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brightfield
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Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2009 10:47 pm
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:22 pm 
 

I got into Deeds of Flesh recently (thanks to a rec I got here). And I just ordered Cabinet and Noctambulant the other day. How do you guys compare the two bands?
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HowDisgusting
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:26 pm 
 

brightfield wrote:
I got into Deeds of Flesh recently (thanks to a rec I got here). And I just ordered Cabinet and Noctambulant the other day. How do you guys compare the two bands?
Until Deeds' most recent album? Not at all. Completely different styles.
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Rottenrectum
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:38 pm 
 

Deeds Of Flesh have released the same decent album for about 10 years now, the only difference seems to be the production job.

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brightfield
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:47 pm 
 

I should have said I just got the first three DoF albums, since I heard the later ones suck.
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cjgone
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Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2009 1:38 am
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 11:23 pm 
 

HowDisgusting wrote:
Rottenrectum wrote:
Sepulturafreak wrote:
Karnstein_Records wrote:
lord_ghengis wrote:
tech death bands of the last 10 years don't know the first thing about death metal.


Please tell me the first thing about death metal. I'm very interested to know what it is.

It should be raw and sick, which is not something you can say about the majority of modern tech death

Depends on how you define "raw and sick".
...In what way does any modern tech-death fit the description of 'raw and sick'?


SoP plays a lot more original guitar parts. You can't really find a band that plays similarily and I haven't found a death metal band that can play more technically then them either.
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HowDisgusting
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 11:24 pm 
 

...okay. How is that an appropriate response to my question?

SoP is like Necrophagist in the sense that they're death metal for people who know fuck-all about death metal.
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lord_ghengis
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 24, 2009 11:48 pm 
 

HowDisgusting wrote:
...okay. How is that an appropriate response to my question?

SoP is like Necrophagist in the sense that they're death metal for people who know fuck-all about death metal.


They're slightly better than that, you're being a little hard on them. They've got a lot more death metal in them than goddamned Necrophagist, who have nil.
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MazeofTorment
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:12 am 
 

I still dont understand the intense hate that Necrophagist recieves on this board unless of course its somehow related to their popularity, which would not surprise me. Overrated? Ok sure but I'll be damned if some of you guys act like its the most bland, unimaginative, untalented sounding death metal out there when theres clearly much worse. I enjoy their music but havent cared to listen to them in a few years but I'm still not quite understanding what makes them so incredibly horrid in the eyes of some people here. Even not being in the mood to listen to this style I still probably wouldnt be able to listen to the majority of their songs and call them bad. Riffs are present, the solos usually make sense in the structure of the song and the songs actually do tend to go somewhere unlike many other technical death metal bands which lack total direction and simply just wank all over themselves aimlessly. Oh and not to mention that one guy writes everything? Not having been in the mood to listen to tech death in quite some time the last thing I thought I'd be doing tonight was actually defending Necrophagist but jesus christ, some of you guys have some pretty tight standards apparently.

/rant

Back on topic....

I like Spawn of Possession. As previously mentioned I havent cared much for this style in awhile but I do recall liking them quite abit. One of the handful of technical death metal bands that I found some substance in.
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rexxz
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:15 am 
 

I dislike Necrophagist because it does not fulfill me, and is not what I look for in death metal (or any metal). I assume that every other detractor of that band does so on the same basis. Everything else you're talking about is simply a difference in opinion.

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MazeofTorment
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:20 am 
 

Well this is after all, a message board where we people express our opinions and disagree at times, yes? :wink:

Just doing my part. But your response is efficient enough. If it doesnt do it for you then it just doesnt do it for you.
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rexxz
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:23 am 
 

MazeofTorment wrote:
Well this is after all, a message board where we people express our opinions and disagree at times, yes? :wink:.


That was the entire point of my post. You're percieving some sort of un-fair attack on the band that borderline's hinting on some sort of conspiracy to disparage them (and perhaps others like them), when all that we are doing is expressing our views towards them just as you might.

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lord_ghengis
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:32 am 
 

The problem with Necrophagist is that their music has no resemblance to death metal, it's like some kind of speed prog which pretends to be brutal by adding blast beats and growls. The fact that this somehow fools so many people into actually thinking this is a brutal band actually offends me (Seriously, look around, there are thousands of people who think they are the most extreme band on the planet), which is odd considering I tend to not care about how people react to music. There's just something about them which irritates me on a deep level.

Also, they invented this modern tech death guitar tone which sounds weaker than a keyboard, their riffs have no character or energy, and Suimez is a self important asshole who mixes himself about seven times too high. But it's more than just the music which makes me hate them.

I don't care that Metallica's Black album helped kill thrash, I don't care that Dimmu Borgir turned Black metal into something goth fags can listen to, but I think Necrophagist and their followers are killing death metal, and I'll be damned if it doesn't piss me off for some reason. It's the only case which this sort of thing applies to me, I'm not sure why, but there's something about them which angers the very depths of my soul. Hell I don't find the concept of Brain Drill offensive to my death metal sense. Necrophagist are literally the only band I hate on a non-musical level.
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MazeofTorment
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:36 am 
 

rexxz wrote:
MazeofTorment wrote:
Well this is after all, a message board where we people express our opinions and disagree at times, yes? :wink:.


That was the entire point of my post. You're percieving some sort of un-fair attack on the band that borderline's hinting on some sort of conspiracy to disparage them (and perhaps others like them), when all that we are doing is expressing our views towards them just as you might.


While it is true that I may have hinted at some potential unfair hate pointed in their direction, it was not the intent of my post to portray that as being my opinion of why they seem to be so generally disliked on here. I have no legitimate past references to actually believe that would be the reason, I was just merely stating that it would not surprise me given the nature of some metal fans, no offense to anyone in particular. It just is what it is sometimes. My biggest point really was just the extremity to which they seem to be disliked and that I dont understand it. Thats all. :grin:
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VictimsOfDeception
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:40 am 
 

HowDisgusting wrote:
...okay. How is that an appropriate response to my question?

SoP is like Necrophagist in the sense that they're death metal for people who know fuck-all about death metal.


So someone who knows a lot about death metal isn't allowed to like Spawn of Possession? That sounds pretty ridiculous.
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MazeofTorment
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:46 am 
 

lord_genghis, I commend you on a very well done, coherent post. Couldnt have asked for a better response. :thumbsup:

In fact, I'll even go so far as to even agree with you for all intents and purposes. If we are in fact talking about the 'true spirit' of death metal in a sense, relatively speaking, then you're absolutely correct. I realise I myself referred to them as tech death simply just because its become such an accepted label but even in the midst of my thoughts I pondered the fact that they really dont sound very much like death metal when it comes down to it. It is in fact, different and probably shouldnt be so commonly associated with the genre. I think I understand where you guys are coming from now.
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lord_ghengis
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:58 am 
 

MazeofTorment wrote:
lord_genghis, I commend you on a very well done, coherent post. Couldnt have asked for a better response. :thumbsup:

In fact, I'll even go so far as to even agree with you for all intents and purposes. If we are in fact talking about the 'true spirit' of death metal in a sense, relatively speaking, then you're absolutely correct. I realise I myself referred to them as tech death simply just because its become such an accepted label but even in the midst of my thoughts I pondered the fact that they really dont sound very much like death metal when it comes down to it. It is in fact, different and probably shouldnt be so commonly associated with the genre. I think I understand where you guys are coming from now.


Thank you, that's at least my personal reason for the more than natural hate for a band which in all fairness make music worthy of at least 30%-40%. I'm not sure if my reasoning applies to everyone, some people may just really really hate their music.
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The_Orphanizer
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 1:07 am 
 

lord_ghengis wrote:
The problem with Necrophagist is that their music has no resemblance to death metal, it's like some kind of speed prog which pretends to be brutal by adding blast beats and growls.

That's an interesting take on the genre, one I'd never really thought of before, but I can certainly agree with it, to an extent; this coming from a fan of the genre.
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lord_ghengis
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 1:14 am 
 

Thats what I love about old school tech death, it still holds on to all the death metal values, while adding in a bit of extra showyness. Early Cryptopsy, Suffocation, early Groguts, Demilich are all amongst my favourite music, I think that may be why I find the destruction on what was once such a magnificent genre so horrible and unbearable.
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MazeofTorment
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 1:25 am 
 

Demilich, fuck yes. I still cant believe I managed to catch them live a few years ago during their last hurrah. They are what I like to refer to as 'real' technical death metal. So far ahead of their time and of any band in general really. So many years later and they still managed to sound picture perfect live, vocals and all. It was really quite a magnificent thing to see.
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latinfiestacarnage
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Joined: Wed May 02, 2007 8:27 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 1:40 am 
 

Noctambulant is a great album. Good tech death!
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HowDisgusting
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 2:16 am 
 

Atrocity - Todessehnsucht

that's a REAL tech-death album.
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ThrashingMad
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Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2007 3:47 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 2:41 am 
 

HowDisgusting wrote:
Atrocity - Todessehnsucht

that's a REAL tech-death album.


Monstrosity's second, amirite?

Never really liked SoP; not unbearable but rather bland and just unremarkable.

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Anonymoose
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 5:09 am 
 

spawn of possession gets two thumbs up from me and i eagerly await a new album.

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SculptedCold
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 6:06 am 
 

On Cabinet, I found the serpentine, chunky riffage and frenetic vocals united with the somewhat psychological lyrical themes into a molten fury of supernatural audio terror.

Noctambulant has too many moments where the songs fall away into dirges of atonal flurrying for my liking. Not that Cabinet was chock-full of melody, but they seemed to forget about narrative altogether on some of Nocambulant's tracks.

Shame too; the lyrical execution was, again, pretty direct. If not altogether original.

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Karnstein_Records
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 8:23 am 
 

lord_ghengis wrote:
Karnstein_Records wrote:
lord_ghengis wrote:
tech death bands of the last 10 years don't know the first thing about death metal.


Please tell me the first thing about death metal. I'm very interested to know what it is.


The first thing about death metal is that it should be death metal. Something that somehow escapes hundreds of bands.


This is a very helpful and intelligent response. Thank you.

So in other words you're talking out of your ass and you have no real answer?
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lord_ghengis
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 8:37 am 
 

Allow me to say it again a little more clearly while removing the whole "All bands in the last 10 years thing", clearly I don't mean every single band.

Most of the bands taking from this whole Necrophagist, SoP and the like style of tech death don't actually play music that has any real similarity with death metal. Hell, even the non-total wankfest bands such as Psycroptic don't really have a lot of the essential elements of the genre in their sound, but my comment is certainly more aimed at the SoP's and Brain Drills of the world. Thus the first thing about being death metal is actually being death metal, which a lot of these bands just plain aren't.
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Karnstein_Records
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 8:47 am 
 

lord_ghengis wrote:
essential elements of the genre


Elaborate
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lord_ghengis
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 9:19 am 
 

Well, that requires are more stringent discussion on what defines death metal as what it is. I lack the actual words to describe the riffing style, but there is certainly a way that a death metal riff is written that makes it a death metal riff, as opposed to a thrash metal riff, or a black metal riff. I'm not a musician, I simply don't know how to describe in a technically proficient way a death metal riff is formulated, I just don't have the words to describe it. All I can say is that the way a real DM riff is made is completely different to the scales and other things that these bands rely on, the music itself is of a different style. DM is more than just blastbeats and growling, and for much of the time, that's the only similarity.
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Rottenrectum
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 11:05 am 
 

Dedicated fans of old school death metal usually dislikes modern because it's an entirely different take on the music. Old school is more simplistic, raw, putrid, rotten and riff based, while modern is a lot more polished and focused on intensity, brutality and technicality. Since death metal fans view the music as important to them, they don't want the opposite side of the spectrum to infest their dearly beloved music, hence Necrophagist is not a death metal band and instead some "speedy prog band with growling and blast beats".
Now I'm not a fan of Necrophagist, always disliked the music since the first time I heard it, but it is none the less a death metal band. They just doesn't float my turds.

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thomash
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 12:11 pm 
 

Look, I'm not saying that fans of old-school death metal have to like the new stuff but I just don't understand arguments that state that there is 'no similarity' between the new and old styles. The question is not really one of musical characteristics but of degree; new technical and brutal death metal features not only blast-beats and growls but also riff structures and rhythmic sensibilities that are similar to and derived from early death metal. As far as I can tell, there is a clear spectrum of sounds and styles within death metal.

I can only conclude that criticism of new death metal is based on a distortion of what it is. Sure, new death metal likes to add a lot of speed and technicality - signature changes, more extensive chromaticism, and, of course, more displays of technical skill - but that doesn't change the fact that the foundation upon which the music is built is the same. The point, then, is that the new stuff is death metal, regardless of any valid or invalid criticisms of the style. Anyway, that's my two cents on the issue.

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lord_ghengis
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2009 6:49 pm 
 

Rottenrectum wrote:
Dedicated fans of old school death metal usually dislikes modern because it's an entirely different take on the music. Old school is more simplistic, raw, putrid, rotten and riff based, while modern is a lot more polished and focused on intensity, brutality and technicality. Since death metal fans view the music as important to them, they don't want the opposite side of the spectrum to infest their dearly beloved music, hence Necrophagist is not a death metal band and instead some "speedy prog band with growling and blast beats".
Now I'm not a fan of Necrophagist, always disliked the music since the first time I heard it, but it is none the less a death metal band. They just doesn't float my turds.


The thing is, I'm not saying modern death metal isn't metal, it's just this wanky modern TECH death. Modern DM, while lacking all of those elements of rawness and vileness, is still death metal. While I may dislike the fact it doesn't sound sinister in the slightest, it's still death metal. It's this higher octave noodling bullshit which completely removes the riffs.

Hell, I'm not even an old school dm fan, I preferred the transitional period in the mid 90s which actually brought in a lot of those faster, more technical elements. As I've already mentioned in my post about early tech death, it added those elements that are associated with modern tech death but still was firmly rooted in death metal. What the Necrophagist type bands have done is that they've taken the speed and technicality ideas so far that they've lost the actual death metal under the sound. Where bands like Psycroptic and Decapitated (After the first album, which is actually awesome) have still retained a heap of modern dm influence. It's not that I don't like the DM that the newer shredy wanky bands are playing, I just can't hear that there is any.
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