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Nolan_B
In League With Nolan

Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 10:05 pm
Posts: 4365
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:26 am 
 

Admittedly, you could say that I am a closed minded metalhead. No other genre really does it for me like metal (except for proto-metal like Blue Cheer and Deep Purple). I honestly cannot tell you why, but the music I am mainly interested in is always primitive and fucking loud.

Occasionally I will listen to a band like Pink Floyd, Jethro Tull, The Doors, or Led Zeppelin, but not nearly as much as Bathory, Sarcofago, or Venom.

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grindon
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 57
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:28 am 
 

Aside from some 70s rock, I am a close minded metalhead. But it's more because I over analyze shit. I focus too much on structure and such in music, and if a song's structure is too poppy sounding (like 99 percent of music, including radio), it aggrivates the shit out of me.

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Kruel
Veteran

Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:56 pm
Posts: 3426
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:29 am 
 

That's not over-analyzing.

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chrislyles15
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 9:08 pm
Posts: 744
Location: Aumsville, Oregon
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:35 am 
 

I have been listening to Metal practically since I was born. I have found that no matter how we try, we will always be persecuted. Why? because our music is labeled a creation of evil and a noise pollution. It is our blessing and our curse. All we can do is remember that we are metalheads united and that no matter what, since the days of Sabbath, Purple, Zep, and Blue Cheer, metal has weathered every storm. When all is said and done, we always win because we love metal so much and always stick with it.

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grindon
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 57
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:37 am 
 

Those who act persecuted obviously love the attention.

Let it go and listen to metal. Unless your image is the most important thing to you.

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agentsteel666
(Short) Buspass Holder

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:45 pm
Posts: 456
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:41 am 
 

chrislyles15 wrote:
I have been listening to Metal practically since I was born. I have found that no matter how we try, we will always be persecuted. Why? because our music is labeled a creation of evil and a noise pollution. It is our blessing and our curse. All we can do is remember that we are metalheads united and that no matter what, since the days of Sabbath, Purple, Zep, and Blue Cheer, metal has weathered every storm. When all is said and done, we always win because we love metal so much and always stick with it.


Well at least we are united and stand for a specific style of music, whereas most other people are really divided in their tastes. What I'm saying is you wont' find like 1,000 people outside a Jazz festival screaming "JAZZ, JAZZ, JAZZ IS THE BEST...OMG JAZZ IS KING OF ALL MUSIC"...actually what's ironic is that you'd probably find a bunch of metalheads in that crowd haha.

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grindon
Metal newbie

Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:43 pm
Posts: 57
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:43 am 
 

Seeing as how alot of metal as we know were inspired by the old days of jazz. Like the first double bass pedal. And the blast beat.

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Nolan_B
In League With Nolan

Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 10:05 pm
Posts: 4365
Location: United States
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 1:47 am 
 

grindon wrote:
Those who act persecuted obviously love the attention.

Let it go and listen to metal. Unless your image is the most important thing to you.

Yeah, metalheads aren't persecuted anymore than any other fans.

Jazz kids are persecuted for being "nerds".
Pop fans are persecuted for being mainstream kiddies.

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saintinhell
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:19 am
Posts: 1426
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:51 am 
 

Haven't gone through the whole thread so this is a general post and not directed at any specific posts. There is nothing wrong per se in focusing on a specific style of music and this is not dependent on whether or not you listen to and appreciate different styles of music. I don't think that person in question would object to a person playing classical piano solo for 20 years - it's classical and this is JUST metal, or so the line of thinking goes. Having said that, I do think a lot of metalheads go around with dogmatic ideas about music that may not have any reasonable basis other than metal fanaticism and fanaticism is hardly a reasonable thing. Lot of metalheads tend to be intolerant to the use of acoustic guitar, not to mention any music that uses instruments other than guitar, as also to styles of singing that don't fit into the metal stereotype. This is not a problem in itself, until you start forcing similar thinking on everyone in your circle and informally excommunicate those who don't agree, which metalheads do quite a lot and not surprisingly get labelled close-minded in the process.

I have been listening almost exclusively to progressive music for the last two months or so and I have been told I must get off the prog phase because I have stuck with it for too long and there is considerable wonderment at how a metalhead can listen to prog for so long and even shut himself off metal in doing so. When people ask how can I listen to just prog, I have a good mind sometimes to retort, "Same way you've been listening to metal all the time, dude." :lol: But I don't like to breed unpleasant vibes for no good reason, so I hold my tongue. I find it amusing that people should grapple so much over the idea of wanting to explore different melodies and different structures and different ideas and different thoughts, because that's the only way I have always listened to music, it's not some kind of candy that I taste just because it feels nice in the mouth, it's a much more consuming and obsessive pursuit for me.

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chrislyles15
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 9:08 pm
Posts: 744
Location: Aumsville, Oregon
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 4:12 am 
 

grindon wrote:
Those who act persecuted obviously love the attention.

Let it go and listen to metal. Unless your image is the most important thing to you.


That's exactly my point. We don't need to worry about being persecuted because those who do always sell out and start listening to popular music, but those of us who have a "Fuck you" attitude and stick with Metal will always know they win.

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saintinhell
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:19 am
Posts: 1426
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 4:34 am 
 

chrislyles15 wrote:
grindon wrote:
Those who act persecuted obviously love the attention.

Let it go and listen to metal. Unless your image is the most important thing to you.


That's exactly my point. We don't need to worry about being persecuted because those who do always sell out and start listening to popular music, but those of us who have a "Fuck you" attitude and stick with Metal will always know they win.


Why bring win or lose into the discussion? Didn't know music was a competitive sport. :scratch: It makes me very sad to see hardcore fans of genres be so hostile to each other, but what do I know.

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Acrobat
Eric Olthwaite

Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:53 am
Posts: 6717
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 5:33 am 
 

Did nobody tell you? MA in itself is a race to see who can name drop the most obscure bands, I'm currently losing as the most underground act I can name is Def Leppard. But one day I hope to be able to recommend quasi-opague-speed-half-thrash-Siberian bands in the Heavy metal help thread.
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saintinhell
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:19 am
Posts: 1426
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 7:42 am 
 

ANationalAcrobat wrote:
Did nobody tell you? MA in itself is a race to see who can name drop the most obscure bands, I'm currently losing as the most underground act I can name is Def Leppard. But one day I hope to be able to recommend quasi-opague-speed-half-thrash-Siberian bands in the Heavy metal help thread.


:lol: It is quite telling though that DL's entire discography - and probably Rainbow and probably Scorpions - has fewer reviews here than say Agalloch.

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DGYDP
Leather Lion

Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2007 12:19 pm
Posts: 1244
Location: Belgium
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 7:54 am 
 

ANationalAcrobat wrote:
Did nobody tell you? MA in itself is a race to see who can name drop the most obscure bands, I'm currently losing as the most underground act I can name is Def Leppard. But one day I hope to be able to recommend quasi-opague-speed-half-thrash-Siberian bands in the Heavy metal help thread.


There's actually some truth in that, but I think it's for different reasons. People assume that everybody already knows the famous bands, so they generally don't mention that ... that's when you wind up with most of the people mentioning only ultra-obscure five-copy demo's. So I don't think it's a "who's the most obscure" competition at all, though perhaps for some exceptions that may be true.
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Acrobat
Eric Olthwaite

Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:53 am
Posts: 6717
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:03 am 
 

saintinhell wrote:
ANationalAcrobat wrote:
Did nobody tell you? MA in itself is a race to see who can name drop the most obscure bands, I'm currently losing as the most underground act I can name is Def Leppard. But one day I hope to be able to recommend quasi-opague-speed-half-thrash-Siberian bands in the Heavy metal help thread.


:lol: It is quite telling though that DL's entire discography - and probably Rainbow and probably Scorpions - has fewer reviews here than say Agalloch.


It is really. I guess the DL one is understandable as even their 'metal' stuff isn't heavy and they just kind of got thrown under the umbrella of NWOBHM. Still I think High N Dry is a great record, though again, not a metal one. They do get a lot of stigma attached to them because of their latter works. The same with the Scorpions, people just think Winds of Change and if that was the first Scorps song I'd have heard I wouldn't have checked out more!

Rainbow is the one that stands out the most from those you mentioned. They had fucking Dio in the band so I can't see why they don't get more attention. Hell even hells_unicorn hasn't reviewed them and he's a big Dio fan. The amount of influence that stuff had on modern PM can not be overstated. And to top it off those first three records are corkers!

Tellingly, I had reviews for DL, Scorps and Rainbow at one point. But I took them down cuz they sucked.

DGYDP - you have a point, though this is not always a case. I remember a month or so back, people were talking about Pentagram (rightly so!) and other doom bands and it turned out some of them hadn't even heard the first 6 Sabbath albums! Also I've been asked whether I actually am a national acrobat (so they didn't know the song!). People don't always start with the most famous stuff, some don't start with the 'classics' either.
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Axel_Sikth
Metalhead

Joined: Wed May 07, 2008 9:30 am
Posts: 910
Location: Hong Kong
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:03 am 
 

saintinhell wrote:
Why bring win or lose into the discussion? Didn't know music was a competitive sport. :scratch: It makes me very sad to see hardcore fans of genres be so hostile to each other, but what do I know.


Yeah, I agree, bringing up the concept of competition wasn't entirely necessary, but I'll have you know, the music industry is probably one of the most competitive industries out there. I assure you, if the music business placed more emphasis on music instead of business, metal bands would be in a much better position, financially speaking. I don't think it's unusual for bands to buckle under label pressure and commercialize their sound in an effort to draw in more fans. Of course, my respect for them as artists might decrease, but we're not living in a reality that allows metal bands to put out a record with a thousand-dollar production cost, go out on tour without paying a cent, and come home with truckloads of cash.

@ Dechripastocide

Wasn't necessary of you to requote that post. I read it the first time. My stance remains the same. Although The_Emo_Hater seems to have even further solidified my position with his post in response to Zetan's. I understand no one here enjoys being told to be "open-minded" but I like I said, I wouldn't want to hear someone flaunting his close-mindedness either. The_Emo_Hater has already established his distaste for nu metal and metalcore but taking potshots at those genres is a bit unnecessary.

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saintinhell
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:19 am
Posts: 1426
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:20 am 
 

Axel_Sikth wrote:
saintinhell wrote:
Why bring win or lose into the discussion? Didn't know music was a competitive sport. :scratch: It makes me very sad to see hardcore fans of genres be so hostile to each other, but what do I know.


Yeah, I agree, bringing up the concept of competition wasn't entirely necessary, but I'll have you know, the music industry is probably one of the most competitive industries out there. I assure you, if the music business placed more emphasis on music instead of business, metal bands would be in a much better position, financially speaking. I don't think it's unusual for bands to buckle under label pressure and commercialize their sound in an effort to draw in more fans. Of course, my respect for them as artists might decrease, but we're not living in a reality that allows metal bands to put out a record with a thousand-dollar production cost, go out on tour without paying a cent, and come home with truckloads of cash.



Oh, the way the music industry is run is a different rant altogether but while I can understand bands and musicians feeling a wee bit possessive and defensive about their work, I don't know what to make of fans treating it as a "With us or against us" thing. It's not, at least that's what I think.

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Axel_Sikth
Metalhead

Joined: Wed May 07, 2008 9:30 am
Posts: 910
Location: Hong Kong
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:24 am 
 

"With us or against us" thing? What do you mean exactly?

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saintinhell
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:19 am
Posts: 1426
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:25 am 
 

ANationalAcrobat wrote:

Rainbow is the one that stands out the most from those you mentioned.


And unfortunately, it's backfired on me, I have to get down to reviewing them myself. :P

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saintinhell
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:19 am
Posts: 1426
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:35 am 
 

Axel_Sikth wrote:
"With us or against us" thing? What do you mean exactly?


I mean the tendency of metal fans - not all of them, of course - and indeed hardcore fans of just about every genre to insist that you should not listen to or praise other genres. You can extend this thinking to bands with huge fanbases too. The idea that genres or bands can be warfronts for fans is ...well, I don't know, it doesn't sit pretty with me.

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Acrobat
Eric Olthwaite

Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:53 am
Posts: 6717
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:39 am 
 

saintinhell wrote:
ANationalAcrobat wrote:

Rainbow is the one that stands out the most from those you mentioned.


And unfortunately, it's backfired on me, I have to get down to reviewing them myself. :P


Good stuff, I'll have re-done one for Rising. Man, what a record, I inherited my mum's vinyl version of that. Do some Thin Lizzy while you're at it! (I'm assuming you like them).
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Axel_Sikth
Metalhead

Joined: Wed May 07, 2008 9:30 am
Posts: 910
Location: Hong Kong
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:42 am 
 

I haven't really met any hardcore fan of any genre that has exhibited such behavior. However, I do feel that that kind of mentality is really deconstructive. I suppose that it is possible some people wrongly construe that to be a real fan of a particular genre, they have to disregard every other genre.

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saintinhell
Metalhead

Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:19 am
Posts: 1426
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:48 am 
 

On the archives itself, I remember somebody saying that Rush are metal and he wouldn't stand for anybody calling him a sellout for listening to them. Now why does listening to non-metal music make you a sellout? :scratch: It is even debatable that a band switching to non-metal is ALWAYS a sellout.

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Oflick
Metal newbie

Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:12 am
Posts: 212
Location: Australia
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:59 am 
 

saintinhell wrote:
On the archives itself, I remember somebody saying that Rush are metal and he wouldn't stand for anybody calling him a sellout for listening to them. Now why does listening to non-metal music make you a sellout? :scratch: It is even debatable that a band switching to non-metal is ALWAYS a sellout.


Especially if they were playing relatively commercial metal than switched to some bizarre totally different and uncommercial music.

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Himmlisch
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2006 5:24 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:36 pm 
 

ANationalAcrobat wrote:
Did nobody tell you? MA in itself is a race to see who can name drop the most obscure bands, I'm currently losing as the most underground act I can name is Def Leppard. But one day I hope to be able to recommend quasi-opague-speed-half-thrash-Siberian bands in the Heavy metal help thread.


Ha, ha, ha.. you said it!

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agentsteel666
(Short) Buspass Holder

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:45 pm
Posts: 456
Location: United States of America
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 4:13 pm 
 

"I guess the DL one is understandable as even their 'metal' stuff isn't heavy and they just kind of got thrown under the umbrella of NWOBHM. Still I think High N Dry is a great record, though again, not a metal one."

On through the Night is a metal album IMO. High and Dry and Pyromania are borderline metal. There certainly are some songs that are metal, such as Rock Rock till you Drop.

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Acrobat
Eric Olthwaite

Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2007 8:53 am
Posts: 6717
Location: United Kingdom
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 4:30 pm 
 

The closest they have come is Wasted which still wasn't quite metal (it's something indescripable). But High N Dry was a hard rock record, no doubt about it and Rock Rock Till You Drop was pretty much a straight up AC/DC tribute so that again is rock... hence the title.
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Noier
Mallcore Kid

Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:32 pm
Posts: 15
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:34 pm 
 

I think I'm not a close minded metalhead, I just don't lose time disrespecting other genres and I don't give a damn thing for them. Almost all music genres have a reason to exist.
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MapleKit
34 going on 14

Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:43 pm
Posts: 529
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 8:37 pm 
 

chrislyles15 wrote:
I have been listening to Metal practically since I was born. I have found that no matter how we try, we will always be persecuted. Why? because our music is labeled a creation of evil and a noise pollution. It is our blessing and our curse. All we can do is remember that we are metalheads united and that no matter what, since the days of Sabbath, Purple, Zep, and Blue Cheer, metal has weathered every storm. When all is said and done, we always win because we love metal so much and always stick with it.
Are those the latest Manowar lyrics?

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