I was wondering how all those losers fed themselves. With unemployment checks. Seems so fitting.

THOUGH TO BE FAIR: The irony of a lot of good metal is that it costs a lot of money to have the proper equipment to make decent recordings. Good guitars, amps and other gear cost a shit ton. Only the richest white kids I grew up with had that shit. My bass rig was always dogshit.

Look at that 2000s metalcore boom in Massachusetts. Yeah. Hard ass white kids from New England.

No, that’s not true. Christianity was partially imposed in Europe, an important part became Christians but it was imposed too and violently in some parts..

As much as I love Scandinavian Black Metal, one thing I've always found hilarious is the irony (hypocrisy?) of its founders/artists. Norway and Sweden are two of the richest countries in the world. Even the poorest people from there have infinitely better lives than 99% people on the planet. Musicians get money from the government just for playing in bands. Unemployment checks and healthcare are handed out like candy. And yet the music is all about struggle, hardship, the general shittiness of life and how awful humanity is. How can their views and attitudes be taken seriously when they're living essentially the most comfortable in human existence?

Obviously a lot of this has to do with image, and personal struggles shouldn't be ignored, but the whole thing is a bit ridiculous when you think about it.

As Kveldulv and a few others have rightly pointed out, it is a mistake to overly associate black metal with Scandinavia, despite the obvious importance of, for example, the early Norwegian scene.

And there's no inherent irony. Black metal does not write songs about the woeful lack of material goods. It repudiates that very lifestyle in a romanticised, nostalgic way. It's not about not having a comfortable bed to sleep in or anything like that...not sure why anyone would think that.

As for attacking other abrahamic religions, sure, in the countries where they apply. Most western nations have been heavily influenced and had their cores shaped by christianity. While people in the uSA, Canada, or most parts of Europe might individually have negative things to say about Islam, it's not as though Islam has had any influence on the societies of these countries. Christianity is a more logical target.

That said, there are certainly bands that write anti-judaic and anti-Islamic songs.

ah see, i studied history at uni and generally how it went was this:
- leaders accept christianity for one reason or another (rarely just conquest!!!), promise the church they'll convert the general populace
- general populace is apprehensive, leaders allow them to adopt a mish-mash religion of sorts, mixing the older religion with christianity (ironically, fantoft stave church was a good example of pagan architecture within the church)
- within a few generations, given the presence of learned priests and general illiteracy amongst the general populace, everyone simply becomes christian and the older elements fade out.

that's a massively simplified rundown of proceedings, but the extant image in popular metal culture of those mean christians killing everyone who wouldn't convert on the spot is a fucking load of shit. and very importantly for us followers of almighty wotan, the germanic heathens were treated comparatively brilliantly - you could look to the jews if you want to see some real persecution, but how much jewish bm is there?

perhaps one downside to our glorious western model of civilisation is the push for tolerance at any cost - anti-islamic sentiment in the west, despite anti-christian (and notably, anti-atheist) sentiment in muslim countries being the norm, is one of the many forms of intolerance we're trying to breed out of ourselves. very few individuals can get away with criticising what's ostensibly an outdated, somewhat violent religion with no real place in the 21st century, at least not without attracting unwanted drama - one day you launch a valid criticism, the next you've become the darling of the far right, neo-nazis and assorted other lowlives. some get away with it - richard dawkins comes to mind - but for the most part, i know personally when i see political parties with anti-muslim messages i assume it's a front for something worse. or at the very least, i hate that i'd be joining my vote with a bunch of "fuck off, we're full" types.

Americans' British ancestors were also forcibly converted in much the same way around AD 700. And 1000 years later they came to America and did it to the Native Americans, and tried to forcibly convert each other from one church to another (i.e. the US fighting a war with Mormons in 1857

Theirs is a spiritual struggle, they have no reason to fight anymore and must declare grand proclamations that exhort nihilism and misanthropy because honestly they have won the game and are bored.

(...) Now, black metal wasn't born in Norway or Sweden. Black metal existed before in the Uk, Brazil, Greece, Chile, Switzerland and other regions with very different life standards (...)

lol it's true though.

Chile!? Of all places? Is Chile the "Lost Cradle of Black Metal"? Is there any way you can back that up? Is that a fact? Or your just saying it because that's your homescene?

if you take the argument it actually makes more sense than you would think. giving a person everything they need/want is a great way to make them miserable, angry, and genuinely unsatisfied with their surroundings.

How many norwegian or Swedish black metal bands were around 1986 (and actually playing some sort of black metal) besides Mayhem? Here there were 2 at least: Bloody Cross and Death Yell. If we talk about the development of extreme metal, there was Pentagram as well.

See that black metal in South America was born from the very source: Venom, MF, Slayer and such. In Brazil black metal existed as a scene before than norway, with bands like Vulcano, Mystifier and Sarcófago (which were a huge influence for the rest to come). Necroabyssious (Varathron) has stated that the band started at the end of the 80's influenced not by norwegians but by the brazilian scene, Slayer, Morbid Angel, Venom and HH/CF.

I see what you mean, but it also gives them the spare time to actually make the music. Tons of people are miserable, angry, and genuinely unsatisfied with their surroundings. Unlike musicians, they have to deal with it in ways that don't involve writing music. Everything about making music takes a lot of spare time, and the people with the most spare time just so happens to be those who struggle the least.

What about musicians who come from a poor background and make music about life on the streets? Surely this offers a more authentic, genuine view of the torment of life than black metal from the socialist paradises of northern Europe.

I wasn't asking about Brazilian bands since I already knew them, and wasn't defending Scandinavia either. My question was because I've never had heard Chile being relevant or even mentioned when talking about pre-second wave BM. Thanks for your answer. I had never heard about those three Chilean bands.

From the three, Pentagram is the best known. They have been mentioned as influence by At the Gates, Napalm Death, Dismember, Avulsed and even Darkthrone. Death Yell released a split with Beherit in 91. Both bands split up in early 90's and resurrected just recently, maybe that's why you haven't heard about them before but back in the day they were well known in the underground.

So what you are saying is that we who are fed, clothed, warm and safe should shut up, sit back, watch our reality shows and occasionally praise the lord jesus, while those who are starving and dying from disease should spend their time writing books and making movies?
Hmmm... I do wonder why the world isn't working like that?

This post made me grin.

Also, it must surely be coincidence, but every CHilean metal band I've heard has been great...everythign from Atomic Aggressor to Pentagram to Bewitched and, of course, Death Yell. The scene may not be large but it surely was/is great.

(Sabbath) were dirt poor and basically illiterate (other than Geezer) at the start of their career.