mean it is immediately a bootleg. I have a Voivod re-issue of Rrröööaaarrr which came out as part of Sanctuary Records re-issues of part of the Noise catalogue which I can find no info of at all online, and I'm trying to sell it on eBay. Some guy sends me an e-mail telling me it's a bootleg, how dare I rip people off and that he's reporting me to eBay blah blah blah. The CD was bought in Virgin Megastores in the early 2000s, and has a Noise Records/Sanctuary mail order flyer inside, so it clearly isn't a bootleg - but because it isn't mentioned anywhere on the web, people immediately jump to conclusions and fly off the handle. Again, the previously mentioned critical thinking is required!! haha.

So true! In all honesty I've had some bad news yesterday right before receiving the order in the mail, plus I have been sleep deprived for some time now, so I basically threw a shit fit. Dubious source, noticeable differences on naked eye, different matrix. If Bill hadn't answered the poor seller would've basically been buttfucked by me without any blame. I sent him an apology PM explaining the whole thing and left positive feedback. But this can indeed happen with all the fear of bootlegs that is nowadays all too present.

i added my 'made in thailand' immolation majesty and decay cd to discogs if anyone is interested
it's important to add things there i reckon

Hi all,

I recently bought from ebay a copy of Heretic's Breaking Point reissue on Lost and Found records, but It has no IFPI code (matrix is:cd 72552). Could anyone confirm it? Is it regular for small labels to press cds without IFPI codes? Isn't it mandatory now? Thanks in advance

it's not mandatory no, my two hirax cds [new age of terror and el rostro de la muetre] have none and are legit, but they own their own label.
matrix: cd 72552 would have alarm bells ringing, but we can't see what it looks like, hint hint, put up some photos
that doesn't even look like the catalogue number according to: http://www.musik-sammler.de/media/381274
it wouldn't be the first bootleg/counterfeit of a non-rare cd though...
neither discogs or musik-sammler have any matrix info listed [disogs doesn't have the reissue at all]

Isn't the Lost And Found reissue legit? If you bought it on Ebay from a trusted source there's no fear of it being a boot. Does it have the right CAT# and EAN? Does it have the bonus track and is it remastered? In last resort you can always email Lost And Found directly.

Thank you guys, I'm trying to upload the picture of the matrix but I can't do it.. Why?? Maybe I'm not allowed to post attachments.. Anyway, except for the missing ifpi and the strange matrix I have no clue my copy could be a boot: cd is perfect, booklet is good quality paper, the EAN matches and the seller was reliable. Maybe I'm getting a little bit paranoid...

We all are nowadays... especially me!

You can't upload photos directly, you have to use an outside website and then link to it.

Here is the photo. It would be interesting to compare it with other Lost and Found releases...

I looked at a Lost & Found CD I have from 1995 (by a band called "Feed") and there is an IFPI code and other numbers and things printed around the center. Don't know if that bit of info helps at all.

indeed, does it have ifpi codes?

http://www.discogs.com/help/submission-guidelines-release-format.html#CD_Matrix

I recently got one too that was sealed, with the same matrix and correct UPC (according to discogs). Aside from such a rare CD being sealed, and seeing that others are grabbing it lately, the only thing about it that makes me suspicious is that the printing on top of the disc is somewhat mis-registered and fuzzy. I've seen this on otherwise perfect boots/represses of Necromantia/Osmose stuff, where everything appears to be legit, but you can tell that the colors are misaligned just a little bit compared to them being sharp on a real original. I'm still loving the hell out of the music though, and I'd rather have this than nothing.

Thanks Korgull, but this is probably another label with same name (from Germany, maybe). Anyway, I have some other recent cds without any kind of ifpi (on Divebomb Records and Shadow Kingdom records), so it is probably not so rare for certain labels. What is strange is when ifpi is missing on very common cds, for example I recently found out that my copies of Cannibal Corpse "Bloodthirst" and "The Wretched Spawn" don't have any ifpi... quite strange...

relapse and metal blade stuff often doesn't have them for some reason.

Can anyone tell me anything about this version of Sigh- Scorn Defeat? See photo.

It is the first cover from DSP, and the cd has the first matrix from DSP. The thing I am curious about is the inlay which has negative colours.

.

Hmmm a little confused over IFPI codes I have researched over the last week. since a couple people argued over the exact date the IFPI codes were stamped onto cds (i do not want to start or be in any part of an argument )
Some places on the web say it was 1994 that cd manufacturers started using them. But still some other sites definitly say it started before them. Here is some info i found.

http://www.miskovskyfan.se/html/ifpi.php
http://www.miskovskyfan.se/html/ifpiis.php

This list is pretty thorough though.

IFPI LB50 Sonopress GmbH, Gütersloh Germany 1984-2004
yeah that's more than a little ambiguous

Got a couple of Bathory tapes the other day and wonder if there was ever an official number that were released, and I also know that Bathory has been bootlegged a lot.

Bathory - Blood Fire Death (Kraze)
Bathory - The Return...... (Combat)
Bathory - Under The Sign Of The Black Mark (New Renaissance Records)

Thank you.

Sadistik Exekution - K.A.O.S.

does anyone else have a copy of this to compare?
matrix: SADISTICK / CREATIVE DISC S10745/1
mould sid code: IFPI 6RA2
barcode: 708496066622
catalogue number: SHOCK 0666

click for images, they're only 600 wide

Hi guys i've a question!(sorry for my bad english)
I bought a digipack version of Burzum-Filosofem and i've fear it is a bootleg.
These are matrix code and IFPI code indicated on discogs for original version:
MATRIX CODE:DADC A0100181635-0101 24 A6
IFPI CODE:L554
Those of my version:
MATRIX CODE:DADC A0100181635-0101 24 A1
IFPI CODE:L554
They are almost the same,just change A6 with A1 on matrix code!
So,my version can be a bootleg?
Thanks!

is A6 and A1 pressed into the plastic or somehow 'inscribed' or is it printed?
it's fairly common to get a variation like that.

put up a photo of the matrix area so someone can compare fonts etc

I had asked on NWN's forum if someone could check the matrix for me. I was told it's the correct matrix, so I'm confident I got a good copy. I asked the Amazon seller where he got his copies, he said he picked them up from some local store when they were closing down.

"Ax" = date/run code. "A1" it's an "earlier" pressing than "A6". This code does not make it to a bootleg.

Thanks!Im quiet now

Was there ever a repress of Razor's Shotgun Justice done mid 1990s distributed by Hellion Records? Matrix FZZ 2 177 FPD 3094. Or is it a Boot.

Here is a conversation between the seller and me

Me : "Hello, i see that you are from Russia, but selling cd out of Arizona?
was wondering about full Matrix, is it like this,with complex CD matrix, which includes engraved complex simbols (in English and in French), which printed backward + barcode lines etc. Let me know and thank you"

Me : "The last question was a little vague,her is a better one
Does the matrix have this in it, 708/ FDP3094 DISQUE AMERIC CANADA also with barcode symbols?"

Seller : "Hi Yes, I have two addresses. I live in Russia now
Also I have USA brother and use his address for Ebay sometimes
I collect CDs over 20 years
Sorry, why you ask me after end of auction?
In description of auction you can see that CD is 2nd edition.
RAZOR "Shotgun Justice" Megarare 2nd press cd released on Fringe in 90's,14 tracks(FDP3094),made in Canada.
Legendary canadian thrash metal....This is a reissue that came in 90's which was sold by Hellion records.
Matrix code is: FZZ 2 177 FPD 3094 No Ifpi code! and No barcode. Price for 1st press usually 400-600$
I think is insane becouse digital data fully compared to 1st press. Plays very fine."

Me : "Hmmm smells like a Russian Bootleg now, i thought you were from the United States and this maybe a real deal. But after researching that Matrix, it appears to be a bootleg. Yes i should have done my research better and actually looked at your feedback, where it says from Russian Federation, NOT Arizona. Shotgun Justice was never officially reissued. Some record companies that sell on line like shadow kingdom have this boot version for 16 $. "

Seller : "Hi This is not a russian boot. I think reissue of this title exist. I'm 100 percent good Ebayer. Ebay automaticaly change my address to Usa location after recent purchase for My brother at Phoenix Arizona. 70-80$ is real price for repress. Again, this is not Russian boot. I have these boots too for my Suv car listening. Matrix is different. 1st press that are you talking about costs 300-500$ really!
I can buy it from you for 200$ right now.
Please make your decide or I can cancel this purchase
Let me know"

cd-maximum, irond, ooho etc aren't bootlegs just russian licensed, maybe that's what it is.
that would annoy me too though, he should tell his brother to get his own account, naturally you'll tell ebay