https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0EaaKk4eRIc

This interview used to inspire when I was 14 (I guess I'm one of the "use to" guys, according to Averse Sefira), but now coming back to this 6 years later, it's clear that these guys are speaking about the world in such absurdly reductionist terms. I'll stick to their music though. Even if they don't know how to think, they know how to write some evil fuckin riffs.

Anyway, any other bands that have stupid ideologies or embarrassing interviews of this nature?

P.S. Let's avoid Burzum lol

That interview is so cringe worthy hahahaha. I don't understand how anyone of above average intelligence that is over twenty could think like them... it just boggles the mind.

I'd name here a lot of the early Norwegian black metal bands. The ideologies they spoke about were generally rather insipid and plain stupid. However, they were pretty much children at the time and they all seem to have grown out of it. Except Varg but that's just a can of worms really.

Yeah for real. I've got a job interview coming up. I'm definitely gonna dress up like those guys haha.

It's so strange to think of those early Norwegian bands as children! Makes me think of Kids Bop.

A lot of people over twenty just continue to believe more and more ridiculous things. Most of them aren't music stars, obviously, so we aren't likely to hear about it unless they frequent our local bars or whatever. But yeah, Dave Mustaine is one we talk about often on here...
And I'm going to mention Graveland. Not sure what the interviews are like lately (I actually avoid interviews for the most part) but there was some pretty absurd stuff Darken and Capricornus would spout in the 90s. Their music is still great for me, though.

Man that Averse Sefira interview makes me appreciate bands like Deafheaven even more. I may not be the biggest fan of them musically, but at least they totally are aware that they're just dudes in a band and not "agents ov terror" or whatever the hell that interview was supposed to have them come across as.

Didn't read the interview so I don't know how "dumb" it really comes across, but what's so great about guys in a black metal band coming across as "dudes in a band"? I kind of appreciate it when a band like Impaled Nazarene comes off as pretty down to earth but generally BM should swing more the other way...

Yeah there's a happy medium. I mean, my own personal opinion, black metal and darkness (whether it be Satanism, nihilism, etc) go hand and hand but then there's also being down to earth about it. Sammy Duet I think represents that pretty well. He makes no qualms about his beliefs and how serious he is about them and how important they are in his music and black metal in general, but the dude's very down to earth and clearly has a sense of humor just like the other guys in Goatwhore.

That's more or less what I was getting at, just in a terrible way. Black metal should be about darkness and death and yada yada yada, all I'm saying is have the presence of mind to realize it's just entertainment. I'm not saying everyone should go shop at H&M and that let's abandon corpse paint and all that, but goddamn, be an actual human being. I love black metal to death, it's easily my favorite metal style these days, but goddamn if there aren't some tryhard, humorless dolts out there.

One could argue that the second wave of Norwegian Black Metal wouldn't have been half as influential if they had a sense of humor. YOu don't become the Paris Hilton of metal if you're not serious about, uh, being the Paris Hilton of metal.

Yeah, they were so serious all the time, especially the inner circle guys when discussing which corn flakes are the most kvlt: crispy or soft.

Why do you say "they don't know how to think?" They're presenting a concept in a brief, casual context of an interview and what they're saying is coherent.



You're aware that this video is stitched together from many segments and doesn't fully give the context of what was asked and the flow of conversation? They're presenting pieces of their ideology in rather simple, straightforward manner. It's not really reductionist either.



It's interesting that you say they don't know how to think when they simplify pieces of the ideology that drives their music, yet in the same sentence, you acknowledge that their music, which is heavily and solely driven by the ideologies they present, is cogent. Averse Sefira is a band that has made it very clear that their music is ideologically-inspired and driven. They're clowns when someone chops together six minutes of them talking about things related to black metal, but they're making evil fuckin riffs when you take the full presentation of their music! I'd credit their music as a whole over just the riffs - a holistic perspective, rather than an absurdly reductionist one.



I also appreciate it when black metal bands look like a J.Crew catalog rather than trying to convey the same ideologies and motivations that shaped their music. Maybe Deafheaven's music *is* about a J.Crew catalog!

They created a mystique around themselves that was only possible if you were serious enough. Burning churches or killing guys sounds like someone either believed something crazy or wanted others to believe they believed something crazy.

I think a respectable portion of that second-wave mystique came from the comparative lack of internet/media presence too. There weren't really any metal news sites to dig up information on their lives outside the band, less forum-driven discussion that would pick apart their "mystery" and thus bring their presence down to mere human levels (and that's not a dig at here or any other forum, just an observation), and the limited exposure they got via the odd magazine/word of mouth/album trade probably made it a lot easier to create and maintain that "evil" atmosphere. Just looking at the Averse Sefira discussion here makes me wonder how the atmosphere of the Euronymous-driven Mayhem would have fared in the age of r/metal, MetalSucks and the like.

Wolves in the Throneroom

Mainly because of their left-winged feminist political view.

The second wave Norwegians did indeed carry with them a certain mysterious appeal, but it's not true that individuals in the scene didn't have a sense of humour. Fenriz always did, and even Varg cracked jokes in interviews from time to time. Infernus from Gorgoroth made me laugh with his statements about "kicking nuns in the head" from the original Antichrist insert, etc.

But a guy having a sense of humour shouldn't at all suggest he doesn't take his music or ideology seriously. I don't reallys ee taht it matters, anyway..they're not here to "be funny!" for us.

On stage black metal should be intense and reflect perhaps some of the ideologies... however the 'act' of insisting that persona in person when all theatrics of stage presence are over can be tedious and annoying.
Reality is simply the law of the land we are all subjected to. Arguments can be laid what is right or wrong etc etc, however we are all subject to them or dare face consequence... now for the spiritual side............ um, yea. People believe, can believe, and DO believe all manner of absolute crazy ass nonsense in total defiance of science or what on the surface would seem our 'reality'

Cool people and fanatical people though... always a line to draw and divide between the two. Fanatics are dangerous no matter how insane or helpful their nonsense is.

Well, even though it was all an act, Euronymous was a total asshole. Just read his interviews.

And what do you mean by that, exactly?

That's a very good point. So is it safe to say none of the crazy views mentioned around here will make a splash as big as the second-wave?

it's a tough decision for me - i personally have *zero* interest in these kinds of ideologies and do cringe when i see interviews like that averse sefira one (i've never listened to them anyway), but i also understand that a lot of this crap comes with the territory, particular when you're talking about black metal. the genre attracts weirdo ideologues, but at the same time, without their wacky ideas black metal wouldn't be the same thing it is today. haha wait, that's not necessarily a bad thing. what i mean is, a lot of classic albums probably wouldn't exist without said weirdos.

on a non-bm note, MANOWAR: joey's "the enemies of metal are out there!" schtick is possibly the most annoying thing ever in heavy metal. listening to him rant and rave about how these completely non-existent "enemies of metal" are constantly trying to stop their shows and somehow *silence* him from telling us the truth, from bestowing his musical gift upon "the best motherfucking fans in the motherfucking world" and so on.... it's so fucking stupid, i almost explode every time. i went to their magic circle festival in 2008, in a small town (a dorf in every sense of the word) called bad arolsen, and if anything the locals were reeeeaaally happy to have some money pumped into their local economy, and they were all able to set up little stalls in their front gardens, taxi drunk metalheads around the place, and enjoy a weekend where something exciting/out of the ordinary happened in their little corner of the world. joey still fucking ranted and raved about the "enemies of metal" trying to shut the festival down, of course...

Meh, I enjoy the Manowar ramblings but I think it's just for the show. I understand that it goes old really fast, anyways.

More on thread, most musicians aren't well versed on history/political sciences/sociology/whatever, so I don't pay attention to their views, and I often wonder why someone would. Any kind of left-winged nonsense, just like Batakanda said, Wolves for example, sort of bothers me but that's me, and it's not that common in metal (like in punk).

And I understand Mustaine. I mean, he's old and was an addict for so long, he has to replace that for something and religion just works. He always was a dick, being a dick about religion now only makes sense.

When has Wolves in the Throne Room ever said a word about feminism? As for their ecology stuff, I don't understand why that is considered a left-wing view. What the hell is left-wing about living self-sufficient off the grid?

It's because our right-wing capitalists want everyone to work for them so that they can profit from the working man. Can you imagine how much money they would lose if everyone would become self-sufficient?

And no, I don't consider myself to be left nor right-wing.

You're right, although I enjoy the mysterious appeal more than I do their sense of humour.



Apparently, Batakanda would rather be a fucking slave for the rest of his life.

As for WIITR, for some time they considered themselves eco-fascists but they currently disregard the term: http://www.editorialconsignment.com/201 ... heads.html

I am ambivalent about ideology in music. I am perfectly nonreligious in my every day life and have been for a very long time, so it is natural for me to ignore or dismiss outright any religious ideology of a band irrespective of the specific religion in question, be it Christian or Jewish or Satanic or whatnot. That being said, I feel like ideologies firmly grounded in the "real" world---any sort of political ideology, whether left wing or Nazi or whatever, regardless of how ridiculous it is---make for emptier, less meaningful music. They aren't as satisfying. Music is an art of aura, not a physical thing you can touch like paint or carving, and trying to ground that in something more tangible almost seems to diminish the art form to me. So regardless of how crazy a belief like orthodox satanism or paganism is, I feel like such a spiritual concept makes for more fulfilling music.

The black legions and other bands in that corner.
Although I'm just 21 and obliviously never experienced the true peak of those bands (and other second wave black metal bands) I think I can understand how it was back then.
I am a real big fan of those old school dark, hateful nihilistic bands, and the atmosphere of their themes are really great. The romantic visions of the black metal world are really great to sink in once and a while. But the fact that those guys took them self that seriously in real life is just absurd.

How do you know how "seriously" they to Do you know more about the guys in the Black Legions than the rest of us? enlighten us.ok themselves?

Well I take their attitude in interviews as a clue that they take (took) them self pretty serious.
Maybe it's well known that it's all an act, I don't know.

Acrimonious and Thy Darkened Shade make some of the best black metal in the world right now, but they take their occult beliefs (the same shit Dissection was into) so seriously I can't even read interviews with them. I once got this email from one of their supporters after a review:



Oh... ok.

Regardless of your beliefs, the point the supporter makes is very valid.

Why is it having spiritual beliefs more stupid than having extreme political ideologies?

I am quite leanient on different ideologies or spiritual messages in music as long as they are brought forth artistically and in a tasteful manner. Great examples of stupid lyrics however often comes with the whole mentality behind "christraping black metal" for example or vivid desciptions of racial hatered in RAC-music. In the case of black metal it is one thing to try to be intelligent like Ihsahn on one hand or to just write about murdering christians and burning churches on the other.

A personal dislike is the MLO/TotBL bands. Not only do I dislike the fact that they were clearly jumping on the bandwagon after Jon's release from prison but also because they try to dress up their ideology with garments that does not fit. The basis of their cosmology or metaphysics are banal and pretty infantile but they have dressed it up with fancy language and tried to connect pre-existing religious traditions and claim them to hold the same views the TotBL does. For anyone who knows anything on mesopotamian religion, ancient egyptian religion or vamachara realize that most of what these anti-cosmic satanists proclaim in relation to these traditions are false. Does it bother me that they do it? Not in regards to themselves. They are free to delude themselves. However I do not like it when their influence stretches out and tries to redefine things not just in their own heads but also in others.



I'm guessing that to one of the modern atheists spiritual beliefs in general are more stupid because they deny the very existence of the spiritual. They see it as something non-real. Political ideologies on the other hand obviously concerns aspects of society that most people know and recognize as real. So even if a political ideology is wrong it at least deals with something real while religion do not. Now this is not my perspective but this is how I think someone would answer your question.

Atheists are generally supposed to be smarter than religious fanatics, so they should recognize flawed political ideologies, but if they don't then they're no better than the religious people they criticize.

No.

They're smart enough not to be religious fanatics.

And being political fanatics makes them smarter? Fuck logic I guess...

Personally, I think both are pretty much equally absurd.

I have met plenty of superb and intelligent religious people. The same goes for atheists. I have also met plenty of stupid religious people. That too goes for atheists. I dont think intelligence is measured in our belief in god or gods. Stupid people appear everywhere regardless of beliefs. It is a part of the human condition.

^ What he said.

SO you would feel better knowing it was an act? I don't really understand. I would think that would somewhat diminish them. That's precisely why bands like the Black legions circle never did many interviews, I expect.