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bloodonthewax
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2008 5:45 pm
Posts: 16
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:08 pm 
 

I've heard this term a lot, but never really understood it. From what I understand, the only difference is that "raw" equals "shitty production values".
Can someone please explain?
Thanks.
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CircleovZaphyan
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:10 am
Posts: 300
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:22 pm 
 

That, and guitar tone.

A band sounding like Dimmu or Wolven Ancestry wouldnt necessarily be "raw" if all that was different about their recordings was having shitty production. Nah mean?

Vlad Tepes or Warloghe are great examples of raw.


And watch out. The thread lock happy mods will get their panties in a bunch for this not being in the designated bm help thread.

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shecriedyoucaved
Metal newbie

Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2007 5:32 pm
Posts: 77
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:22 pm 
 

I’ve always considered “raw” black metal to be black metal with:

- poor production (which can be a good thing, as it can create a great atmosphere if done correctly)
- a lack of “symphonic” elements like liberal synthesizer use, female vocals, violins, etc.

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MaDTransilvanian
Caravan Beyond Redemption

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2007 12:56 pm
Posts: 3862
Location: Romania
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:41 pm 
 

That, and as was previously said, guitar tone. The fuzzier the sound, the rawer the black metal is basically. It obviously has to be traditional BM with no exterior elements (except maybe in the album intro/outro).

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CountBlagorath
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2008 7:11 pm
Posts: 1042
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:24 pm 
 

The term is used WAY too much. MaDTransilvanian is correct.
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mrchris
Metalhead

Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 7:32 pm
Posts: 950
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:26 pm 
 

Would Forest of Fog be considered on the rawish side?
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CircleovZaphyan
Metal newbie

Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:10 am
Posts: 300
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:45 pm 
 

mrchris wrote:
Would Forest of Fog be considered on the rawish side?


I took a listen to the songs on their/his Myspace and I wouldnt say so. I wouldnt expect anything very raw at all from a guy who plays in Eluveitie. I kinda liked what I heard though.


Last edited by CircleovZaphyan on Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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jesusbathe
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 4:58 pm
Posts: 160
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:45 pm 
 

CircleovZaphyan wrote:
That, and guitar tone.

A band sounding like Dimmu or Wolven Ancestry wouldnt necessarily be "raw" if all that was different about their recordings was having shitty production. Nah mean?

Vlad Tepes or Warloghe are great examples of raw.


And watch out. The thread lock happy mods will get their panties in a bunch for this not being in the designated bm help thread.


Huh...Since when have wolven ancestry used good production? I always found their guitar tone to be quite raw and 'fuzzy'.
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Kruel
Veteran

Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:56 pm
Posts: 3426
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 7:46 pm 
 

CircleovZaphyan wrote:
And watch out. The thread lock happy mods will get their panties in a bunch for this not being in the designated bm help thread.

No, since the BM help thread is no longer in existence.

But they might lock it, and rightfully so, for this same exact topic has been done quite a few times already. For example...

http://www.metal-archives.com/board/vie ... p?p=928700

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bloodonthewax
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2008 5:45 pm
Posts: 16
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 8:57 pm 
 

Thanks all :)

Why did the BM help thread get removed?
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Alocer7138r
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2008 7:55 pm
Posts: 169
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 9:01 pm 
 

What thats a damn shame... those threads were very helpful.

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SladeCraven
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed May 21, 2008 1:51 pm
Posts: 390
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 9:03 pm 
 

Alocer7138r wrote:
What thats a damn shame... those threads were very helpful.


I concur.
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the16th6toothson
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 7:48 pm
Posts: 1007
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 9:08 pm 
 

yes WHY did the Black and Death metal help threads get removed?

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Kruel
Veteran

Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:56 pm
Posts: 3426
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 9:15 pm 
 

They just disappeared due to the site crash. The mods did not decided to delete those threads.

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the16th6toothson
Metalhead

Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 7:48 pm
Posts: 1007
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 9:16 pm 
 

excellent so the idea of a resurrection would be frowned upon or....???

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DaBuddha
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:30 pm
Posts: 1295
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 12:37 am 
 

I wouldn't say it's based on guitar tone or production all the time. I'd consider Behexen (at least before the last full length) to be raw black metal, and they had a good production and non-fuzzy tone.
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christianmetalsite
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 9:31 pm
Posts: 7
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 1:35 pm 
 

raw black metal is more thrashy
and dosent stop for breaks or breakdowns
it dosent start or stop in a slow man either

its a lot of double bass
cymbal crashes
and snare hits
along with that black metal guitar sound we love
playing over and over the same simple tune
and black metal vocals

tada raw black metal

=|

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DisembowelMe
Metalhead

Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2007 10:59 am
Posts: 528
Location: Iceland
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 2:58 pm 
 

christianmetalsite wrote:
its a lot of double bass
cymbal crashes
and snare hits
and black metal vocals

tada raw black metal

=|


BEST MUSICAL DESCRIPTION EVER

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red_blood_inside
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2007 6:20 pm
Posts: 485
Location: Argentina
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 5:21 pm 
 

the later Antaeus "Blood Libels" has a great prod. and I consider it raw as fuck, but I might be wrong...
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DaBuddha
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:30 pm
Posts: 1295
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 5:33 pm 
 

red_blood_inside wrote:
the later Antaeus "Blood Libels" has a great prod. and I consider it raw as fuck, but I might be wrong...


I'd also consider this raw black metal.
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Open gates to darker lands
We spread our wings and fly away

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redeemerofchaos
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2008 11:14 pm
Posts: 42
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 6:15 pm 
 

christianmetalsite wrote:
raw black metal is more thrashy
and dosent stop for breaks or breakdowns
it dosent start or stop in a slow man either

its a lot of double bass
cymbal crashes
and snare hits
along with that black metal guitar sound we love
playing over and over the same simple tune
and black metal vocals

tada raw black metal

=|


You obviously don't know anything about raw black metal. There is much better structured black metal than the average Darkthrone worship band.

btw. You're christian, what would you know?

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MaDTransilvanian
Caravan Beyond Redemption

Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2007 12:56 pm
Posts: 3862
Location: Romania
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 6:20 pm 
 

What a nice little troll/idiot we're picked up here in that little christian boy.

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LVB
Metal newbie

Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2008 11:26 am
Posts: 142
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 6:21 pm 
 

Oneword:
Deathcrush.

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Asguard
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:10 am
Posts: 29
Location: El Salvador
PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 1:15 am 
 

The raw black metal is -in one word- a use of distorted guitars many riffs an atmospheric ambient and many bands decide don't use Vocals like The Rusting Of The Leaves

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marktheviktor
Metal freak

Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:41 am
Posts: 6888
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 4:47 am 
 

When I think of raw black metal, Antaeus comes to mind. Pure power chords and boookoo distortion. I love me some raw black metal sound.

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red_blood_inside
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2007 6:20 pm
Posts: 485
Location: Argentina
PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 7:54 am 
 

So, it seems that Antaeus is indeed raw BM, and has great prod values, so I think that raw BM has to do with the intensity of the music, hateful atmosphere, not use of other instruments but the tipical guitar, bass and drums, and of course, no melodic elements, or at least not constant use of catchy moments, am I far from the definition?
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marktheviktor
Metal freak

Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:41 am
Posts: 6888
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 8:16 am 
 

red_blood_inside wrote:
So, it seems that Antaeus is indeed raw BM, and has great prod values, so I think that raw BM has to do with the intensity of the music, hateful atmosphere, not use of other instruments but the tipical guitar, bass and drums, and of course, no melodic elements, or at least not constant use of catchy moments, am I far from the definition?



Indeed. There isn't a morsel of melody to be found in Antaeus' music or many bands of those sorts to qualify.

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Morzoft
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:35 pm
Posts: 13
Location: Taiwan
PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:50 am 
 

Katharsis is another great example of raw black metal.

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KingVold
Metalhead

Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2008 10:05 am
Posts: 1082
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 12:59 pm 
 

The best example of raw black metal is maniac butcher. The production si nso shitty you cant hear anything over the muck.

But they are really good.

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DaBuddha
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:30 pm
Posts: 1295
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 3:41 pm 
 

KingVold wrote:
The best example of raw black metal is maniac butcher. The production si nso shitty you cant hear anything over the muck.

But they are really good.


Wait, are you saying Maniac Butcher have shitty production? I have all their albums and even the debut (Barbarians) has good production for such an underground band.
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