Encyclopaedia Metallum: The Metal Archives :: View topic - CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread

I recognise your wordpress avatar from Discogs too :nods:

Yeah... that font gives it away. It's pretty much as I said in my previous post though, DOP still has a very interesting resell value, thus making it more prone to bootlegging. MC not nearly as much.

In other news, it seems like this house is mine and dreadmeat's! as we're virtually the only ones replying all the time... :-D

Please stay longer, i probably will have more question.

By the way - did You bought Ghoul CD from me on Discogs?

In other news, it seems like this house is mine and dreadmeat's! as we're virtually the only ones replying all the time... :-D

In other news, it seems like this house is mine and dreadmeat's! as we're virtually the only ones replying all the time... :-D

androdion wrote:

In other news, it seems like this house is mine and dreadmeat's! as we're virtually the only ones replying all the time... :-D

Is it possible that one of this SETHERIAL - Nord | 1996 Napalm Records is a bootleg? I have both copies and wanted to dispose one of them. Just making sure because I don't want to keep the wrong or probably a bootleg copy in my collection.

White Logo Print - CD Matrix: 03071108 NPR 017 eruditus +49 (0) 245191250 [Without SID codes]
Silver Logo Print - CD Matrix: DADC Austria A0100184477-0101 13 A0 IFPI L553

The album was released in 1996 and judging by the absence of SID code on the White Print Version, is it possible that this one may be a boot?

There was an old thread regarding this one here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=71177 , but no sure comments/replies were posted.

Any help/comments from the masters - androdion/dreadmeat?

Horns Up!

New question:
just got Order From Chaos / Stillbirth Machine / Crushed Infamy CD by Osmose, CD Matrix is DADC AUSTRIA IFPI L553 A0100247447-0101 12 A0, but booklet is only 4 pages: 1. cover art 2. lyrics of Stillbirth Machine 3. photos + adv. or Helmkamp book 4. band photo.
Is it regular edition or i just got a "promo" instead?

Nokturnel's 'Nothing But Hatred' on JL America

it has no matrix code whatsoever. All other JL America bits I've seen have some sort of matrix code, so thought it was pretty odd. Any thoughts?

My copy has three tiny codes written around the hub: the barcode 7-3815-41015-2 (which is also written much larger on the face of the disc under the JL America logo), something that looks like PILS, and a third number which may be W.O. 62821-3M. My eyes aren't so great at quarter til seven on a Sunday morning, I should add, and these codes, for whatever reason, seem harder to pick out than others I've seen. Strangely, I don't think mine had the mail order card. I remember buying it sealed from a dollar bin with other JL America releases in ... the early 2000's, I think. (Beherit's DDTM and Pyogenesis' Ignis Creatio were the other two I snagged. There were multiple copies of them, it was like a JL America dump. I miss those days of magical music store finds.) Obviously I can't comment on the legitimacy of my copies, as I have no idea where they came from before showing up in a Media Play bargain bin. Here's to hoping.

It would help a lot if you would mention WHICH Gehenna this is supposed to be. If it's the Norwegian one, I didn't find any information about tape like that...

Immolation - Majesty And Decay
COUNTERFEIT bought from http://www.ebay.com/usr/musiccocktail

New release added to Discogs, take a look.
http://www.discogs.com/release/5026588

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Sun Oct 13, 2013 5:23 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Well, first things first. Usually the RR/RC presses have SONOPRESS for the matrix, although there are editions with different matrices depending on where they were pressed (US vs EU) or when (represses). And all RR/RC editions were repressed around 1996 according to what many collectors have been telling over time, can't give you a written piece of text to confirm that so take it with a pinch of salt (although it's basically that, and that's why you find RR/RC albums with SONOPRESS matrices and IFPI codes, which were implemented post-1994). Now, my copy of Retribution is exactly like yours, whereas my copy of TTC is this one. Stillborn I don't own. Your copy of it seems like an actual first press, unless that smudge in the lower side of the inner ring is a SID code (IFPI). Discogs also lists a repress of Stillborn with a "manufactured by optimal media production..." matrix, and coincidently there are no represses listed for Retribution (although they exist), which should be because no one has entered them. Also bear in mind that post-1992 you see a lot of availability for RR/RC editions, and this is mainly because of how distribution increased in Europe. You can see that from Deicide's Legion for instance, which can be found pretty cheap everywhere. So it's only normal that most other albums from that date have more or less the same kind of broader distribution. Now, pre-1992 is where it gets trickier, and mainly when you get into the late eighties/early nineties because there were no major distribution deals between the US and Europe (read: as broad as they would become). I also may be talking out of my ass with this one, but didn't Metal Blade distribute RR/RC calatogue in Europe at that point in time? You find mainly Dutch and German editions when it comes to European presses of that label, so it wouldn't surprise me if such a thing was true. Point is, unless you bought them from a dubious source I sincerely doubt they're bootlegs. DOP's first press still sells for way more than any MC album so that's a good argument to get into bootlegging it, you know?! And just out of curiosity, how do you know your copy is a boot?

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Sun Oct 13, 2013 5:37 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
PS: Just remembered where I got my reassurance at the time I purchased Retribution. Take a look at the pages listed below, I believe all the matrices on your copies are listed there. I suppose if that info is correct they should be European represses (or something...). http://www.musik-sammler.de/album/10968 http://www.musik-sammler.de/album/10965 http://www.musik-sammler.de/album/10967

Author:	dreadmeat [ Sun Oct 13, 2013 7:03 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
They look like represses to me, not originals or "first presses" but still possibly bootlegs, they do appear legitimate, the matrix fonts and SID codes look ok from here. The fact you are in Russia makes it slightly more questionable though, depends where you got them from... "Europe" is a big place Top marks for posting good images

Author:	AcidMind [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:02 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Thanks for answers! Now i feel more or less fine with my MC CDs (still need to find good copy of DOP ) MC CDs comes to me from something like Belgium, i believe. My friend was not into music (especially this kind of), so i just sent him list to check it out in music shops. As to DOP - i figured out that it's bootleg because of matrix (and CD/booklet) looks like bootleg according to discogs (couple of pages ago it was discussed in this topic as well) Spoiler: show

Author:	dreadmeat [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:21 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Can you put up a photo/scan of your copy of Dawn Of Possession?

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Author:	dreadmeat [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:27 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
I recognise your wordpress avatar from Discogs too

Author:	AcidMind [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:02 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
dreadmeat wrote: I recognise your wordpress avatar from Discogs too Yep, they are both me Here are fotos of my copy of DOP Matrix Spoiler: show CD1 Spoiler: show CD2 Spoiler: show P.S. Just noticed that when CD on tray it's not cleat that CD is printed all around the central hole (like on bootleg foto on discogs page).

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 11:01 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Yeah... that font gives it away. It's pretty much as I said in my previous post though, DOP still has a very interesting resell value, thus making it more prone to bootlegging. MC not nearly as much. In other news, it seems like this house is mine and dreadmeat's! as we're virtually the only ones replying all the time...

Author:	AcidMind [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 12:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
androdion wrote: Yeah... that font gives it away. It's pretty much as I said in my previous post though, DOP still has a very interesting resell value, thus making it more prone to bootlegging. MC not nearly as much. In other news, it seems like this house is mine and dreadmeat's! as we're virtually the only ones replying all the time... Please stay longer, i probably will have more question. By the way - did You bought Ghoul CD from me on Discogs?

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:12 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
AcidMind wrote: Please stay longer, i probably will have more question. By the way - did You bought Ghoul CD from me on Discogs? I'm not going anywhere. Well hello Dmitry, aka "TempusNemini". Yeah, I use the same Internet alias pretty much everywhere. Didn't even realize it was you mate! How's it going?! PS: This guy is a really cool seller and everyone should buy shit from him. You can dismiss the bad feedback given by people who just can't seem to wait for orders to arrive.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 5:29 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
androdion wrote: In other news, it seems like this house is mine and dreadmeat's! as we're virtually the only ones replying all the time... Ha ha chur bro! TempusNemini had something I wanted too, I'll just keep my eye on it for now though.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 5:34 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
So this looks legit to you guys aye? it looks the same as the other copies I saw on Ebay The dimple dents on the booklet are slightly different, the table is a different colour and the disc has different markings [specks of dust, small cat hairs etc] Click for ultra mega close up

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 6:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
I was talking with Daemonlord once about an old disc and the basic conclusion was that "old age can't be faked", so take that as you will. To be honest today was the first time I heard about that band, and I have little experience with NR editions pre-97/98. Can't be of any help here.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 6:54 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Dude, you've never heard of Disastrous Murmur?! "old age can't be faked" I like that

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 6:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Can't know them all (and I already know way too many). I've seen what/how they are, but then again I've never liked Pungent Stench, so from the get go I have no big intention on listening to it. Nothing personal.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 7:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
I love all that Austrian stuff Are you going to use that quote in your sig?

Author:	japc [ Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:26 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
I love all that Austrian Disharmonic Orchestra.

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Tue Oct 15, 2013 10:58 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
I think the only Austrian band I listen to is Miasma, which then again is fucking expensive! Why are all death metal classics from that country so pricey?! My sig is like my alias, I always use the same.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:10 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Limited numbers made, small label, obscure band etc I suppose

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:13 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
It was more of a rhetorical question, as in "Oh why?!". I know why.

Author:	dreadmeat [ Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
I have a mate in Austria and his idea of "expensive" is really different to mine, lets just say I may be getting some more of this obscure Austrian stuff in the not too distant future...

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:33 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Find me a copy of Miasma's Changes for an acceptable price and I'll kiss your behind... well, maybe...

Author:	dreadmeat [ Tue Oct 15, 2013 4:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Yeah I want that one too and you can be sure I'll update the respective Discogs pages with full matrix info and scans/photos

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Tue Oct 15, 2013 5:06 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Fuck that, I want my copy!!! Just kidding dude...

Author:	ancientorder [ Wed Oct 16, 2013 3:14 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Beware! There is a bootleg out of ISENGARD's Vinterskugge CD on Deaf Records. Covers are pretty good replicas and it's hard to notice by that. But the matrix on the disc says only "FENRIZ". Anyone who deals with old CD's knows that there is no such version that has matrix like that... Disc itself also has a bit shady print. Matrix however is the best way to identify it. I've encountered this now twice. Once through discogs and yesterday at local 2nd hand record store (which they removed from the sale after I talked about it). Crush the bootleggers!

Author:	AcidMind [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:55 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
New question: just got Order From Chaos / Stillbirth Machine / Crushed Infamy CD by Osmose, CD Matrix is DADC AUSTRIA IFPI L553 A0100247447-0101 12 A0, but booklet is only 4 pages: 1. cover art 2. lyrics of Stillbirth Machine 3. photos + adv. or Helmkamp book 4. band photo. Is it regular edition or i just got a "promo" instead?

Author:	Stone69 [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 4:21 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
androdion wrote: In other news, it seems like this house is mine and dreadmeat's! as we're virtually the only ones replying all the time... Is it possible that one of this SETHERIAL - Nord \| 1996 Napalm Records is a bootleg? I have both copies and wanted to dispose one of them. Just making sure because I don't want to keep the wrong or probably a bootleg copy in my collection. White Logo Print - CD Matrix: 03071108 NPR 017 eruditus +49 (0) 245191250 [Without SID codes] Silver Logo Print - CD Matrix: DADC Austria A0100184477-0101 13 A0 IFPI L553 The album was released in 1996 and judging by the absence of SID code on the White Print Version, is it possible that this one may be a boot? There was an old thread regarding this one here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=71177 , but no sure comments/replies were posted. Any help/comments from the masters - androdion/dreadmeat? Horns Up!

Author:	Daemonlord [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:20 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Stone69 wrote: androdion wrote: In other news, it seems like this house is mine and dreadmeat's! as we're virtually the only ones replying all the time... Is it possible that one of this SETHERIAL - Nord \| 1996 Napalm Records is a bootleg? I have both copies and wanted to dispose one of them. Just making sure because I don't want to keep the wrong or probably a bootleg copy in my collection. White Logo Print - CD Matrix: 03071108 NPR 017 eruditus +49 (0) 245191250 [Without SID codes] Silver Logo Print - CD Matrix: DADC Austria A0100184477-0101 13 A0 IFPI L553 The album was released in 1996 and judging by the absence of SID code on the White Print Version, is it possible that this one may be a boot? There was an old thread regarding this one here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=71177 , but no sure comments/replies were posted. Any help/comments from the masters - androdion/dreadmeat? Horns Up! Without checking for 100%, it looks like the one on the right is the earlier pressing (with the old Napalm logo on the back), and the one with SPV on the left looks like a later pressing (probably after Napalm got a distribution deal). The one on the right matches my version, anyhow. I'd imagine both are legit to be fair, but I'd need to see the Matrices.

Author:	Daemonlord [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:24 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Right I have a query of my own here, as this has left me a little flummoxed... I picked up a cheap copy of Nokturnel's 'Nothing But Hatred' on JL America, and just wanted to query the below with anyone else who owns it. http://www.metal-archives.com/albums/No ... tred/12516 Basically, it 'looks' legit - slightly aged booklet/yellowing - disc has marking from use - it even has a little card 'mail order' thing tucked in between the pages of the booklet that advertises their infamous compilation album from way back when - totally not the usual thing that would be bootlegged in my eyes. However, it has no matrix code whatsoever. All other JL America bits I've seen have some sort of matrix code, so thought it was pretty odd. Any thoughts?

Author:	~Guest 82538 [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:17 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
AcidMind wrote: New question: just got Order From Chaos / Stillbirth Machine / Crushed Infamy CD by Osmose, CD Matrix is DADC AUSTRIA IFPI L553 A0100247447-0101 12 A0, but booklet is only 4 pages: 1. cover art 2. lyrics of Stillbirth Machine 3. photos + adv. or Helmkamp book 4. band photo. Is it regular edition or i just got a "promo" instead? Should be the real deal, although I can't find a matrix for that online. Discogs does state that the promo version comes in a (as usual) cardboard sleeve. Only someone with a similar copy can confirm that though. @ Stone69 - What Daemonlord said. And the fact that I'm constantly responding in this thread doesn't necessarily mean that I know every trick in the book.

Author:	irionman [ Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:23 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
This isn't a cd, but a tape. (Didn't wanna spam the forum) Anyways, I received a Gehenna tape and I cannot find any information on it anywhere. See the image below. (edit: holy hell, sorry for that huge image. it's not a great photo hence the size needed)

Author:	ancientorder [ Sun Oct 20, 2013 2:08 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
It would help a lot if you would mention WHICH Gehenna this is supposed to be. If it's the Norwegian one, I didn't find any information about tape like that...

Author:	dreadmeat [ Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:38 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
imageshack.com has image size options for posting to forums, just copy and paste the code into your message and voila. Also I have an epic update regarding my Majesty And Decay CD from months ago... just you wait!

Author:	DeathfareDevil [ Sun Oct 20, 2013 6:59 am ]
Post subject:	Re: CD Identification, Matrix & Bootleg Help Thread
Daemonlord wrote: Nokturnel's 'Nothing But Hatred' on JL America it has no matrix code whatsoever. All other JL America bits I've seen have some sort of matrix code, so thought it was pretty odd. Any thoughts? My copy has three tiny codes written around the hub: the barcode 7-3815-41015-2 (which is also written much larger on the face of the disc under the JL America logo), something that looks like PILS, and a third number which may be W.O. 62821-3M. My eyes aren't so great at quarter til seven on a Sunday morning, I should add, and these codes, for whatever reason, seem harder to pick out than others I've seen. Strangely, I don't think mine had the mail order card. I remember buying it sealed from a dollar bin with other JL America releases in ... the early 2000's, I think. (Beherit's DDTM and Pyogenesis' Ignis Creatio were the other two I snagged. There were multiple copies of them, it was like a JL America dump. I miss those days of magical music store finds.) Obviously I can't comment on the legitimacy of my copies, as I have no idea where they came from before showing up in a Media Play bargain bin. Here's to hoping.